melting lead part 2

In the previous thread, you seemed to agree that there is a minimal amount of lead vapor dispersed during the melting process.
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Where?? I have NEVER stated that. I am finished debating with you. To the OP, I do apologize for getting sidetracked. Like I said before, do whatever makes you comfortable.

Look, if you want to have an elitist attitude, that is fine by me. I run into it everyday. But at least sound like you know what you are talking about.
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I really am not sure why you are having problems understanding what I am typing. I don't have an elitist attitude, but when people tell me that I say things that I haven't and try to make me look silly, I will get defensive. You need to read what I am posting...It is so clear and concise. I am not quite sure what elese I can do.

Do yourself a favor and go back and RE-READ my posts...
 
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Guy, I have tried to make it as clear as possible in the last few posts that I have made. What is it that you don't get?

I never put words in your mouth. I am just interpreting what you have said.

Locked thread states that you melt in your basement with no fan. Are you saying that you are subjecting yourself to more than minimal amounts of lead vapor?

By stating in post number 6 of this thread:
Quote:
Well, I think that when lead is melted in a melting pot like your doing, there is minimal lead vapor during the melting process.
False
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are you stating here that there is NO lead vapor? MORE than minimal lead vapor? What do you mean by your "False" statement?

No one is attacking you or trying to make you look silly. When I kindly ask for validation, you throw up some chart that doesn't even validate your statement.:rolleyes:

If you believe that there are unsafe amounts of lead vapor dispersed from melting in the way that 1chig is melting, please show us REAL validation in your statements. Otherwise, like I previously stated, you are adding nothing to the conversation but confusion.
 
Well, I suspect the OP has his answer. Bullet casting doesn't make lead hot enough to create toxic levels of lead vapor. Like one of the other posters, I did a bunch of indoor casting at one point (basement) without proper ventilation (I was young) and had a lead level check at the time, and had no issues. The main lead threat faced by shooters is not from metalic lead, but from inhaling smoke from lead styphnate primers, and even that doesn't seem to be a huge threat unless you work at an unventilated indoor range.
 
illinoiscoyotehunter.You said in the first thread that lead fumes pretty much takes a higher temperature to become airborn than what we melt it at.That is pretty much what muddinman 04 said in thread 2, not in exact words but i took it to mean the same. But in your next post in thread 2 you seem to disagree with muddinman.I think that is what is causing the confusion, at least for me. I did not want to cause an argument and i do thank everyone for there help.
 
Muddinman....

you state this:
are you stating here that there is NO lead vapor? MORE than minimal lead vapor? What do you mean by your "False" statement?
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I have stated, in the thread that was deleted:
Lead becomes airborn (vapors) at a much higher temp than we cast at.
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... AND in this thread I posted your validation...so you knew what my "False" statement meant.... and you went on to say...
Thank you all high and mighty...

There is no reason to be a jerk.
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I gave you what you asked for, you obviously understood what I had posted, so why do you intend to try to stir the pot? It is clear as day what I have written. Maybe someone else can help me out here. I posted a table that show the temps at which lead vaporizes. Did you have trouble reading that table because they use Celcius? Help me out here, because I want to help you. I want you to completely understand what I have already stated several times in several different ways...
 
This post is to the OP:

I personally am sorry if you were ever confused. To answer your question: Lead does NOT vaporize at temperatures we use for casting/smelting. Are there minimal amounts of lead vapors when melting lead for casting?? NO, there are not. So, you are safe casting indoors if you want to. A fan is not a bad idea to blow the smoke from the FLUX outside if you don't want to stink up your house. Does this smoke contain lead vapors? NO, it does not. There are NO lead vapors when casting. The only time you WILL get vapors is if your pot gets EXTREMELY hot, which all commercial casting pots don't come near to that, even when run WIDE OPEN. Lead vapors occur only at extreme temperatures...NOT at the temperatures we cast at. I hope this helps and welcome to the world of casting!
 
thank you illinoiscoyotiehunter, I think you just cleared it up for me. They say minimal vapor then you said dalse meaning there were NO vapores heating in the pot we use. I understand now . thank you:confused::)
 
OK, I feel better now. Dang snow from this global warming still covering the ground, so I'm going back to the garage (sans fan, but listening to Rush and Hannity) and trying to thin down this ingot pile. Wife wants it moved, and this'll be the third time. I'm tired of moving it.

On a good note though, what I don't get cast into boolits, the rest will be in it's final resting place until cast up at some point in the future. She allowed me to take over our 8X16 portable wood building for my realoading room, away from the house. Just need to run power to it now. I have so much brass and other reloading stuff out there now, there is barely room for the lawnmower and other yard stuff. Stuff, Stuff,Stuff, Stuff When will we stop collecting stuff

I think the issue, although resolved was mainly over the simple word "MINIMAL". Mr. Mud man used it, ICH throwed the graph thingy up to veryify that there is "NO" fumes, not MINIMAL,(I missed the real intent too) and that's when the fight started. Ya see, we can't often even understand each other and we know what we are talking about most of the time. Obama counts on this misunderstanding his plans, as it appears half (becoming less all the time) still believe he can spend this country into prosperity. I guess I could do my part in helping out by buying all factory (ripoff) ammo, but have always been a miser, so he'll get no help from me.
 
Sorry to resurrect an older thread, but I thought I might be able to add a tiny bit to the discussion.

I read the chart that says Pb vaporizes at 1750C and I don't dispute the information it contains. However, the vaporization temperature refers to the boiling point of any individual atom, not just the mass as a whole. Just because your whole pot of lead isn't boiling doesn't mean that individual atoms aren't receiving enough energy to escape the pot.

Want an example? Leave a glass of water on the countertop for a few days. It goes away, doesn't it? How is that possible, since the water was never heated to its boiling point? It happens because even though the AVERAGE thermal energy of the substance is below the vaporization point, individual molecules absorb enough energy to leave the glass.

Why can't a pot of hot liquid lead evaporate below its boiling point just the same as a cup of cool water? The answer is that it can. The only thing slowing the process is the heavier atomic weight of the Pb.

I have no idea how much lead this puts into the atmosphere, but my guess is that it isn't much. Still, since Pb is a cumulative toxin that's not something I would expose myself to if a simple fan in the window could lessen my risk.

Please don't think I'm being superior--when I first started casting it was with an electric hotplate in my Dad's unventilated basement. I spent hours there happily casting with no ventilation at all. That was 25 years ago and there have been no ill effects I'm aware of. But now that I know the stuff I mentioned above, I wouldn't do it again.
 
I missed the other thread but I understand what he and the article said.

He really doesn't contradict himself if you pay attenion.

...minimal lead fumes...false... meant false as in zero, not minimal, not any.

Maybe professors shouldn't teach kindergarden, that's the trouble here:D
 
Water molecules are actually lighter than air molecules. Molecular weight 18 as compared to 28 for nitrogen and 32 for oxygen.

Water evaporates into the atmospere, forms into ice falls melts and rains
 
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I'm new to this fascinating aspect of the shooting sports so safety gets my undivided attention. Having a little fun to make a point is good, hope we all learned something. Fear of airborne lead kept me from casting for many years and molten lead still scares me.
 
Water molecules are actually lighter than air molecules. Molecular weight 18 as compared to 28 for nitrogen and 32 for oxygen.

Water evaporates into the atmospere, forms into ice falls melts and rains
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Doesn't the kinetic energy of the molecule enter into the equation? I understand the density difference, but won't enough KE overcome that?
 
I actually am not a chemical engineer*. I googled it.I have know Idea what I am talking about. If I put a glass of water on my counter top next to a lead bullet for 24 hours. When I return I will find there will be less water and the same amount of lead.

* [I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express once]:)
 
I actually am not a chemical engineer*. I googled it.I have know Idea what I am talking about. If I put a glass of water on my counter top next to a lead bullet for 24 hours. When I return I will find there will be less water and the same amount of lead.

* [I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express once]
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Now that's just funny, I don't care who ya are! :D
 
I actually am not a chemical engineer*. I googled it.I have know Idea what I am talking about. If I put a glass of water on my counter top next to a lead bullet for 24 hours. When I return I will find there will be less water and the same amount of lead.
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Next time, try it with solid water and liquid lead. :)
 
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