Mauser 24/47 questions?

Hi, Cousin,

No 8x57 Mauser has a .318" bore size; all 8x57 rifles have a .311" bore size.

As to the old .318" groove diameter (8x57J), no European military rifles made after c. 1905 have the old size, they are all .323", same as the new bullet diameter (8x57JS).

Why do you think your 24/48 (??) has the old groove diameter?

Jim
 
NO 24/47 is a "48". The 48s were a new manufacture in Yugoslavia. And they are the same caliber as the 7.92X57 cartridge and the German K98k Mauser. As are the 24/47's.
 
Cousin

Did you Slug the bore to determine that it was 318 ? or did someone else say it was ? The 24 47 Yugo Mauser as well as the M 48 Yugo Mauser are supposed to have a .323 bore just like a German K 98 Mauser.
 
I should also like to point out that there were absolutely NO "teak wood" stocks ever produced for these rifles....certainly NOT by the Yugoslavs. That is a total MYTH, largely promulgated by a certain seller of these rifles.....with the initials "MM". I have no idea why they chose to do this, but I assure you, it is/was BOGUS.

The predominate wood used for stocks by the Yugoslavs, before WW2, was Walnut. However, walnut in was in short supply after the war (the war absorbed a huge amount of the available wood)....so other woods were adopted more and more. During the 24/47 re-work program, serviceable M1924 stocks were reused. While walnut was still available, the first runs of M48 rifles were stocked with that. After this, Carpathian ELM became the predominate wood used, with Beech used as well (but much less common than Elm).

The stocks mistaken for "Teak" are almost always actually ELM.

The others (who've already said this) are right. NO M1924, 24/47 or M48 series rifles were ever produced with barrels having other than the .311 / .323 bore (7.92 x 57 IS) .......NO .318 barrels were made/ used by the Yugoslavs. IF the rifle in question does actually have a .318 bore, then the barrel is NOT original to the rifle, period. In all probability, the barrel is actually a .323 one.

As for reloading data for a .318 barrel, the same DATA can be used as for the 7.92 x 57 IS cartridge.....but NOT the same BULLETS. .318 bullets can be obtained, but they are very much less common (than .323). In any case, if the rifle has a .318 barrel on it, great care should be taken with loads, because the age and condition of the barrel might be suspect. Some .318 barrels (though they are rare in the US) have been inadvertently abused by firing .323 bullets through them. So, I'd HIGHLY recommend having the barrel inspected by a good gunsmith BEFORE shooting the rifle. So, of course ONLY .318 bullets should be used......and IS data, but starting at the BOTTOM end of the loading range (or even lighter) for whatever bullet weight chosen.

That assumes that he actually has a .318 barrel.....which is probably not the case.
 
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Just to clarify a bit. The terms "bore", "bore diameter", and "bore size" refer to the diameter of the hole "bored" in the barrel. When rifling groves are cut, the diameter from the bottom of one groove to the bottom of the opposide groove* is called "groove size" or "groove diameter". That will also be the diameter of the bullet. In other words, the bullet is always forced through a barrel with a "bore diameter" smaller than it is, so the grooves are engraved on it.

Using inch measurements for convenience, the original 1888 8x57 rifle had a bore diameter of .311" and a groove diameter of .318". That meant a groove depth of only .0035". That turned out to be too shallow to stabilize the bullet once the barrel began to wear. The groove diameter was increased over time but that only resulted in grooves that were not fully filled by the bullet. Finally, about 1905, the German army decided to fix the problem once and for all, by going to a .323" bullet and increasing the groove diameter of the barrel to that measurement. They rebarrelled all the new Model 98 Mausers for the new dimensions, and thereafter issued only the new ammunition. Oddly enough, they called the old bullet the 8mm, and the new, larger bullet the 7.9. (As one might say, only in an army!)

The civilian name for the older cartridge was the 8x57 J (standing for "Infanterie" - the German I and J are similar and there was some confusion), and for the new cartridge the 8x57 JS, the S for the German word for large.

But the Germans had tons of Model 1888 rifles. They wanted to use them for reserves, but could not afford to rebarrel them. So what they did was just to run a new reamer into the chamber. That opened up the chamber neck, allowing the new round proper case neck expansion and there was no problem in firing the larger bullet through the smaller groove diameter barrel (remember, the BORE diameter did not change - it was still .311".

But the Model 1888 used a five round, en-bloc type clip that entered the action and fell out the bottom when empty. The Germans modified many of those to use the new 98 Mauser clip ("stripper clip" or "charger"). So, with the chamber modified and the receiver altered to use the new clip, the old rifles were considered perfectly OK and hundreds of thousands were issued to reserves in WWI and supplied to Germany's allies, mainly Turkey.

Ammunition confusion was apparently not a problem, even though Germany still had thousands of unaltered Model 1888 rifles. The new ammunition was issued in the new clips, which unaltered Model 1888's would not accept; old ammuntion was issued in the old clips, which the altered Model 1888's and Model 1898's would not accept. Loose rounds could still have been a minor problem, but in the German army's view, it was not a significant one.

Jim
 
the S for the German word for large.
The S in 7.92X57JS/8X57JS is for the German word for pointed, as in spitzer (those new-fangled bullets). The previous bullet was a round nose.
 
Correct, Scorch, and my bad. I was thinking of the military sS bullet where the small "s" stands for schweres, or heavy, while the large "S" is for Spitzgeschoss, or pointed bullet.

Jim
 
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