Magpul Art of the Dynamic Shotgun.

You me both. This summer i bought my firs Upper for my AR planning on taking art of the tactical carbine in a couple of years.
 
I can see that as well. I can't honestly say i would think it would be a blast firing 4-500 rounds of 12 ga, buckshot and slugs. Especially it being tactical shotguns are either inertia driven or pump. Don't get me wrong a 12Ga doesn't bother me recoil wise but after 200 rds at the skeet range it wears on me. Which in this case would be worse training.
 
For sure! When I was younger, we used to take my Dad's duty 870 out and enjoy blasting slugs and 00 mags. But a class full of that stuff gets old really quick. Especially when I'm not likely ever going to deploy a shotgun for defense.

It's definitely good to have a shotgun course under your belt. But I wouldn't take another one any time soon.
 
Alot of people like to classify the 12Ga as a premier defense weapons, for home in most instances. But i agree i'm not likely to grab a shotgun either for defense. Which is why i'm building my AR, i just enjoy the stability of having 30 rounds in one mag and then 4 more right behind that, instead of having to take time to reload my shotgun. And range isn't a worry with the AR.
 
i just enjoy the stability of having 30 rounds in one mag and then 4 more right behind that, instead of having to take time to reload my shotgun.
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I can't think of many HD/SD situations that would require you to reload a shotgun if used properly.
 
I live in a rural area where bears, mountainlions or methheads could pop up at anytime. An 870 loaded with 7 slugs and a side saddle with 6 more is my bedside companion.
 
But i agree i'm not likely to grab a shotgun either for defense. Which is why i'm building my AR, i just enjoy the stability of having 30 rounds in one mag and then 4 more right behind that, instead of having to take time to reload my shotgun. And range isn't a worry with the AR.
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At what range do you think you will be engaging someone for "defense"? Planning for that random drive-by 150 round sniper duel? ;)
 
At what range do you think you will be engaging someone for "defense"?
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I know this question was for Blackops, but defense shootings are likely to be at contact distance to not much more than 15 yards. Thus, you're best bet is the best CQB weapon... the carbine. Specifically, the M4 carbine.

The long range capability of the carbine is always being debated, but for close up stuff. It's the champ... hands down.
 
The long range capability of the carbine is always being debated, but for close up stuff. It's the champ
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Maybe for you that is the case, but not for me. My choices would be 1) shotgun/00 buck, 2) .45 ACP. I'd rather make big holes in the BG than small ones. Each of the 8 or 9 pellets from the SG is going to make twice as big a hole as the .223.
 
Maybe for you that is the case, but not for me. My choices would be 1) shotgun/00 buck, 2) .45 ACP. I'd rather make big holes in the BG than small ones. Each of the 8 or 9 pellets from the SG is going to make twice as big a hole as the .223.
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Could be that more people like the security of more rounds or availability of being able to load fast/quicker (30 round mag)in a carbine than a SG even with mag capacity ones
 
Maybe for you that is the case, but not for me. My choices would be 1) shotgun/00 buck, 2) .45 ACP. I'd rather make big holes in the BG than small ones. Each of the 8 or 9 pellets from the SG is going to make twice as big a hole as the .223.
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I prefer having a precision shot capability. Although I've had impressive pattern results with Flight Control 00 ammo in my shotgun, Single precision shot capability is still preferred for me.

Overall though, the carbine does just about everything better than the shotgun. Recoil, flash, ammo capacity, penetration, ease of reload if necessary, penetration, and ease of accessories are all better on the carbine than the Shotgun.

The one area where the Shotgun is probably better is punching through auto glass. But that remote possibility doesn't outweigh every other area where the carbine completely outperforms the shotgun.
 
I wonder if they cover using birdshot for personal protection.
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I saw an episode of Personal Defense TV where they were actually advocating the use of BIRD SHOT at Gunsite. Tom Gresham, of course, was eating it up.

I couldn't believe it. At least I know to never take a course at Gunsite now.
 
advocating the use of BIRD SHOT
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Number 2 copper plated for geese isnt no laffing matter if shot at SD ranges. Cut one open and see what I mean there. The 2x6 turkey combo shells are another I wouldnt wish to be shot by. Not all bird shot is 7 1/2 there are a few large winged ones out there that 6 wont knock down.
 
I also have come to realize that I will probably opt for my AR for HD in my new home. Right now, it's my .45 ACP 1911 due to my present home's small confines. But I really need to get a decent shotgun and master it, simply because it's the one weapon I purely suck at. I'm bound and determined to become a viable shotgunner someday, and this video really stuck it to me.
 
I think that ruling out Gunsite based on that one factor is a disservice to yourself. Please also consider that Gunsite is in the lineage of whole lot of respected shooting schools and instructors out there.
 
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