Looking for that perfect 1700 yard gun.

1700 yards (20x) on a man size target. Internet is the only 1700 yard shot I will take. :)

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1400 yds FAR past the ethical limits of hunting. I have shot deer at close to 800 yds with the 7 Rum on many occasions. When I hunt that stand, I literally drag my 1k competition rests into the tower box and set them up. It is really not that hard of a shot unless the wind is brutal; then the problem is the stand moving not the lack of ability to compensate for wind drift.
 
emcon5 said:
I do know them, I looked them up before responding. And yeah, I had to look them up. I haven't hunted since I moved here, drawings for the local area are close enough to impossible not to bother, and I am not willing to drive 300 miles each way to get to where I would end up having to hunt.

You may want to actually read the referenced regs from the page you linked, because that page is wrong.
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Well I also found it in your big game regulations from 2015 that a .22 caliber centerfire rifle or larger is what's legal in your state. So no a .17 caliber generating 1000 ft-lbs wouldn't be legal on big game. I only looked for where it stated 1000 ft-lbs because you seemed certain of it. You can click the link and go to page 8 of the booklet center column about half way down the page.

Legal Weapons
Centerfire Firearm
(refer to R107-14 and NRS 503.150)
Rifles: Must use a center-fire cartridge of .22 caliber or larger.
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Well since the OP stated that he was looking for the rifle capable of making a 1700 yard shot. That means he hasn't attempted it yet, so calling people names will only want to make them do the shot that much more. Having a discussion without the preaching, bashing, and name calling will get your point across more effectively is all I'm saying. Once the OP realises the probability and the time and effort developing the skills to take the shot, my guess is he won't attempt it.


andy29847 said:
Somebody mentioned 2700 yards earlier the "longest sniper shot". Seems like I read that 6 ranging shots were required before that sniper got his man.
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That was me and yes the Sniper took multiple shots to make the kills. It took 9 shots for the sniper team to effectively range the target, then with two consecutive kill shots they took out the machine gun nest. However, my point was that the .338 Lapua and several other cartridges are capable of these long range shots on big game but without the teamwork of a spotter you're severely handicapping your chances of a clean kill.

Road_Clam, you're right if the OP comes back and actually does the work to learn to shoot that far he'll start to realize the immense difficulty of the shot.

Jimro, the .338 Lapua shooting a 300 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2650 fps can stay supersonic past 1700 yards depending on elevation.

RC20, why close a thread as long as the discussion is civil and somewhat still on topic? Who cares if the OP hasn't been back.
 
OK... I'll wreck it then ;)

the way I read the MN rules, I can legally deer hunt with a 25 ACP...

it used to read bla bla bla, with exclussions against the 30 carbine, & for the 10mm auto, but in simplifying it, I can now legally hunt "big game" with a 25 ACP :eek:

long range shots... my longest was about 250 yards & for that one I went prone on the floor of the stand... I'm just not that confident in myself under hunting circumstances ( andrenaline, shivering from the cold & such )
 
Somebody mentioned 2700 yards earlier the "longest sniper shot". Seems like I read that 6 ranging shots were required before that sniper got his man.
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Corporal Craig Harrison's record breaking shot in Afghanistan was at an extreme angle at high altitude recorded 2,475 meters (2706 yards). In order to not have the target below the reticle of his S&B scope a significant angle would be needed as the issued scope runs out of adjustment long before that, and there aren't enough hold overs on the reticle to get out that far on flat level ground.

Jimro, the .338 Lapua shooting a 300 grain bullet with a muzzle velocity of 2650 fps can stay supersonic past 1700 yards depending on elevation.
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True, but I don't know of any military force using that load. Most are 250gr loads with a Lapua projectile. Not that there aren't powders that can't push that safely (there are, and H1000 is spec'd for the Mk248 Mod1 load) it just seems that every time NSWC Crane does the comparison between 338 Lapua and 300 Win Mag there isn't enough accuracy available in the 338 to meet requirements (despite the Army and SOCOM wanting it to fill the gap between 30 cal and 50 cal). Last I knew SOCOM was handling 338 Lapua ammo acquisition through commercial channels but it has literally be YEARS since I talked to a SOTIC instructor.

But, you are correct at STP for sea level you come up shy by 100 yards, 1570 yards to subsonic. At 1000 ft elevation it is 1630 yards. At 2000 ft elevation it is 1690 yards. It is 2,200 feet elevation for that load to stay supersonic to 1700 yards, at least with normalized atmospherics with zero percent humidity. Humidity is mostly a non-factor compared to altitude density (or "real" elevation) at that point, even going to 50% humidity is meaningless unless it changes pressure.

This is one of the reasons why so many long range shots are made out in Wyoming, but not so much on the coast of Oregon.

Jimro
 
so calling people names will only want to make them do the shot that much more.
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Not much that can be done about the Dunning-Kruger Effect.

Having a discussion without the preaching, bashing, and name calling will get your point across more effectively is all I'm saying.
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Right, because we can't risk hurting the feelings of any delicate snowflakes who want to do stupid things. :rolleyes:

Any other stupid things we should dance around? What about peeing on electric fences, or lighting up a smoke in a fireworks factory?
 
I am a hunter with 30 years afield under his belt. I sometimes post about distances that get others upset. As one who says a 500 yard shot CAN be ethical, let me offer the following reply to the OP:

NO. JUST NO.
 
The OP is neither stupid or a moron, rather he is ignorant about shooting at long rang which is why he came to this forum in the first place. Some of us chose to berate him instead of seizing the opportunity to educate him on the difficulties of long range shooting and the ethics involved in doing it while hunting. It is certain he won't be back. Would you want a teacher who called you stupid and a moron? Positive reinforcement would have gone so much further. Or should I call you stupid if you haven't mastered non-Euclidian geometry? We are all ignorant about a great deal more than we are knowledgeable about.
 
FFS, go back and read what I wrote. Go back and find where I said the OP was a moron.

Here is the Readers digest condensed version:

OP asks a question.

~20 people, including me, post and say that it is a bad idea, unethical, and explain why.

Taylor said, paraphrased, that we shouldn't bother to talk about ethics, because some people will try it anyway.

THOSE are the people I called morons, and I stick by that assessment.

Hopefully the OP bothered to read the 44 replies before that point. Hopefully he pays attention to the folks who actually shoot long range. People who understand the physics involved. People who understand that a ballistics calculator is a prediction at best, and often has little bearing on reality. People who understand that at the range being discussed the wind is nearly impossible to read with the precision required to make a first round hit on the vitals of an animal that deserves the respect of a quick clean death.

Hopefully he read, and got a clue, and will not fall in that category.

The habitually-offended brigade then decided that my use of the word moron to describe moronic behavior is somehow the point, rather than the bad idea that started this conversation.

There is only one statement I made on this subject that looking back I should not have. Taylor mentioned a video of 12 year old shooting an elk at 1376 yards, and I said he was a moron. That was wrong. A 12 year old is a kid, and doesn't know any better. The parent who taught him that shooting at a game animal at 1300 yards is the moron.

And I am done with this.
 
emcon5 said:
taylorce1 said:
We can talk ethics all we want about not taking a 1700 yard shot on elk, but the truth of the matter is people are going to try it regardless of what we say.
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Well, some people are morons.

taylorce1 said:
I personally would never attempt a shot on elk at 1700 yards, but there are videos on youtube of elk of a 12 year old shooting at 1376 yards. It's only a matter of time until someone stretches out the remaining 324 yards.
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Also morons. How many shots did he take that were not filmed?
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No you didn't outright call the OP a moron, but were you not implying from your statements that the OP was one. That is the way I took your statements, that even considering hunting long was moronic. Believe me you'd have a hard time finding a guy with thicker skin, and I agree that people need to get thicker skins and take harsher criticism without getting hurt feelings. However, calling or implying people are morons can bring a teachable moment to an abrupt halt.

That's why when topics like this one come up from time to time we need to leave our emotions and opinions at the door and stick to the facts. The fact is there are times when a 1700 yard shot is possible. Should it be taken? I'm strongly in the camp of "NO", but I'm willing to give my reasons why and not resort to name calling or berating the person asking the question. After all aren't we taught there is no such thing as a stupid question?
 
I have read this whole ridiculous thread and find it more amusing than informative in any way. The OP is a loose cannon in his own right, thinking outside the box is one thing, falling out of it is another. He's asking for advice on shooting something like an elk at 1700 yards?....really. I would go to a military forum and ask what model mortar would be best for that endeavor.

He also has a thread about putting optics on a 338 lapua for shooting bears at 25 yards. Again, I would not entertain him on that but send him to a military forum to find out the effect and availability of hand grenades.

Seriously, can you even picture this guy out elk hunting with a 50 bmg over one shoulder and a 338 Lapau over the other? That's not counting the Hubbell telescope!

Do they even have elk in Canada? Well, 1700 yard Elk I guess I should say.
 
"Can I recommend something in the 30mm class...

Possibly from the nose of an A10..... "

I like that! One of my all time favorite planes and guns...Gatling.
 
Interesting thread. There is all kinds of hunting and skill sets. I am a bow hunter as well as a handgun and rifle hunter. I consider myself a very good shot with lots of blood experience. That said, I consider a 300 yard rifle shot pretty far. I have taken some impressively long handgun hunting shots. My goal as a hunter is to get as close to the game as possible. This is to challenge my discipline an skill. The by product of this is a higher chance of a ethical kill. As a hunter, I dont like to miss. Period. Call it ego, discipline, or old fashion pride.

 
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