Lone Rangers when TSHTF, Reality Check

I suppose we all ramble at one time or another. This must be my time.

When the **** hits the fan.........it won't.

Take a look at California, less than 5% compliance with the restrictions on assault weapons, such as they've been mislabelled.

No one's come to get those people who don't comply. They know that ot's not required.

The socialists folks, are very intelligent people, knowing if a confrontation arose, public opinion would defeat them; there's too much history to draw on for these people to risk.

So what happens?

We are seeing the socialists tie guns to taxes;let the IRS deal with it through the court system. Now it's not a gun issue, no cops are going to come for your guns, just you.....and not for a gun violation, but for tax code enforcement.

Think you're going to win against the IRS? You have no one to shoot at. No one will listen to you, you're a tax evader, the bane of society. You don't have the rescources to put up a quality defence, and no attorney in his right mind is going to fight these folks past putting up a facade of a fair trial.

What we seem to forget in all these bull**** rambo scenarios is that the socialist party is blessed with uncanny patience. they don't want your guns, they know that they will have those of your children, just by excercising alittle restraint.

Our side, in general terms, is the republican party. what do they do in principal? They try to be reasonable, honest, and compromising.

Look at the presidential race.
Gore is a liar, but who is calling that spade what it is? No one.
Clinton was impeached, and who compromised his way out of the removal from office? It wasn't WJC, but the republican party, who didn't want to be offensive.

So............who in the hell do you think you're going to shoot at?
 
Michael - Amen.

Either via the tax system, or the establishing of a license to own. Then jack up the fees a la Nassau County NY or Canada, OR just stop issuing them as in Brazil. Granted Brazil's attempt was thrown out, but, there's always next year.

The Socialists are past masters of constantly restricting freedom without violence. The Comminists and Fascists take the ham-handed approach.
 
And Waco didn't start out as a tax code violation?

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Sam I am, grn egs n packin

Nikita Khrushchev predicted confidently in a speech in Bucharest, Rumania on June 19, 1962 that: " The United States will eventually fly the Communist Red Flag...the American people will hoist it themselves."
 
You cannot tax a God-given right. You cannot tax a constitutional freedom. Sorry.

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The tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of Patriots and tyrants alike...TJ.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hnkg3:
You cannot tax a God-given right. You cannot tax a constitutional freedom. Sorry.

[/quote]

Yes, you can.

"We're the Government and we're here to help."

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Keepin' the FUD Legacy Alive! Check us out @ FUD's Fan Club! :D
 
re: You cannot tax a God-given right?

Why not? They tax everything, including the air we breathe. Add up the taxes which you pay, not just income, property, sales, etc, but all of the not so visible taxes, luxury taxes, excise taxes, gasoline taxes, liquor taxes, and 75% of your income goes out in taxes. I am old enough to remember when people were horrified at the 50% tax rate in socialist Sweden... we should have it so good!
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael:

What we seem to forget in all these bull**** rambo scenarios is that the socialist party is blessed with uncanny patience. they don't want your guns, they know that they will have those of your children, just by excercising alittle restraint.

[snip]

So............who in the hell do you think you're going to shoot at?[/quote]

So...we just give up? Hand them over and sigh with resignation as they slip the yoke around your neck?

Here's a hint: what if 95% of gun owners ignore any attempt at imposing a "gun tax" on them just like they're ignoring the registration law now? They don't have room in all those prisons for everyone.

I could say plenty more, but no doubt there are folks who would be horrified and incensed by it, so I won't. Except this: There's a reason why the JBTs like hold their raids in the wee hours--the elements of surprise. You don't have to wait for the JBTs to knock on your door before you act. JBTs have homes too.
 
Good points, all. Bottom line is that it's going to take some rather massive resistance over time to get their attention, let alone make a difference or force change.

Scratch yer balls, how much brass y'all feelin'? M2
 
Al,

I think I take the point. I do understand the emotion. I don't know your background and experiences, but if you would, I'll share some of mine (I'm old, there are a few).

I spent my senior trip in SEA. I Corps to be exact. I wasn't a model child. I didn't get drafted, the court volunteered me.

There were lessons learned during that little field trip, some of which were;

It is extremely difficult to live off the land in perfect health for any length of time whilest one is being hunted. Any imperfections in ones health diminish greatly the chances of long and prosperous lifestyle.
In groups of 2 and 5 it's damn near an impossibility.

You are always accompanied by those less brave than was first assumed.

One shot fired in anger will bring many angered shots in response.

Some of those will impact close to one's person. A lucky few will impact in one's person ( 4 in my case.....I'm just extremely lucky ).

The ability to generate income to support one's family denegrates with ill health. See above.

Now, what are you going to do here? Shoot the cops when they come to the door? If so, been nice knowing you, you're a corpse right then and there.

Are you going to the home of a police officer and render harm to him and his?

I don't know where you live but here in Texas they hunt you like a rabid dog because you've sought out a person or persons known to be armed and trained in the use of said arms, and further chosen to render harm unto them.

The reasoning is that if you consciously make the choice of attacking without provocation an armed and trained individual.........you are a thoroughly dangerous man..........you will die when they find you.

They always find you.

So, I ask the question again.............WHO in the hell are YOU going to shoot at?

Me, I'm going to run through the political process until I've exhausted every possible avenue....NRA, GOA, my congress people, state legislature........every avenue. Every one.
The alternative is so sickening and traumatic as to be revolting.

If they come to my door will I give them my guns?
Will I choose to defy 20 or so armed agents of some law enforcement agency and die in the presence of my family right then and there........................................
while I wait for my fellow citizens......most of whom are now not so nearly filled with bravado at the increased liklyhood of personal danger.......to come to my aid? Refer to Waco for the correct frame of reference.

I think I'll personally lead whoever knocks right to my personal weapons and ammunition stored within my domocile and they can have it all. I will furnish coffee and cookies too. We will have a grand time, and they will leave without reason to return.

I know where more of those weapons are than they do. They can have the 20 or so in my home anytime.................there are many more elsewhere.

Have you walked out your county of residence?
All of it?
Can you do it at night without a light?

Can you in the dead of night leave your home with 30 seconds notice on foot and flee for a distance of 1 mile without alerting the neighbors? Have you tried?

Where are the 6 places you can go that no one knows about? You know, the ones you've located and never again been seen at? Never told a soul about?

How is your family going to live while you visit the homes of those "jbt's"? You sure as hell ain't gonna go to work the next day......ever.

Now, do I know a few things? Yeah I do.
Those rambo bull**** books always talk about
" seeing the eyes...always the eyes...."

Bull. Done it. Didn't care about the color.

Try sliding a knife through the kidney of an armed man while restraining him so he can neither scream or fire his weapon. Know that if you fail you will die. His comrades will kill you......quickly with any luck.
Hold him while you make the primary inscision, feel and hear the muffled pop as the blade enters, and the trembling as you make that horizontal slice to the left, using the spine as leverage to split the organ. Waiting until he has bled out, feeling that life slip away in your arms............then talk to me about what you're gonna do.......
You wanna tell me horror stories?

You go right ahead.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Michael:

So, I ask the question again.............WHO in the hell are YOU going to shoot at?

Me, I'm going to run through the political process until I've exhausted every possible avenue....NRA, GOA, my congress people, state legislature........every avenue. Every one.
The alternative is so sickening and traumatic as to be revolting.
[/quote]

[Original rant deleted.]

Okay, since the JBTs are 10 feet tall and bullet-proof, when TSHTF and all the legal and political options have been exhausted, what do YOU suggest? If we can't win politically and we can't hope to defeat the awesome might and majesty of the authorities, what's left?

[This message has been edited by Al Mondroca (edited October 24, 2000).]
 
What's left is being organized and having action plans. If people come to arrest you legitimately, put up with it, but if JBTs come to the door, you personally will not stop them. Your neighbors won't either unless they know what to do, when to do it, and what the signals are. IF, and ONLY IF, you get no-knock, illegal confiscation raids, you and your neighbors should do something about it. Don't live near people who will protect you? Change that. Move to a pro-guns state, make the political scene there firmly on our side, and get to know your neighbors well. We have lost too much ground, and we are spread out everywhere surrounded by people who either don't care, or don't approve of what we stand for. Our best defense would be go gain firm control of the western mountain states, which are strong pro-gun states for the most part.

Also, PAY ATTENTION TO WHO YOUR SHERIFF IS!!!

The sheriff has the legal authority to throw the feds out if he wants, and there isn't much they can do about it. Sheriffs usually are too scared to, or don't know they can, do this, inform them that they have your full support if they do, and if they say they won't, elect someone better.

Michael is right, any of you try that alone and you're screwed. Friendship and unity is power, be humble about this, but don't give up.

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The Alcove

I twist the facts until they tell the truth. -Some intellectual sadist

The Bill of Rights is a document of brilliance, a document of wisdom, and it is the ultimate law, spoken or not, for the very concept of a society that holds liberty above the desire for ever greater power. -Me

Compromising the right position only makes you more wrong.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Al Mondroca:
[Original rant deleted.]

Okay, since the JBTs are 10 feet tall and bullet-proof, when TSHTF and all the legal and political options have been exhausted, what do YOU suggest? If we can't win politically and we can't hope to defeat the awesome might and majesty of the authorities, what's left?

[/quote]

Lose
 
You attack when the enemy is weak. Only a wanna-be corpse tries to take out sentries at a fortified base. You take them when they're not ready (going to lunch, taking a pee, meeting friends, etc), or you wait until they're busy elsewhere. If they're busy with another conflict, that means they can't focus their attention on you.

What is so difficult about getting a guy when he gets out of his car to walk into his house at night? It happens all of the time. If done quickly and effectively, how would you find the guy who did it? It's so simple that it scares me. It could happen to anybody any time. Run that through your head when you get out of your car tonight.

That's not a threat, just something to think about and find a way to prepare for.
 
If we truly have 80-90 million gun owners and even 10% resist, disappear or go underground, that is bigger than most other resistance groups.

[This message has been edited by RobertR (edited October 25, 2000).]
 
Considering how many have signed the petition against the NEA's petition for more gun control, I don't think we can reasonably assume that even 5% would participate... maybe even less than 1%... :(

This thread about the petition and pathetic turn out of gun owners to sign it.

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John/az
"When freedom is at stake, your silence is not golden, it's yellow..." RKBA!

www.cphv.COM & www.handguncontrol.NET are being sued by Handgun Control, Inc.!

See the "cease and desist" letter here: www.cphv.com/lawsuit.html
 
Thanks. I just email them for a copy to get signatures. Also mail one to a friend in a different town.

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Robert
Littleton CO
NRA Life, CSSA, RMGO
 
Don't forget how powerful the IRA, PLO, Hamas and all the various terrorist type groups. Most groups have under 5000
members and look at the trouble they are causing in the mid-east right now. Just a few hell raisers gets both sides agitated


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Northen Ireland and Israel/Palestine are hellholes.

Are you ready to turn the USA into one of these places for the RKBA?

You wildly overestimate the people who support you and wildy underestimate the ease of fighting the Feds.

In both these areas, the general populace supports the cause - freeing the Northern Counties or freeing Palestine.

I can guarantee you that the majority of citizens in the USA will NOT support a terrorist campaign so you can have a gun.

You will turned on by the country. You might end up being a set of Timothy McVeighs - hated and hunted.

You blow up a government building and kill kids and most folks, including many of us,
will hunt you down.

Besides, if you posted here for the revolution, you are swept up in the first general roundup of nut cases.

Win the political battle. If you can't convince the public - killing kids in fed. buildings is going to help?
 
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