Live ammo fired in re-enactment,

Not the "anti gunner" conspiracy crap again!!!

I swear, half the gun show ND threads seem to have somebody claiming the anti-gunner conspiracy and come to fine out that most of the time the guns going off are the guns brought in by dealers and after are personal weapons, are weapons not otherwise checked gun show staffing, and/or were weapons not checked by either the dealer or customer before stupidly pulling the trigger. I have been present for one and been present afterwards for two more when vendors were "escorted" away by the cops.

Just how the heck do you think some anti-gunner is going to slip loaded cartridges into a reenactor's gun?

Look, the bottom line is that people do stupid stuff. Gun owners are people. Sometimes gun owners do stupid stuff. It isn't anti-gunners causing CCW folks to have NDs in public places, but it happens. It isn't anti-gunners causing cops to have NDs, but it happens.

However, if you have some proof of this happening, then by all means do share it. Otherwise, there is no reason to make anti-gun excuses for the negligence of the shooter.
 
Human tissue vs. a few tens of thousands of PSI gas is a BAD idea.

For a while spray grease was available in higher pressure cans that could drive it into you skin and result in massive tissue death (You didn't need that finger anyway...).
 
Double;
U sorta helped make my point -- the more modern the more "Rambo" and dangerous, less informed, less controlled the people seem to be.

There are, however, ranks, and the NCO's do take their responsibilities seriously. Especially in safety. I guess you'll have to borrow one of your close friend's kits, practice the 1764 Manual of Arms, get tested by an active unit to see if you can make the cut, form up, and let us know if what you assume is correct. Seems a great black-powder oriented, history immersed, hobby to me.
 
Some are. Some are a bunch of hot doggers wanting to play dress up Army. The NCOs may or may not take their responsibility seriously, but they have no one to actually answer to. So a Vietnam NCO reenactor has one of his E1s accidently shoot live rounds into period equipment or a person. Does the NCO get busted down to an E3 or something. Does that really have any detrimental affect on him. No.

Besides, it isn't just the people below the NCOs that sometimes have problems, is it?

Yes, I looked into playing "with the big boys" and decided that they safety wasn't truly there. I see no reason to go through a voluntary hazing to "make the cut" to play dressup with people that may not be safe - people I don't actually know well enough to let them point real guns at me and pull the trigger.
 
People have to be afraid of being demoted a slave-wage lifer pay grade for a job that doesn't require a high-school diploma to take safety seriously? Then why are ranges so relatively safe?

No-one is getting paid to be safe. The NCO's have a job to do and got there democraticaly because they know their stuff and conduct themselves as leaders by example, doing their jobs and then some. You should go to a reenactment and observe them. Note safety checks before and AFTER a battle when everyone is tired, dehydrated, dirty and melting in wool uniforms under the sun. Can the safety measures catch everything? They'd be foolproof but it is clear we keep building bigger fools...

I've never heard of hazing prospective reenactors. Did something bad happen to you?

Oh, BTW, they aren't actually ever supposed to point guns at each other.
 
I used to be a WWII Russian reenactor and pointing guns at CLOSE ranges was a no no. Problem is when people get pumped up with adrenaline things get a little to real sometimes. Once when doing our saftey check some people had smoke bombs full of kitty litter :eek:luckily someone found them. I've also played paintball and guys had way worse.
 
When CW reenactors use their muskets for deer hunting sometimes part of the skirt of the bullet will break off and leave a lead ring inside the bore of the rifle. This can be missed with a sloppy inspection of the weapon prior to shooting in a reenactment. After a few blank rounds are fired the ring can become loose and shoot out at some poor schmuck on the other side. At least that's the story I was told a few years ago when some yankee got wacked in the foot with.......something. Of course I remember another time another reenactor was shot in the....man marbles....with a 22........seems he was carrying an older Single Six in his sack while on a horse and ooops. How that got past inspection I hate to think.......
 
You know, I can understand that there are some reasonable risks with reenacting. Paul Revere almost got killed last year, for crying out loud, when his horse flipped on top of him. http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2010/07/paul_revere_reenactor_injured.html This guy's powder pouch got ignited. http://www.reenactor.net/forums/?action=printpage;topic=345.0

I found this thread interesting...
http://civilwarreenacting.forumotion.net/t301-worst-injury-you-have-seen-at-a-reenactment

You have people walking over fires, charges, injured by animals, and getting shot.

Getting shot, however, is not a reasonable risk.
 
Update to the June 17th shooting's

Here is the AP article,

The shooter Paul Doering has a lengthy criminal past and was a felon in possession of firearms.
I don't see in the story what penalty he is looking at for this.

Edit:
I see there is a plea in the works.
On-line records in MN that I can find only go back to 1985 and since that time he was convicted of Fleeing 3 times, Burglary 2 times, violating OFP 2 times and his 2nd in 5 year DWI.
Someone should have done a background check on him before letting him preform.
 
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Wow, thanks for the update.

A plea bargain is in the works? I hope the difference is along the lines of 70 years to 68 years.

I don't know how MN works, but could he not get felony criminal endangerment for each person injured and a felony for each of the guns? I should keep him put away for a while.
 
A Rev. War reenactor group once invited me to participate. I couldn't make it but the rules sent to me clearly stated I should not bring balls and would be searched for any before the reenactment began. Good rule.
I have friends who do horseback cowboy shooting. They are not allowed to bring their own blank (or any kind) ammo. Their registration fee includes approved blank ammo that is issued to them.
 
I was a member of the Guthrie Gunfighters back in 1999,,,

We underwent a very rigid inspection process before each show,,,
I used 1858 remingtons so I had no cartridge issues.

No live ammo was allowed on anyones cartridge belts,,,
They used empty cases with no primer in them,,,
This made for an easy inspection of the belts.

Before each show one person came out and loaded the guns with blanks,,,
At all other times we walked around with empty cylinders.

Even though we were uber-safety conscious,,,
I couldn't aim directly at any person,,,
I always aimed a bit to the side.

Aarond
 
This was not so much an accident by an actor as it was stupid action on the part of a felon and felons are, in general - stupid.

Yes the company had poor oversite.
 
At the various Rev War and CW reenactments I have participated in safety is emphasized VERY strongly and well adhered to. Lead balls are ABSOLUTELY prohibited-and few of the reenactors I have known were shooters anyway.
At Monmouth Battlefield in 1991 or so a Union drummer boy's drum was hit by a tompion supposedly fired by a Confederat dismounted cavalryman, at Gettysburg a few years ago a reenactor was hit by a cleaning jag fired by a cavalryman out of his revolver. Those are the only 2 accidents I know of.
 
When the Old Guard was checked before a function involving a recent President, the Pres was still in office, the EOD Team found 4 muskets with loads in the barrel.

Unfortunately, this type incident is rare but not unusual.
 
DNS,
This happened in South Dakota. Doering just so happened to be a resident of MN. and they made reference to his past, so I checked our free access site.
I will have to set my cell phone message reminder to check on the sentence.
 
DNS,
This happened in South Dakota. Doering just so happened to be a resident of MN. and they made reference to his past, so I checked our free access site.
I will have to set my cell phone message reminder to check on the sentence
Click to expand...

AH! So while I was in error on the location and you provided the correct location, I am still in the dark. I don't know the specific laws of SD either, LOL.

So then is it possible that this guy was crossing state lines with firearms and hence subject to federal charges, too?
 
I believe one of the news articles listed him as a Summerset resident.
His criminal past is in Minnesota. I am unable to get into South Dakota criminal records like I can in MN.
I will be interested in what he gets for the charges he plead to. :rolleyes:
 
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