light or heavy bullets for 2" .357 SD revolver

How about mimicking (or passing) the time proven 'FBI load' (.38 spl +p 158 LSWC-HP) in magnum brass, that's what I do.
I use the Magnus swaged 158 LSWC-HP because it's relatively soft compared to most commercial cast, and it's got a wide meplat and an impressive looking hollow point and clean sharp edges.

That old load had a solid track record in .38 snubbies and was used by the RCMP in their 5" 38's with good results, even when dispatching large animals.
In magnum brass you can reach the same velocity or better with plenty of safety margin. I think 950 fps would be achievable in a snubby
I have not tested the Magnus HP in any way, but it's the most impressive looking of all the swaged hollowpoints in my collection.(Speer/Hornady/Rem)
http://saas.shopsite.com/magnusbullets/store/page11.html
 
Don't know about anyone else, but just about any handloads I have ever shot in my wife's S&W 340PD scandium revolver hurt. We found the new Ruger branded ARX poly bullet to be an exception. No pain and the reality of extreme tissue damage made this her load of choice in this very lightweight revolver. I know it's a store bought load and not a handload, but lack of punishment makes for more practice.
Ralph
 
great minds think alike

Hammerhead said:
How about mimicking (or passing) the time proven 'FBI load' (.38 spl +p 158 LSWC-HP) in magnum brass, that's what I do.
I use the Magnus swaged 158 LSWC-HP because it's relatively soft compared to most commercial cast, and it's got a wide meplat and an impressive looking hollow point and clean sharp edges.

That is what I have done. A 158rgr. swchp/gc over 6.5 gr. of Power Pistol in .357 brass gives me about 950 fps. through my LCR .357. Loud and quite the kick but I can shoot the revolver one handed and be back on target quickly. Not a plinking round but will work well on two of four legged preditors. Has good penetration in wet newspaper and expands in a near perfect mushroom twice its dia. Good shootin' to ya'.
 
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A 158rgr. swchp/gc over 6.5 gr. of Power Pistol in .357 brass gives me about 950 fps. through my LCR .357
That sounds like a winner to me.
I'm still after a jacketed load since all my practice these days is with Rainier plated bullets.

I bought some 135 grain Gold Dot short barrel bullets recently. They are not impressive looking, very inconsistent in their length, weight and even the location of the cannalure varies. Should be a good bullet after sorting out the rejects.:mad: HUGE hollow point on these. May not feed in lever guns. Speer had data specific for those including Power Pistol.

Also contemplating the Hornady 140 XTP, that's supposed to expand down to 900 fps or less. I know Hornady builds a consistent bullet. 9mm XTPs are impressive performers.

How are you liking Power Pistol in 357?
Burn clean?
Magnum primers?
Meter well?
Sure looks like a winner on paper.
 
A heavier bullet causes longer barrel time, so the pressure has more time to peak when the bullet isn't too far down the bore. A bullet that is too light for the powder burn rate can lead to a lot of velocity spread in very short barrels. We had a fellow with a 1 7/8 inch snubby in .38 Special getting velocity variation from about 490 fps to 650 fps from his load on another forum (I forget if the bullet was 125 grains or 110 grains). Going to a faster powder, the velocity spread came down, but 600 fps was as fast as he could safely go with the faster powder.

It is a factor that muzzle energy will tend to peak with a bullet the right weight and seating depth in the .357 Magnum. In a full power .357 load for 3" and longer barrels, 125 grains is usually the sweet spot with H110/296 and other magnum-specific powders, but the short barrels keep those powders from being utilized to best effect with that bullet weight. .38 Special has the same issue with short barrels. I noticed, as Hammerhead must have, that Speer Gold Dot .38 Special and .357 Magnum Short Barrel Ammunition uses their 135 grain bullets. That's weight is probably a best compromise value for the snubbies in these cartridges. Also, the Gold Dot is a plated jacket bullet that is harder than lead but softer than standard jackets, and that probably ensures its expansion at lower velocities than Jackets will work well with. If I were doing your project, despite Hammerhead's disappointment with the bullet's length consistency, I would likely piggy back onto Speer's experience with snubby loads and use this bullet as a starting point anyway. Nosler used to make a 135, but I don't see it listed on their site.

For a 2 inch barrel, QuickLOAD thinks a number of powders could still achieve pretty good velocities at that bullet weight and despite the short barrel, though I don't fully trust it's predictions with such short barrels, so I won't mention numbers here. But relative comparisons are still promising. It predicts 2400 will be a top velocity producer in this barrel length. Blue Dot is another possibility, but after Alliant's warnings against its use with 125 grain bullets and the fact 2400 got slightly more velocity with slightly lower charge weight in the short barrel, I figured, why mess with it? Unique does well for a tamer load. Power Pistol is known for fireball brightness, but at Alliant's listed load is an in between velocity producer. Per Hammerhead's point, 2400, Power Pistol, and Unique all have recipe's for the 135 grain Gold Dot, specifically, at Alliant's web site, which is another reason to work with these powders if you are going to try that bullet. Just remember Alliant's "recipe's" are max loads and their manual says to knock them down 10% to start. I haven't loaded with 2400 recently, but my recollection is that it has a yellower flame than the sphericals produce, so the fireball is less blinding. You will have to experiment to see which works best for you, though.

One last point: For the short barrel consistent ignition is extra important. Because a snubby is light, bullets are more subject to inertial pulling under recoil, which makes a bullet stick out of the cylinder and jam rotation. For both of these reasons, a really strong crimp is extra important. I can recommend the Redding Profile Crimp Dies, specifically. It's roll crimps can be made firmer than others without bowing the case out below the crimp. Lee now makes a Collet Style Crimp Die for 357 Magnum that is less than half the cost of the Redding product and that might provide an even stronger crimp, but I just got one and haven't yet tried it out, so I haven't proved this to myself one way or the other.
 
I bought some 135 grain Gold Dot short barrel bullets recently.

Hmm, I've only been looking for this bullet for about five years now - no luck. I have purchased (and extensively chronographed) loaded ammo with this bullet - in 38+P and 357 Mag.

How are you liking Power Pistol in 357?

Speaking for myself: a lot. A touch flashy; but potent stuff. Makes bullets go fast.

Burn clean?

I think so. At least, how I've loaded with it; which is pumped up pretty good - where it belongs.

Magnum primers?

Not necessary; as it ignites easily.

Meter well?

Identical to Bullseye (looks identical too); so, pretty good.

Sure looks like a winner on paper.

Makes bullets go fast. Yes, it's good stuff.
 
Hmm, I've only been looking for this bullet for about five years now - no luck. I have purchased (and extensively chronographed) loaded ammo with this bullet - in 38+P and 357 Mag.
They were at Midway a few months ago. They're due back in stock in this week.
 
light or heavy bullets for 2" .357 SD revolver

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Trying to develop some SD loads for a light weight .357 snub-nose revolver. True .357 loads are just too brutal to shoot and +P are not powerful enough. Have tried 125 gr. @ 1050-1070 fps and 158 gr.@920 fps. The 125 gr. load developed more energy but less TKO than the 158 gr. load with less ft. lbs. but higher TKO rating.I figure in the TKO (Taylor Knock Out values) because I don't think lbs. of energy are the only measure to be considered when comparing loads, IE: a 55 gr .223 load has more energy than a 240 gr. .44 magnum load. Would rather have the .44 mag load for short range self-defense.
Anybody out there have any thoughts on which would be the better SD load?

There is a range between where 38 Special +p ends and 357 Magnum minimum starts that makes a good range for the small 357 guns using 357 cases. You do have to find a match in bullet and powder. I make that comparison with Speer Short Barrel loads, although you have to fudge a bit around their 135 gr bullet. I don't use heavy bullets in short barrels, hoping to get enough velocity for bullet expansion. Therefore, I need to use the fast powders, in my case AA#2.
 
There is a range between where 38 Special +p ends and 357 Magnum minimum starts.

Yes, the divide between the two (although what defines "minimum 357" is largely a matter of opinion) is rather cavernous. This area has its place in some applications. This might be one of them.
 
My favorite is 12gr of 2400 behind a 158gr bullet, jacketed or cast. Very accurate at any range out of any length barrel I've ever tried. Definitly hotter than 38 but not a stem winding 357 either.
 
I prefer to use heavier bullets and generally go with a 158 grain SWC in my snubbies. You can get some pretty powerful loads out of the snubbie with a little work. Just take a look at what Buffalo Bore is getting out of there 38sp P+ outdoorsman ammo. They are showing it will hit 1027 feet/sec out of S&W642 and that's a 158 grain projectile. I've fired them out of my LCR 38 and it is a handful.
 
I called Speer and asked about the 135 grain Gold Dot's disposition. He told me their loaded ammunition demand for that bullet has been very high and with some law enforcement contracts being filled, only about 10% of the ones they make are being made available for the handloading market at this time. He thought that once the contracts were fulfilled, that would change and you'd see more of them available.

I also asked him about the expanding velocity. I noticed Speer's databook only has it in +P loads for .38 Special. He said 860 fps was their recommended minimum. The reason I asked is that Hornady's XTP line has a 140 grain bullet and it requires 850 fps. It's harder jacket will likely mean it wants a little less powder, but its weight is close enough that I expect you could ultimately load it to similar enough ballistics to the Gold Dot in the .357 2" gun to get good performance.
 
I made up this chart of the load range for a smaller 357 using the gap between 38 +p max and 357 Magnum minimum. I did not use Speer Short Barrel and instead went with a 125 gr JHP that one could actually buy and load.
357%20Lite%20Loads.jpg


My current favorite is 7.0 gr SR4756 with Mag primers, but it could be lower, per the chart.

All data is from powder company sources.
 
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