military & the .223
Military levers, hmm........well the Russians bought a bunch of M1895 Winchesters chambered in 7.62x54r, during WWI, musket style stock, bayonet lug, stripper clip guide and all. I wouldn't think that rifle would have held up well in the trenches at all. I've actually handled one, sporterized here locally, but it was back before Mosin/x54r craze that swept the country and I did not buy it as I perceived ammo to be a problem. Who knew? I wonder how it got to N. Alabama, if in fact it ever got to Russia? If guns could talk.........?
Earlier levers saw combat, but their advantage was rate of fire over their muzzleloading contemporaries. I'm thinking the Spencer and the Henry. Seems I read some M94's were used as guard guns here in the US in WWII.
But the Mauser took over and the Russians eventually produced the Mosin (till they sold them back to us) and we came up with the Springfield ( and had to pay Germany some money on patent stuff) and the rest really is history.
I'm familiar with the Remington pumps using spiral magazines. Locally they were known as "candy cane" pumps formally the Models 14 and later 141. They were a family favorite and one chambered in .30 Rem was my first deer rifle. I really should kill a deer with it before I cannot run the iron sights at all. Kinda strayed from lever .223's, sorry.
Despite my "formidable" comment earlier, I do not see the .223 as an ideal battle cartridge and I believe the current search for a replacement is proof of that. That said, I think it is an ideal LE and urban cartridge when loaded with appropriate ammo. I'm surprised that LE has not embraced V-max ammo and or ultra light bullets like 40-45 grain. Perhaps they have on entry teams and I am just not aware. I can not imagine those frangible pills making it through a felon or drywall. Hornady claims they penetrate less in gel than a pistol round. The loads in favor seem to trend towards bonded bullets and increased penetration, like a .223 for deer.
Comparing .30 Carbine to .223 brings up some interesting results. In gel, it appears anybody's expanding carbine ammo penetrates more than any expanding service pistol round. A .30 Carbine FMJ is a serious penetrator, exiting a testers set of blocks after drilling through 27"!!! On hard mediums, .30 Carbine out penetrated both 5.56 FMJ and not surprisingly, .45 ACP ball.
I have always liked the M1 carbine, and have always wanted one. I would not feel undergunned with a carbine and expanding for SD in most instances.
But declaring the .30 Carbine superior to the .223 for urban and LE purposes is contrary to current testing. The .30 Carbine round out penetrates the .223 with all ammo types (INCLUDING 55 gr FM) with the possible exclusion of 5.56 green tip which is designed for enhanced penetration.
In an attempt to bring my post back to levers, there was a .30 Carbine lever action, the Marlin Levermatic......wish I had one of those too!
