Let's try again: Which Handgun?

Dumb Thread X 10

At least one poster made the point that your azz will be grazz if you are caught with ANY firearm in many countries. In Jamaica, if you have ONE round of ammo you go to the slammer and everything you own gets taken. If you survive being gang raped 50 times you might get a trial and you'll be convicted and sent back for more gang raping.

It's a stupid question with an idiotic premise.

The only LEGAL choice is the most powerful flare gun you can buy with lots of ammo stored in vacuum sealed packs. Large handheld flares are also a good hand to hand weapon.
As a long time sailor, there are MANY places I sailed 20 years ago that I wouldn't go now with any boat that didn't have U.S. Navy guys and guns on board.
Even the US Virgin Islands are dangerous.
Gump had it right, kill this thread!
 
Plenty to see right here in America and I don't have to make excuses for my guns.

Plus, the service in restaurants is uniformly better than you'll find in other countries...
 
I think Quint had the right idea, but...

...Google "noonesite". It is a cruising forum with lots of information about recent acts of piracy and customs laws relating to firearms. Generally, you declare the weapons to Customs upon arrival in a port, but the laws vary by country.

Here are some considerations for weapon choice that come to mind:

- Some countries have restrictions on military weapons and calibers (Mexico, for example);

- I think that with weapons on a boat, you're basically talking about a "repel boarders" scenario, because if you're up against any sort of crew-served weapon, it won't really matter what small arms you have;

- Resistance to corrosion and mechanical reliability with minimal maintenance are desirable qualities;

- The weapons could end up being in custody of port authorities, so they shouldn't be too nice or exotic;

- Ammo will be whatever you bring, so resupply isn't a consideration.

Given this line of thinking, my choices are:

- A well-used mid-sized .357 stainless steel double-action revolver with fixed sights, like a S&W 65 or comparable Ruger: Non-military caliber, versatile ammo (shotshells, .38s, .357), solid man-stopper, that won't make you cry when it goes over the side.

- A 12-Gauge pump shotgun with a weather-resistant finish: Even the Marine Magnums rust, so I'd get an old crappy gun, Duracoat it (or whatever), then add a side-saddle and tactical light.

- I'd love a rifle, but given the constraints listed above, I just don't think I'd bother to carry one. Given a self-defense purpose and a lever or bolt action against AKs, even with a range and accuracy advantage, I just don't see it as a tactical scenario.
 
LordTio3 said:
hmm. I thought I'd pick a revolver too.
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Revolver or not, your choices are good IMO, with good thoughts on "why". No experience with the M14, but Glocks are good reliable firearms. I've owned a few (G20 & G27), and never had a bit of trouble with either. They were accurate enough for their purpose too, but I never could get use to the feel of them.

Even so, a G19 is high on my list of "guns wanted". The grip is longer than the 27, and not as deep (front-to-back) as the G20, so it should fit my hand(s) better.

IMHO though, the 9mm is more of a "social" purpose cartridge, less effective than some revolver cartridges for "woods" carry. It would work great for shooting a coyote; not so great perhaps for shooting a 300 lb hog.

It's hard to find a "package" for "any" circumstance though. Smaller seems to be better for social type purposes, and bigger is generally better IMO for "other than social" purposes. I can open carry a SA revolver here, even in town, without any issues, but if I go to another area of the world then it's not as "accepted". Large frame handguns aren't as concealable for carry as they are useful when needed.

So, it seems to me that most choices (for-all-purposes) become a compromise of some sort.

I'd intended this thread to see what folks would choose as a "one-size-fits-all" handgun, but I'm starting to wonder if a great choice exists. For social purposes, more concealable firearms are usually better, but short barrels (sub-3") and/or short grips aren't great choices for outdoor type use.

I carry a J-frame .38 special for "social" areas, and then add a SA in .45 Colt when headed to more rural areas. I have several handguns, but these two seem to be the most carried. They serve me well for "any circumstance", but I'm not very confidant that one gun exists that I could replace these two with. If I had to choose one for all occasions, I'd certainly choose the larger one, but there are times and places where it might not be "acceptable".

A rifle, for me, is almost a "non-issue". I've kept a rifle behind the seat of various trucks since I started driving at 16. It's just something that's always there. Concealing them isn't an issue, and one is generally pretty similar in size to the next. Choose a cartridge that fills the projected need, in an action type that fits the user's fancy, and go forth with confidence.

I have several to choose from, and I'm not sure one is better than the others for general, do-it-all purposes. A .243 or .308 will serve me well enough in any of several bolt action platforms. That's the platform I hunt with, so it's the one I'm most familiar with.
 
Citizen Carrier has it right...

as for those who would carry abroad....be sure you keep the US Embassy or Consul's phone number handy. I'm sure the Kenyan will bail you out......eventually.
 
In terms of an "around the world trip", I think the handgun(s) that would make my short list would be...

  1. Browning Hi-Power - It's been in use worldwide for 80 years, well known in many countries, well made and reliable. Add a matte hard-chrome finish for marine use.
  2. Beretta 92FS - Another well know pistol outside the USA. Most importantly, I can score well with one. Hard chrome is a must on this one.
  3. A 1911 Clone - A stainless 1911 with conversion parts for .38 Super would give you the ability to use two types of ammo. However, unlike the first two, it undeniably screams "American!"
  4. CZ-75B - Well known in Europe, M.E. and Asia. Reliable, high capacity, well made. And it should be cheapest of the lot (more ammo!).

Leaning to the 9mm is logical as it is the most popular pistol cartridge in most of the world. For the purpose of repelling invaders any high-quality JHP round that functions 100% would comprise the first 3 magazines with enough spare JHP ammo for one refill. After that, the other magazines contain ball ammo. Unless one gets too close to Somolia or other pirated waters, 100 rds of JHP should be plenty.

Consideration for a rifle -- In my view, you want a rifle that can reach out at least 200m accurately to keep hostile boats at bay. Further is better. Rate of fire may be important for pirates/hostile parties. Since boats are large and sturdy, this eliminates the 5.56 IMO. The M1A, FN-FAL, HK G91 or similar will work. Stowing about 60 rounds of APT and 40 of API ammo for serious encounters against other boats seems prudent.

A marine-use shotgun could be substituted for short range use. A combination of #00 buckshot and rifled slugs (and/or sabot slugs) could ward off smaller boats (buckshot would ruin a Zodiac owner's day). And a few boxes of birdshot if you can go hunting waterfowl in certain places.

If it was "grab and go" with what I currently own, I might be tempted to take this combo...
M57M1894.jpg

S&W 57 and Marlin 1894FG - in .41 Magnum

Now, before someone says it, the legal issues make doing any of this problematic. You may plan to avoid "hostile" ports but breakdowns, storms and politics have a way of changing those plans.
 
My boat gun for my sloop (a 28 footer usually used on the lake, and once every two to three years gets put out to sea for fishing... US waters thank you very much) is a Mossberg Maverick. It is stainless and polymer with a folding stock. Hence, it is easy to stow, stands up to "sea" conditions fairly well, and just plain works. I have no need of a handgun or rifle aboard my boat, and exposing a firearm to rust-inducing conditions, without a verifiable need, seems foolhardy to me.

That said, if I were hunting pirates off the African coast... I wouldn't be in my sailboat. Odds are the ship would be crewed by the Navy and full of my Marine brethren... like maybe a Marine Expeditionary Unit. If that's the case, I'll be armed with whatever the mission requires.
 
Another one for a Browning Hi-Power. And a 12 gauge pump of some sort, suitably treated to protect against salt water effects.
 
1. It's amazing how ignorant people are and they obviously do not read all the posts. LEAVE THE LEGALITIES OUT OF IT! IT IS NOT A REAL QUESTION ABOUT A GUY ACTUALLY TRAVELING THE WORLD!! YOU ARE NOT SOME COOL SMART GUY BECAUSE YOU REFUSE TO PLAY A GAME BECAUSE YOU WANT TO GET ALL TECHNICAL! I'M PRETTY SURE PIRATES ARE ILLEGAL IN MOST IF NOT EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD.

2. That said and done. 1 Rifle, 1 Handgun? My rifle would have to be an AK-47 in 7.62x39 strictly because you can find parts and ammo for it anywhere. Its a good assault rifle to fight pirates even if it is semi-auto and you can still take it hunting.

My pistol would have probably a hi-cap 9mm like a Glock...

These answers are strictly based on if I need to find more ammo and replacement parts... Otherwise I'd take a M2 and a 1911
 
huh?

It's amazing how ignorant people are and they obviously do not read all the posts. LEAVE THE LEGALITIES OUT OF IT! IT IS NOT A REAL QUESTION ABOUT A GUY ACTUALLY TRAVELING THE WORLD!!
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So.....you want a practical answer to an impractical question. AND you expect that no one should take exception to that.
I do enjoy these "what one gun.....if you could only.....what would be your choice if..." threads. I think about these choices frequently when I'm in daydream mode. ("If I were taking and extended road trip - maybe a year - what three long guns would I bring? PIstols? Ammo?")
It's a lot easier to be serious about the idea if the premise is realistic. There are a number of scenarios that could be predicated that would avoid the possibility that a luckless soul might take the "gun-on-a-boat-in-foreign-waters" idea seriously.
Pete
 
So.....you want a practical answer to an impractical question. AND you expect that no one should take exception to that.
I do enjoy these "what one gun.....if you could only.....what would be your choice if..." threads. I think about these choices frequently when I'm in daydream mode. ("If I were taking and extended road trip - maybe a year - what three long guns would I bring? PIstols? Ammo?")
It's a lot easier to be serious about the idea if the premise is realistic. There are a number of scenarios that could be predicated that would avoid the possibility that a luckless soul might take the "gun-on-a-boat-in-foreign-waters" idea seriously.
Pete
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Well pete, I didn't mean this as a "if you could only have one..." thread.

My question, as I said before, was intended to see what people might "carry with them". You can have all the guns you want in your home, but they won't do you any good if you need one and don't have it with you.

So, the intent was simple; which handgun for "any" circumstance. It has less to do with laws, and more to do with what's practical and adequate. Laws can certainly be a factor, and perhaps the scenario is flawed (most are), but it was meant to take in a broader scope of "needs".

I once took a .45 Colt to Alaska, and played heck trying to find "hunting" type factory loads for it in Anchorage when I got there. Lesson learned, and next time I'll simply take my own loads. I'd never flown with ammo or firearms before, and played it "safe". The fact that I flew back with what was left of my ammo showed little need for concern.

That's the only time I've ever had any desire for a different chambering in a do-it-all outdoor handgun, but it goes to show how "common" can be more practical in some cases.

I apologize if the scenario offended your delicate and sensitive nature; I promise there was no offense intended. I figured it was something that perhaps more people could relate to than going into hunting several states, several different terrains, on foot, on horseback, in vehicles, and so forth. Where I live "pirates" are a very real concern in the form of drug smugglers, and the rest isn't too far from the truth, either.

Daryl
 
Nature

your delicate and sensitive nature
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:rolleyes:

Do I detect sarcasm? No need.
You write well enough. So...
the intent was simple; which handgun for "any" circumstance
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You could have left it at that.
I figured it was something that perhaps more people could relate to than going into hunting several states, several different terrains, on foot, on horseback,
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Add traveling around the country for a few months
And that there is right on the idea.
Pete

Was looking at my response in post 12 - my choices (see...I did play.). Thinking some more about it, I'd for sure carry a good laser rangefinder.
P
 
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Ruger KGP 161 would be my sidearm of choice without doubts.

157_1.jpg


Concerning the rifle, now it's a tricky question. Honestly, don't know. I think that it would be a semiauto, in .308 Win which is as universal as it can be and pretty common to get. And the weapon would be indeed something very simple and rugged, no fancy, all bussiness. Maybe the russian Saiga, which is based on AK, or Izmash Tiger in .308 (Dragunov).

tigr_308l.jpg


Note that I personally prefer bolt actions but semiauto might be better for a survival situation. :)
 
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