LEO's: Describe your qualification course

shooter_john

New member
Alabama has just modified the APOST (AL Peace Officer's Standards and Training) handgun qualification course. They were finalizing the course when I was going through the academy early last year, and we shot it at my agency last week. I think it pretty much sucks.
The new course of fire is 50 rounds, 12x 25 yards, 12x 15 yards, 14x 7 yards, 12x 5 yards. This is a daylight course, scored on a 100 point scale, minimum score is 70 (35 hits) on a "Q" target.
Just interested to hear what others shoot. Thanks for your input.
 
60rds, fired on a TQ-15 target, scored 5-4-3, 75% required to pass (225/300)

25yds: (18rds) From the standing, 6rds prone, 6rds kneeling, 6rds standing.

15yds: (12rds) Run from 25yd to 15yd, draw 2rds, stay at lowered ready, fire 2rds from lowered ready on signal.

7yds: (12rds) Run from 15yd to 7yd, draw, fire 6rds, reload, fire another 6rds.

5yds: (10rds) Run from 7yd to 5yd, draw, fire 5rds one hand, reload, transfer to opposite hand, fire 5rds.

2yds: (8rds) Draw, 2rds one hand double tap (think quick draw).

I do run a time limit on each, although I can't remember the times right now.
 
Ours changes quarterly. Last quarter had pretty easy shooting challenges, with lots of malfunction drills.
 
Ours is similar to Steve's except our yd lines are 3, 7, 10, 15, 25. We also have time limits any where from 3 secs to 12 per sequince depending on number of rds. fired in that particualr sequence and the distance from the target. WE also have weak hand shooting at the 25 yd. line. and we need a 240 or 80%
 
Also remember,

"Qualification" is not firearms training, it is just proficiency with a weapon.

I run a qual course for handgun, shotgun and rifle for my dept. But I also run tactical/stress (multiple targets, shoot/no shoot, etc) dim light and night fire.
 
Same here steve. I'd say all the course we run are somewhat challenging except the shotgun course. Although we don't use shotguns as much as alot of places because everyone has an ar-15 and we don't even get provided slugs, just buck shot.
 
Police Qualification Course

The purpose of a handgun qualification course is to measure basic marksmanship skills and the ability of the operator to properly manipulate the weapon. It is a performance measure. It is "training" in the sense that most any structured repetition of a skill has value in "programming the computer" but it is not "training" in a tactical, force on force sense.

That being said, you have to be able to perform basic skills and hit the target consistently on a square range before you can do any of the neater stuff. And considering that most cops don't shoot in practice on their own and that the only time they shoot will probably be during in-service training, you just can't get too complicated and "high speed" because they can't do it safely nor hit the target. It's unfortunate, but that's the reality of the world.

Different states and different departments have different requirements for how often they do firearms training and what their qualification standards are, and it varies widely. Some places shoot monthly and some shoot annually and some small departments may not do much training at all. In the county where I work, all the agencies shoot quarterly. My department shoots quarterly, usually 150 to 200 rounds of handgun per session (including a 50 or 60 round qualification course) and 60 to 100 rounds with the AR-15 (including a 30 or 60 rounds qualification course). We only shoot the rifle three times a year because the other time we're firing on the indoor range in low light and the indoor range can't accomodate rifle fire (and I haven't convinced management to buy any frangible ammo because of the cost)

It took years(!!!) for us to convince management we needed to shoot this much. Ten years ago we'd go out for quarterly training and waste all day shooting 75 or 100 rounds of handgun and 5 00 buckshot and 5 slugs, taking all day to do what we could've done in two hours . . . but that's another story for another day . . . .

So any way, to the point of all this: Noted below is a qualification course we've used frequently for the last two years or so. Besides whatever ideas our training staff comes up with, each inservice we try to use a formal course from a recognized source so we can show that we conform to the prevailing professional standard. (There is no requirement to do this, but it can help make your firearms training program more defensible in court if you ever get challenged). We have used courses from the FBI and the Army and the Air Force and the ATF and the DEA and various other states and state police organizations. This one is based on the QC used by the US Marshals Service.

US Marshals Service Handgun Qualification Course -- Modified

TARGET: The USMS uses the Trans Tar II target scored 5-4-3-2.
(we used the NRA TQ-15 target scored 5-4-1. When I practice myself I use an IDPA or IPSC target scored 5-4-2)

AMMUNITION REQUIRED: 60 rounds
DISTANCES OF ENGAGEMENT: 3,7,15 and 25 yards
MINIMUM QUALIFICATION STANDARD: 210 points/70%

STAGE DISTANCE PROCEDURE
1. 3 yards From the holster, draw & fire 2 rnds center mass and
one headshot. 3 rnds in 4 sec. 2X

2. 3 yards Begin at the low ready with the handgun in the weak
hand. At the signal fire 2 rnds in 4 seconds
WEAK HAND ONLY. 2X

3. 7 yards From the holster, draw & fire 3 rnds center mass
in 4 seconds. 2X

4. 7 yards From the holster, draw & fire 3 rnds center mass
in 5 seconds STRONG HAND ONLY . 2X

5. 7 yards From the holster, draw & fire 3 rnds center mass
and one headshot. 3 rnds in 5 seconds. 4X

6. 15 yards From the holster, draw & fire 3 rnds center mass
in 5 seconds. 4X

7. 25 yards From the holster, using the high barricade for cover:
fire 6 rnds standing, perform a mandatory reload, drop
to the high kneeling position and fire 3 rnds, perform a
mandatory reload, go prone and fire 3 rnds. Total of
12 rounds fired in 60 seconds.

6 headshots required

Qualification Standard:
300 pts = Distinguished Expert
285-299 = Expert
255-284 = Sharpshooter
210-254 = Marksman
below 210 = DNQ (did not qualify)

This course is based on the USMS Handgun QC in use on 1 January 2004.

The USMS fires this course from concealment.

(We extended the time limits to encourage accuracy over speed)

This isn't the only course out there or the best course or anything like that, but it's one I really like and I use it as a practice course fairly frequently.
 
More interesting courses of fire

Check out www.personaldefensetraining.com. Scroll down the toolbar on the left side to the bottom where it says "Drills and Targets". There are links to the MEU SOC handgun course of fire and also to the Personal Defense Training Handgun QC. I originally became aware of this because of a post on the Lightfightertactical Forums by David Blinder of PDT.
 
Most of my agency's qual course is within 15 yds. 48 rounds total, 32 to pass. Most of the shots are fired between 3-15 yds. some people still fail. they just won't practice.
 
ours is weak...here's a link to the minimum


subject to change, and not what i shot. again, it says the agency can change to suit. ours was a 50 rd course, 7, 15 and 25 yards. same size target and 70% hit to pass. basically, you hit everything in the 7 and 15, you passed, you could completely throw off the 25 yard shoot.

personally, i think it needs revisited, but that's just me.
 
squid..i googled mine to make sure, lol. and i laughted when i found out it's not the same qual i had to do. top that off, each MTU is different...

i doubt that posting someone's qual requirements is pushing anything in respect to OPSEC. again, i googled mine
 
Alright, I guess I am wrong in most cases. I know for me the information is pretty public, its the standard Navy Handgun Qualification Course, with night fire and practical weapons course. Just incase, I recomend you google it just to make sure. I would imagine some departments prefer that not be made public for whatever reason.
 
My department goes through 4 qualifications a year. Each one is different.

#1. Standard daylight practice course of 60 rounds. Various distances. Some shots are timed, some aren't.

#2. Night shoot. We go to the range and do not shoot until after it becomes really dark. We shoot using low light and no light at all.

#3. Tactical Shoot. On this range set up we move from barricade to barricade, shoot or engage multiple targets at various distances. This one we call "The Shoot and Scoot."

#4. FATS Machine done indoors in the winter time. This "qualification" is for shoot-don't shoot testing. Sometimes we do it in low light and other times we do it with full light on in the room. Computer records the hits so you can review whether you did right or wrong.
 
Here's ours in Ohio. We use targets similar to these, although ours aren't shaded. I chose the shaded targets to give you an idea of our "preferred area", which is the shaded area. Anywhere in the shaded area counts as a hit. Head shots do not count as a hit. On any of the stages that call for moving while shooting, any shots fired from a stationary position do not count.

ohpt-cs.jpg


Stage 1- From carry ready, on command fire 6 rds into the preferred area of the target 50 ft away. Time limit 18 seconds.

Stage 2- On command, draw from the holster and fire 6 rds strong hand only from 12 feet. Perform a mandatory reload and fire 6 rds weak hand only. Time limit 15 seconds for all 12 rds and the reload.

Stage 3- On command, draw from the holster and fire 3 rds at the target at 21 ft in low level light using a flashlight hold, shooter's choice. Time limit 5 seconds. Repeat for a total of 6 rds fired.

Stage 4- 4 targets evenly spaced in front of the barricade, two on either side, 21 feet from barricade to targets. On command, run 75 feet to a simulated 4'x6' barricade located at 21 feet from the targets. Draw and fire 2 rds from the strong side at the outermost target while standing. Assume an alternate position (kneeling, crouching, basically anything but standing or prone) and fire 2 rds at the inner target beside the first one. Perform a tactical reload behind cover. Move to the non-dominant side and repeat the above (2 rds standing, 2 rds alternate position). Time limit 30 seconds.

Stage 5- 3 targets evenly spaced. Start standing approx 5 feet from the middle target. On command, draw and fire 3 rds from the hip at the middle target (groin hits preferred). Begin moving backwards, assume a two handed hold and fire 3 more rds at the middle target. Reload if necessary and, while moving backward, fire 3 rds at each of the other two targets. Time limit 15 seconds.

Stage 6- 2 targets about 4-5 feet apart. On command, start at 50 feet and walk towards the targets. Draw your weapon and verbally identify yourself as a Police Officer. Keep walking towards the targets, telling them what you want them to do ("Drop your weapon!", or "Get on the ground!" or something similar). On command (about 20 feet), fire 2 rds into each target. After the 4th round, immediately reload while comtinuing forwards. On command, start walking backward away from the targets and engage each target with 2 rds. Time limit 15 seconds.

Stage 7- 2 targets about 4-5 feet apart. 2 small barricades (simulated cover) on each side of the range (about 30 feet apart) about 15 feet away from the targets and on a line parallel to them. Start at the left barricade. On command, walk to the right and engage each target with 2 rds. Upon reaching the opposite barricade, immediately reload. Then, walk back to the left and engage each target with 2 rds while moving back to the other barricade. Time limit 15 seconds.

That's it. Not too difficult. Anyone who can pass any of the state CCW courses I've ever seen should be able to pass this without any trouble. The sad thing is, we keep having guys who have to reshoot various stages, mostly the 50' stage. It's pitiful, but no one wants to go out and practice without being paid and having their ammo provided, and with the latest budget crunches, that ain't happening.

Bub
 
State LEO

We start with the duty load at the 25 yard line: 2 standing, 2 kneeling, 2 prone.

Walk toward the 15, stop & fire 2 rounds. At the 15, we fire, including a tactical reload and weak hand shooting. Generally, we holster between targets.

Walk toward the 5 yard line, stop & fire 2 rounds. More firing, a combat reload, then close combat shooting.

Finally, combat reload with the mag from the earlier tactical reload, holstering a loaded pistol with the last round chambered.

Passing grade is 70%. Exposures are timed.

It's a pretty good course that drills all the basics.
 
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