Lee Loadmaster or Dillon Square Deal B?

[bryco32]

The changeover doesn't really seem to be all that complicated on the 650.

All my Lee goodies fit the tool heads. The Dillon powder measure seemed pretty easy to set up as well. I see guys are liking the Lee auto drum and are able to use it on the 650. Definitely would be cheaper to get a few of them than a few Dillon powder drops.

Them things are crazy expensive.

 

[DEMOLITION MAN]

Unclenick, I mainly used the rock chucker and classic turret prior to the LM. Once you get it dialed in, and it does require learning curve, you'll never want to go back.
I also use the auto drum powder measure and it's great. No chain needed to drop the charge.
I think what you said about mechanical ability matters a lot. But most guys that reload usually are.
Issues with the LM are the priming system, index bar adjustment, keeping tool head tight, case feed with 223, pistol is no problem. Oh, and no half stroke, always full stroke the lever.
Watch some videos of the ones that know what they're doing, and you can crank some rounds out.
I did try some S&B primers from Cabela's, not good, stick with the CCI. I also had tight shell plate problem with 223 LC brass, had to grind them a little too fit looser. Or you can use the 9 mm plate, worked ok for me.

 

[kmw1954]

jmorris I believe I'm in the same camp as you. I'm color blind. No brand loyalties. I look for tools that fill my needs, I read reviews and comments. I try to be informed of the upside and downfalls of things I'm looking to purchase. I understand limitations. I would never expect to form cases with a Lee C press just as I wouldn't expect to drive tacks with a 3# mall.

bryco32 I have a Lee Auto Drum and I'm not happy with it. Used it for a few days doing drop tests at different volumes and it was very accurate. Took it apart to clean and soon had a malfunction where if would not cycle. The funnel/flare tube was stuck. Now it leaks and won't hold consistent charges.

It will be going back and I will try one more. From there I'll see what happens. I haven't given up on the product yet.

 

[KEYBEAR]

I only buy a press to load my ammo the press is not my hobby for me reloading is not working on them .
The loadmaster was very very disappointing .

Just to make it fair I did send a Dillion back (really)
I bought the first Dillion shot shell loader think it was a 900 ? ( don,t remember) Dillion came out with that way to soon it was not ready not even close .

 

[David R]

I posted earlier in this thread I had one of the first loadmasters. I couldn't believe it, $219 for a progressive press! I saved and ordered it. Had lots of trouble working it. It seemed to go out of time.

I called LEE Precision to see what they could do to help me. I talked to a gentleman for over 20 minutes. One suggestion was to add a sizing die to one of the stations to help keep it in time. The guy was nice as can be. I told him reloading was supposed to be relaxing, not frustrating. We discussed the press a lot and I really wanted it to work. I was trying to do 500 rounds per hour like they claimed. He told me the slower I go the faster I will reload shells. He also asked me to send it back for some upgrades. It seems they had to knurl the top of the ram so the toolhead would not turn on it. (go out of time)

After the call was done, I said by the way who am I talking to? He said Richard. I said Richard who. He said LEE. I was impressed.

I still has lots of problems with it. One time of MANY a 45 had no primer, so I put it back in the press. It went off when I pressed in the new primer. The bullet exited in a hurry and left a dimple in the ceiling of the basement in the shape of a tumble lube 45 sideways. The case opened up, nothing was hurt, just a loud BANG.

My Dad had an early pro 1000. We had a few chain reactions of primers going off up the little track they rode in. Then we only used CCI. Small primers were a pain in the butt in both presses. Thgey went in sideway, upside down, or not at all. A through inspection was needed after all were done.
I have my dads pro 1000 in the garage. I do not use it. I now have a blue press with zero problems.

David

 

[StripesDude]

Here are Some of the things I've found with my Loadmaster that I've seen people struggle with:

Spent primers drop into the ram. The bolt that holds the trap door to empty them also tightens the carrier. If you loosen it too much when emptying primers, the carrier can need readjusted.

The chain that comes with the powder measure can be eliminated by using the auto drum. The auto drum is a great upgrade.

Lube the case feed slider, and keep the rod square to the carrier arm that the case feed slider rides on.

Primer brand does not matter any more than in other press brands. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise.

Lubed pistol cases allow for smoother operating, but this is the case with any progressive.

Keep the primer trough full to at minimum just below the primer tray. And you can soften the corners of the primer tray to allow them to slide better. The tray can hold around 200 or so small primers, and about 120 large. Keep an eye on it as you can get cranking so fast you'll empty it in ten minutes or so.

If you get the case collator, for 9mm or smaller cases it can help to put some small pieces of clear tube in the collator holes so that all cases go down base first. Not necessary, but it helps.

 

[KEYBEAR]

StripesDude I am sure you have helped some people load on the Loadmaster And they thank you for sure .

As for myself I will just set down with my Dillion and just start loading .
I will not need a list of things to do like only have brown socks on .

 

[kmw1954]

WoW, nice stories, thanks for sharing.

 

[jmorris]

Definitely would be cheaper to get a few of them than a few Dillon powder drops.

With the Dillon's just preset the powder bars and have different powder dies already preset in the tool heads. It only takes backing out 2 screws to swap the measure from one tool head to another and loosen a 3rd to swap the (less than $15) powder bar. Also they come with two powder bars, large and small from Dillon.

Also the powder check die comes with 3 arbors too. If you get a few extra V notched parts and dies, you can move it around too.

Will burn up another minute of your time but if you don't change them out often, can save you $100 and it still leaves everything set where is was.

The bolt that holds the trap door to empty them also tightens the carrier. If you loosen it too much when emptying primers, the carrier can need readjusted.

The chain that comes with the powder measure can be eliminated by using the auto drum. The auto drum is a great upgrade.

The bolt and carrier adjustment is likely the #1 issue with the LM. If you have it right it will work. One "bump" either direction and you have something that's just going to frustrate you. Tighten down "on top" of a "bump" where you think it should be and it will move away from the right spot not towards it.

That said its like riding a bike, once you "get it right", well, you know how to get it right.

The chain on the auto disk is a safety device that requires the ram to move below the point of indexing before it will reset the measure. So if you make a partial stroke, like going down slightly then back up, you cannot double charge a case. You can eliminate the chain and install a spring but you must ensure you do nothing except full and complete strokes.

Not unlike the old Dillon linkages that were spring return.

Vs the new one that prevents short stroke double charges.

 

[Unclenick]

The only mod I've made to a Dillon myself is I turned and bored my own powder drop/actuator tube. I wanted the Lyman M style neck flare with a step in it. I learned later that Dillon offered that option at one time, but dropped it. Probably because the step has a tendency to grab a little at the brass, so it doesn't feel quite as smooth, but treating it with Moly Fusion fixed that. I also didn't yet have a toolpost grinder for the lathe at that time, and now I might just put a step in the provided tube that way.

The difference is the bullet sitting upright in that step starts in straighter. With the original on my Square Deal I'd get a number of rounds where the bullet base position bulged only one side of the case due to bullet tilt. With the step I never see that. The base is always mirrored all the way around. It isn't always quite perfectly uniform because case wall thickness isn't always quite uniform, but it is way better.


Demolition Man,

Thanks for feeding back. It adds to everyone's knowledge base.

On the primers, when I got my Square Deal, which would have been the late 80's, it had a lot of trouble with CCI primers. That was before CCI revamped their assembly line and process ('92, IIRC). The old CCI primers had burrs on the edges of the cups and they all felt very hard to seat, and I got a lot of high primers from them where Federal, Remington, and Winchester would all slide right in. After the revamp, CCI burrs were gone and they started seating nicely and still do.

More recently, I've noticed Russian primers have burrs on their primers. I bought 10,000 Tula primers at one point because they produce such remarkably low velocity SD's, but the seating has been no fun. I generally have to run all brass, even new brass without crimps, through my Dillon primer pocket swager before the Tula primers will seat reasonably easily. But once you get them in place, they work well. I haven't tried the S&B's myself, but suspect that's what you are seeing with them.

 

[jmorris]

The only mod I've made to a Dillon myself is I turned and bored my own powder drop/actuator tube. I wanted the Lyman M style neck flare with a step in it. I learned later that Dillon offered that option at one time, but dropped it.

They are making (at least some of) them like that now. This is a current production .30 cal funnel/expander next to a "normal" one.

The expander on the 1050's also are like that but the funnel is completely different because it's just to flare the various calibers (pistol).

They also had a different design on their expander/flare funnels decades ago that had a grove turned into them but were no larger above the grove than below.