Large loop levers

U

Unlicensed Dremel

Moderator
What are they for, really?

Do they actually help anything in any way, really?

If the theory is that you can cycle with mittened hands, then you have no trigger finger, so that's out.

If the theory is that you can cycle with thick gloved hands, ok, maybe, but it will still be hard to get your thick-gloved trigger finger into the still-standard-sized trigger guard. I guess that's it then. Any real world experience using thick gloves from members here, versus a regular loop with same gloves?

For thin to medium gloves, the regular loop works fine.

And most importantly, it's easier and more "sure" to cycle with a standard / small loop, because there's a lot less "take up time" before the back of hand engages and begins actuating the lever. That gives a large loop a disadvantage with a bare hand or thinly-gloved hand.

Thanks.
 
What are they for, really?
Click to expand...

Large and/or gloved hands.

I find that they are also much more comfortable to manipulate.

BEFORE:
45-70.before.jpg


AFTER:
Enhanced-Guide-Gun_EGG.jpg
 
I don't think that's what most people think of when they think of large loop levers. IMO they're for aesthetics or for people that want to emulate John Wayne or the Rifleman. Personally I think they're butt ugly.
 
As said above, for better manipulation. The tear drop shaped ones (biiig loop) are just ugly. Like the ones on those Mare Legs. I like my loops compact and close to the stock as possible and still being easy to manipulate.
 
Hollywood.(The big loop)
In some old westerns ,holding the rifle muzzle up,by one hand around the wrist of the stock,fingers through the lever,the hand would be punched forward,racking the lever open.The muzzle was then allowed to fall back,sweeping under the armpit.The whole rifle did a 360 deg twirl around the fingers inside the lever,coming up loaded,cocked and locked,and pointed at the bad guy.

Drama.

IMO,this maneuver does not score well for safety and responsibility.Its about chambering a round while the rifle is not securely held,sweeping 360 degrees,and subject to being dropped.

Not everything you see in the movies is a good idea.
I don't know of any other reason for the big round loop
 
I have no clue but if I ever get a large loop I would hope to have the rifleman modification operated on tv by Chuck Connors.

23795trigger_screw.jpg


I have a winchester 94 that was made in the early 40's that would be a good candidate for it.
 
Blindstitch,that Rifleman screw on the trigger idea is an accident that WILL happen.
Respectfully,no offense intended..the Uzi accident is really enough bad press,don't you think?

I suggest a 1940's Win 94 is worth a lot of money,unmodified.

You get to do whatever makes you happy.....I think it would be regrettable.
 
I didn't think of the cartoonish Hollywood size loop levers, I was thinking of the practical application...
 
There is no practical application of a large loop like the one "The Rifleman" used.

It's all a case of "Emperors New Cloths" and a gullible public willing to buy things to be special.
 
The Rifleman's loop is hideous

That pin that trips the trigger when cycling the action is about the stupidest thing Hollywood ever came up with.
I can understand a larger loop, within reason.
 
There are various sizes & configurations of large loops.

The smaller ones allow larger hands or gloves to fit better.

The Hollywood versions from John Wayne & Chuck Connors were designed strictly for the visual effect of spincocking.

They create more room for any hand, but can slow down repeat firing because there's a lot of room for a hand to bounce around inside the loop.

That said, I have a 16-inch Win '94 that came as a standard Trapper Model.
I stuck the elongated Wayne version on it years ago, I'm one who likes the Hollywood look. :)

Couple years ago, to try to get it to fit in a scabbard to mount in the ATV, I swapped it back to the original lever.

This gun is an Angle Eject model, with rebounding hammer.

The rebounding hammer guns require more effort to cycle because of their alterations from Browning's design.

I immediately noticed how much more effort it took with that standard lever, and a few minutes later put the Wayne loop back on.

It is slightly longer & creates better leverage, cycles the gun easier & smoother, for me.
I don't need to run that gun fast, but I've worked out a different placement of the hand & I can shoot it fast enough, should I ever need to.

There is an actual benefit, for me.

A side note is that, while an unmodified Model 92 copy will dump dummy rounds on the floor at my feet in spincocking, the '94 in .30-30 will actually feed & function perfectly while doing that.

Not something to do regularly, but an alternative method of emergency one-handed use should my left hand or arm be unavailable due to injury in the wilds.
Not something I recommend, just something I mention.

The large loop lever was purely a Hollywood affectation initially, but for me it actually benefits that short .30-30.

My 1951 '94 in pre-rebound form wouldn't gain anything, it's been easy to run since it left the factory.
In certain applications, the big loop does have value, but not across the board.

Have a big loop '92 coming from Winchester/Browning, looking forward to seeing how that works.
The last one I had here had a stiffer action with its rebounding hammer than a Rossi version without, I expect the same cycling benefit with the big loop on this pistol-calibered Winchester.
We'll see. :)
Denis
 
The pin hits the trigger on closing the lever. No need to pull the trigger as a separate action to fire the rifle. Lots of the cap gun Winchester toys in the 1960's had a swiveling flange you could rotate to place it under the trigger. You got rapid fire out of your cowboy rifle, quite useful when the entire Apache nation charged your wagon train.
 
Mo,
Short history on the Rifleman's 92.

The TV show's producers in the late 1950s were looking for a gimmick that'd set the new show apart from the dozen or so other TV westerns of the day.

The show was built around that Winchester.
The "hook" was the different gun & its use by the hero, Lucas McCain (Chuck Connors).

He had to fire the gun rapidly.
Two-part element of the show:
Good guy overcoming evil in each episode, and generally an action sequence with him using the rifle.

Connors was a natural athlete & fully ambidextrous.
He practiced with that rifle until he could actually empty it in a helluva hurry as it was in factory form, either arm.
Producers were concerned that he might damage his trigger finger during shooting & delay production schedules, so they had the gun modified in two additional areas, besides the large lever.

One modification was the set-screw you see in the photo posted above.
When turned in, it replaced a finger in tripping the trigger each time the lever was closed. The gun could be fired as fast as its operator could run the lever.

When backed out, it allowed the gun to be fired normally, by a finger, without automatically firing every time the lever was closed.

Each action scene was set up for one or the other screw position.
Each time the gun needed to be fired rapidly for more than one shot, the screw was in.
Each time it only required one shot, the screw was out.

The other modification was a plunger set into the top rear of the frame above the chamber.
Without that, 5-In-One blanks would just fall out during the spincocking sequences.

The set-screw in real life allows firing a gun with one rapidly, but the accident waiting to happen part lies in the fact that if screwed in, it'll trip the trigger any time the lever's closed.

You have to remember that if you don't empty the gun completely in a rapid-fire string & stop halfway through.
You forget & subsequently cycle the lever with the screw still in, intending to shoot normally, the gun will fire when the lever closes.
If you don't have the muzzle in a safe direction....
Denis
 
Good.
Besides that, the entire Itahaca Nation would protest.
The tribe would never allow themselves to be associated, even in name only, with such an idea.
Bad mojo.
Denis
 
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