Kimber. Overpriced?

TunnelRat said:
Wait, based on that last sentence, are you saying this is based off of total sales figures, and that Kimber sells more firearms than any other manufacturer? Even compared to S&W, Ruger, etc.?

Edit: Looking at the 2019 Annual Firearms Manufacturingand Export Report (hosted by the ATF here: https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/docs/report/2019-annual-firearms-manufacturers-and-export-report-afmer/download), I see the following

Pistols Manufactured in 2019 (all rows)
Kimber: 150,941
SIG Sauer: 692,326
Ruger: 536,426
S&W: 520,888
Colt: 29,022

Maybe Kimber does produce more 1911s than the others combined in sheer counts, as there is no breakdown of model (I'm aware there are also many other manufacturers of 1911s, and dedicated at that, I was looking for large volume producers, if someone wants to dive deeper be my guest). Worth noting, I couldn't find Springfield Armory in the report. I'm not sure if that's because they're privately held or what, but that would be interesting to know as many if not most of their pistols are likely 1911 style pistols.

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I was not clear, Kimber makes the most 1911s.

The BATF numbers are broken out by revolver, pistol, etc. and caliber (9mm, "to .50").

Kimber was all 1911-design pistols until they introduced a striker fired 9mm. Just talking pistols.

Kimber moved their manufacturing from New York to Alabama. I don't believe they are back up to full capacity.
 
totaldla said:
I was not clear, Kimber makes the most 1911s.

The BATF numbers are broken out by revolver, pistol, etc. and caliber (9mm, "to .50").

Kimber was all 1911-design pistols until they introduced a striker fired 9mm. Just talking pistols.

Kimber moved their manufacturing from New York to Alabama. I don't believe they are back up to full capacity.
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Got it. I will admit I was surprised by the production figures of Kimber.

As a note since my previous post might be a bit unclear, the BATFE breaks it down to manufacturers in each state. That means for a given manufacturer you have to search the rows for each firearm type in the event a manufacturer produces in multiple states and has multiple entries. That’s what I attempted to do in my post, and why I had “all rows” specified.


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totaldla said:
I was not clear, Kimber makes the most 1911s.
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You still haven't provided any support for your assertion that they make more than all others combined. In 2019 Kimber made 68,811 pistols in the 45 ACP category.
Colt made 20,000+,
Ruger made 18,000,
Magnum research had 8,000,
S&W lists 66,000 (most probably not 1911's but some certainly are),
Remington knocked out almost 17,000,
Sig was at 37,000,
American Tactical Inc somehow produced 28,000.

Other than S&W most of those are 1911s. I left out lots of manufactures with a few thousand listed.
 
totaldla said:
I was not clear, Kimber makes the most 1911s.
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But that's not what you wrote, and that's not what I questioned.

totaldla said:
The BATF numbers are broken out by revolver, pistol, etc. and caliber (9mm, "to .50").
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Correct -- but not broken down to model types.

Kimber was all 1911-design pistols until they introduced a striker fired 9mm.
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This is incorrect. The Micro 380 was introduced many years ago, and the Micro 9 not long after. Both are hammer-fired with conventional firing pins, and neither is a 1911.
 
reddog81 said:
You still haven't provided any support for your assertion that they make more than all others combined. In 2019 Kimber made 68,811 pistols in the 45 ACP category.
Colt made 20,000+,
Ruger made 18,000,
Magnum research had 8,000,
S&W lists 66,000 (most probably not 1911's but some certainly are),
Remington knocked out almost 17,000,
Sig was at 37,000,
American Tactical Inc somehow produced 28,000.

Other than S&W most of those are 1911s. I left out lots of manufactures with a few thousand listed.
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As a point, there are 1911 style pistols in calibers other than 45 ACP, though I guess we can debate whether those are actual 1911s.

For SIG some of those pistols are likely P220s.

I’m also not sure how pistols that are often eventually fitted with braces fall into these production numbers for pistols. According to the ATF they are still pistols, so do those numbers show up here? In that case they will skew numbers as some manufacturers make quite a few of those.


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Let's be honest and understand that "marketing" sells a lot of guns...

Is Kimber overpriced - No, not if they are still selling a lot of guns ( and they are ).

Is it the best "value" - you have to answer that with your own budget ...( for me no )...

Is Kimber one of the top 5 mfg's of 1911's - in my opinion no ....( but in my view the top 2 mfg's are clearly Wilson Combat and Ed Brown ...and then the rest of the top 10 gets a little muddy ...)...

Bottom line buy what you can afford - and what you like. I have a couple of Kimbers...are they the best guns in my safe - no ...are they terrible no ( but I have had most of the internals in both guns replaced with parts from Wilson Combat ...to make them run and have better triggers - which are both key issues in my view.
 
You most likely have to do these things or something at least to any sub 1000.00 pistol.

I see similar comments on gun forms quite a bit. I personally own 13 1911 style pistols, and all of them except possibly one (a Colt) cost less than $1000 new. I have a Taurus that you really have to grip hard to make sure the grip safety is depressed and one of my Springfield Armory 1911's had a stove-piping issue that they quickly addressed. Other than these two relatively minor hiccups, they all shoot well and dependably, including my Kimber Ultra Carry II in 45 ACP.

I'm in the process of trading a mint black Colt 1911 A1 for a mint Kimber Raptor II, both in 45 ACP. Disappointed to hear Kimber only warranties original owners, but I'm still considering the trade. (I will keep one Colt in my collection).

Have I been lucky or am I just not that picky when it comes to gun performance?
 
I have Kimbers in .45 and 10mm. Both run great - haven't had the issues that people like to cite. I don't know why gun people need to run down other makers...if people are happy with their guns, why is there a need to chime in with "my buddy had a XXX and it was a jam-o-matic". Sounds a lot like Chevy & Ford owners who think the other make is a piece of crap.....come on, guys!
 
You most likely have to do these things or something at least to any sub-$1000.00 [1911] pistol.
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There, ... I just helped you say the quiet, embarrassing part out loud.

Finicky, hicuppy, sub-$1K 1911s are why Glocks exist. A lot less $$$ invested for a near-100% reliability return across all models and chamberings.

* * * I'm in the process of trading a mint black Colt 1911 A1 for a mint Kimber Raptor II, both in 45 ACP. Disappointed to hear Kimber only warranties original owners, but I'm still considering the trade. (I will keep one Colt in my collection).
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:eek: No, just no. Keep all your Colts.

Have I been lucky or am I just not that picky when it comes to gun performance?
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If you're trading away Colts for Kimbers, I've got a heck of a used car deal for ya ... :eek:

:rolleyes:
 
I don’t find Kimber to be overpriced. The quality I have seen with their pistols is very good for the prices I’ve paid. My full sized Stainless II was $900 back in 2009, and it was skin and bone stock. But just a tiny bit of break in needed. Fit and finish were superior, easily worth twice the money in my eyes. Then the Officer’s model was $650, lightly used, like less than a box of rounds through it.

I would do it all over again, hands down. Just my $0.02.
 
Kimber. Overpriced?
Cheap is expensive.
Have .45 ACP Kimber stainless II and Custom II. Both came out of the box and started dropping dimes, center target, 7 yards. Broke them in at about 400 rds. Then starts the conversation: "They are overpriced.""I could have bought 2 (fill in the blank with ur favorite manufacturer)."
Any thoughts?
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Yes, my thoughts are simple on this. Any gun on any given day be it new or used is worth what someone is willing to pay for it, no more and certainly no less. The very two best 1911 .45 ACP pistols are the one I just sold ad the one I just bought.

All that really matters is if you are happy with your guns. My own personal view of your choice in guns matters not. We know what can be said about opinions anyway.

The 1911 design much like the AR15 design is currently being marketed by countless manufactures. Some very good while some leave quality to be desired. You can put lipstick on a pig but ... you get the idea. However, if you are happy with your pig that's all that matters.

Enjoy your guns...
Ron
 
I have around 15k rounds through my Kimber Custom II. It has never so much as hiccuped. It eats ball and hollow points just the same. The only think I really didi was throw away the trash magazine that Kimber sends out. There is a lot of Kimber hate on the inter webs. If you like it, shoot it. If not, sell it and move on.
 
Common Sense Buying and won't "bash" on price.

If I want it and the price is right; I buy it.
If I don't like or want it; I leave it for someone else.
If I really don't want it and can steal it; I buy it.

Regardless I never look back or live with regrets. ..... ;)
I have made money selling or broke even but so far I have never lost money. .. ;)

Be Safe !!!
 
Pahoo said:
If I want it and the price is right; I buy it.
If I don't like or want it; I leave it for someone else.
If I really don't want it and can steal it; I buy it.

Regardless I never look back or live with regrets. ..... ;)
I have made money selling or broke even but so far I have never lost money. .. ;)

Be Safe !!!
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So much this!!!
 
IF you like them PAY NO ATTENTION to others.........I have 2 for about 20 years. A Custom Classic and a commander sized CQB. No problems with either..........Personally I never care or worry about other people's opinions of my guns........Never second guess yourself!
 
Kimber. Overpriced?

Guns are a lot like pianos. If they play well, who cares what you paid for it?
Guns also last a long time, and inflation will be with us forever. If you are
happy with it, why worry about what someone else thinks or says?
 
I say yes. I've had my share of Kimbers and the only real difference between the cheaper ones and the pricier ones was finish and sights. I don't think Kimbers are "bad" but they are definitely overpriced considering the amount of mediocrity and MIM parts you get. In the sub $1K range, Ruger and Springfield are better options and better made. Never spend over $1k on a Kimber because for that coin you can get considerably nicer 1911's. This seems harsh, but Kimbers are 1911's for guys that really don't know anything about 1911's who are easily sold by pretty pictures and cleaver advertising, like how they call their full size a "custom" when there's not one thing custom about it. It's like spending $20 on a dollar menu burger when you could have a decent steak.
 
I understand it's fun for the Kool kids to bash those Kimber/MIMbers. I never liked the "idea" of how MIM parts are made, or having them in my guns. But FWIW, I've never had a MIM part crack, break, deform or crumble on any Kimber, SIG, Springfield or S&W I've ever owned. I'll shout it out to the internet as soon as a MIM parts breaks. After all, I want to be Kool too;)
 
rock185 said:
I understand it's fun for the Kool kids to bash those Kimber/MIMbers. I never liked the "idea" of how MIM parts are made, or having them in my guns. But FWIW, I've never had a MIM part crack, break, deform or crumble on any Kimber, SIG, Springfield or S&W I've ever owned. I'll shout it out to the internet as soon as a MIM parts breaks. After all, I want to be Kool too;)
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They really are not the Kool Kids. :D So I agree with all of that except your last sentence.

I have broken a few MIM parts actually. Just broke one last Saturday. But I don't ever take one gun to the range, and when I got home, swapped out a tool steel part in about 10 minutes. But most of the MIM parts are going to outlast their owner and whoever ends up with them after the original purchaser as well.

And my 3" Kimber still is running perfect.
 
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