Unlicensed Dremel
Moderator
OK, I'm needing to raise money (laid off). Putting together a list of guns I could sell (among other things).
This particular choice involves two CZ 527s: An EEE in .223 rem, and a customized Varmint in .17 Hornet (threaded, shortened to 20").
I'm *definitely* keeping the .223 rem EEE - the question is whether I'll be sorry if I sell the .17 hornet, or not... is there so much overlap that I wouldn't miss it?
Not a big varminter historically, though would like to do some (and still can of course, even without the .17 H).
This .17 H has given me some 2/3rds MOA groups with factory ammo (5 shot), BUT usually not. Usually it's 4 shots in about 2/3rds to 3/4ths MOA, then ONE flier a good 1.25 to 1.5" from that group....or occasionally, a terrible (inexplicable) 3 MOA group. I can't figure it out; why it does this. Of course, it's probably me / parallax error, not the rifle or ammo, most likely, but it MIGHT be inconsistent ammo, I suppose. I'd rather NOT reload this particular chambering, though I could. I was hoping to get consistent 3/4ths to 1 MOA from the Hornady factory 20s.
My raison d'etre for the .17 hornet is: pond turtles, p-dogs, and crows, particularly here in my semi-rural setting where I can put a can on it... but also just fun range shooting and "newbie induction" into shooting rifles. Although I haven't hunted crows in about 11 years, and there's no ponds right here on this place (10 acres with neighbors all around).
Though it would also be nice to simply target shoot with it around here in the wooded area - how quiet is .17 hornet with a can, actually? Would it sound like a .22lr, or even less than that, I'm guessing? I've shot .223 with a can, but not this one (yet) with a can. Seems to me that the .223 rem (or 5.56x45) sounds roughly like a hyper-vel .22lr, with good can, no?
My EEE in .223 is NOT threaded -- and with that beautiful twisted barrel, I don't think I'd want to. But supposing I did anyway, to create an apples to apples situation, my questions would become...
1. For the Newbie Induction purpose, is there any material advantage in the area of "less recoil" perceived to the newbie shooter of the .17 hornet vs. the .223 rem? Or any other real advantage to hooking a newbie on guns with the .17? [Yeah, yeah, I know - I ALWAYS put the newbies on at least 3 different .22lrs, and ONLY .22lrs - and stay at 25 yards.... EXCEPT at the end of their 1st session, or during their 2nd session, I like to put them on a .17 Hummer or this .17 Hornet, and let 'em stretch to 50 or 75 yards with some fruit. And no, I no longer have a .17 hummer, so that is not a substitute option either].
2. For the "target shooting suppressed round the house" purpose, is the .17 hornet suppressed any quieter (in a noticeable way) than .223 rem suppressed, given same suppressor, when neighbors range from 200 to 800 yards, but at least 4 houses within 400 yards? It's legal to shoot here, but good neighbors and all that, ya know...
3. Is there materially less barrel heating from shooting p-dogs - a lot of rounds, with .17 hornet vs. 223 rem? I noticed that in 34 F weather, the .17 H really doesn't get hot to the touch, no matter how much you shoot it. This could come in handy with high-volume varmints in 80 F weather, relative to .223 rem. May go prairie dogging someday (that's not too far away now), but doubtful it'd be more than 2 or 3 times in my life.
As for the rest - turtles and crows, the .223 is equal for all intents and purposes. Except for the fact that I was going to dedicate the 20s in the .17 H to turtles, crows, p-dogs, and dedicate a 55 to 62 grainer in .223 for yotes, beavers, etc., but I'm sure I could find a 55-ish load that is a pretty good laser with explosiveness, AND perfectly adequate for yotes and beavers; thus fulfilling my "find one load for each rifle, for all of its purposes, and stick with it" MO.
So that last observation mostly answers my question - makes me lean toward selling it. But I could get by keeping it if it's going to make newbies smile more, or if it's significantly quieter (more neighborly) with a can with 200-400 yard neighbors, vs. the .223 rem.
What say you wise gents and ladies? Thanks.
This particular choice involves two CZ 527s: An EEE in .223 rem, and a customized Varmint in .17 Hornet (threaded, shortened to 20").
I'm *definitely* keeping the .223 rem EEE - the question is whether I'll be sorry if I sell the .17 hornet, or not... is there so much overlap that I wouldn't miss it?
Not a big varminter historically, though would like to do some (and still can of course, even without the .17 H).
This .17 H has given me some 2/3rds MOA groups with factory ammo (5 shot), BUT usually not. Usually it's 4 shots in about 2/3rds to 3/4ths MOA, then ONE flier a good 1.25 to 1.5" from that group....or occasionally, a terrible (inexplicable) 3 MOA group. I can't figure it out; why it does this. Of course, it's probably me / parallax error, not the rifle or ammo, most likely, but it MIGHT be inconsistent ammo, I suppose. I'd rather NOT reload this particular chambering, though I could. I was hoping to get consistent 3/4ths to 1 MOA from the Hornady factory 20s.
My raison d'etre for the .17 hornet is: pond turtles, p-dogs, and crows, particularly here in my semi-rural setting where I can put a can on it... but also just fun range shooting and "newbie induction" into shooting rifles. Although I haven't hunted crows in about 11 years, and there's no ponds right here on this place (10 acres with neighbors all around).
Though it would also be nice to simply target shoot with it around here in the wooded area - how quiet is .17 hornet with a can, actually? Would it sound like a .22lr, or even less than that, I'm guessing? I've shot .223 with a can, but not this one (yet) with a can. Seems to me that the .223 rem (or 5.56x45) sounds roughly like a hyper-vel .22lr, with good can, no?
My EEE in .223 is NOT threaded -- and with that beautiful twisted barrel, I don't think I'd want to. But supposing I did anyway, to create an apples to apples situation, my questions would become...
1. For the Newbie Induction purpose, is there any material advantage in the area of "less recoil" perceived to the newbie shooter of the .17 hornet vs. the .223 rem? Or any other real advantage to hooking a newbie on guns with the .17? [Yeah, yeah, I know - I ALWAYS put the newbies on at least 3 different .22lrs, and ONLY .22lrs - and stay at 25 yards.... EXCEPT at the end of their 1st session, or during their 2nd session, I like to put them on a .17 Hummer or this .17 Hornet, and let 'em stretch to 50 or 75 yards with some fruit. And no, I no longer have a .17 hummer, so that is not a substitute option either].
2. For the "target shooting suppressed round the house" purpose, is the .17 hornet suppressed any quieter (in a noticeable way) than .223 rem suppressed, given same suppressor, when neighbors range from 200 to 800 yards, but at least 4 houses within 400 yards? It's legal to shoot here, but good neighbors and all that, ya know...
3. Is there materially less barrel heating from shooting p-dogs - a lot of rounds, with .17 hornet vs. 223 rem? I noticed that in 34 F weather, the .17 H really doesn't get hot to the touch, no matter how much you shoot it. This could come in handy with high-volume varmints in 80 F weather, relative to .223 rem. May go prairie dogging someday (that's not too far away now), but doubtful it'd be more than 2 or 3 times in my life.
As for the rest - turtles and crows, the .223 is equal for all intents and purposes. Except for the fact that I was going to dedicate the 20s in the .17 H to turtles, crows, p-dogs, and dedicate a 55 to 62 grainer in .223 for yotes, beavers, etc., but I'm sure I could find a 55-ish load that is a pretty good laser with explosiveness, AND perfectly adequate for yotes and beavers; thus fulfilling my "find one load for each rifle, for all of its purposes, and stick with it" MO.
So that last observation mostly answers my question - makes me lean toward selling it. But I could get by keeping it if it's going to make newbies smile more, or if it's significantly quieter (more neighborly) with a can with 200-400 yard neighbors, vs. the .223 rem.
What say you wise gents and ladies? Thanks.
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