JHP-FMJ and coming trends

M

mordis

New member
Well, as i write this, a bill i before the congress-hr45- that will add a 400% tax to all firearm and ammo sales. Now, before i get anyone ****** at me, i now that JHP is better and safer for home defense and is what i would prefere to get.

ON the radio the other day, the talk show host was talking about this and said that we need to stock up on our ammo so the new tax wont hurt us to much. Stocking up on suitable self defense ammo is a difficult thing. Most JHP's cost alot more then the fmj of similar grain weight. I feel that i need to stock up on something and am unsure what direction i should start with.

So i am considering buying a few thousand rounds of fmj in all the calibers i own, being .38spc and .45acp. Seeing as both me and my wife have small incomes, i cant afford to go out and buy a couple hundred of my chosen calibers in jhp. Currently tho the fmj flavors are very inexpensive and i am able to buy them in great quantity. I know they wont have the same knock down percentage as jhp but anything is better then nothing.

Sure i plan on getting a few boxes of jhp's but i wont be able to keep them in the kind of quanitities as i can fjm.

So this is a practicle discussion about stocking up on ammo and what kind to get before this law takes effect. So my question is, how should i and others like me, stock up and if push comes to shove am i at a great disadvantage with fmj vs jhp in the situation above??

I know that from time to time the fmj vs jhp debate pops up, and suprisingly there are a few here that still use fmj for self defense. So how should i handle this??

I hope the discussion i know will follow helps others in the same situation and those looking to stock up.
 
Do a simple search - old news. This same bill seems to get put forth every year, and every year it dies in committee.
 
First off, there hasn't been any activity on H.R. 45 since it was introduced and it still has no co-sponsors. Chances are, it'll die in comittee, so there's no reason to panic about it unless/untill something else happens with it. That aside, if it does look like it'll go through, your best bet would be to get into reloading (not a bad idea anyway) as both .38 Special and .45 ACP are quite easy to reload with inexpensive and pletiful components. If you still insist on stocking up on factory ammo, you might look into some LSWC ammo rather than FMJ as it's usually as cheap or cheaper and is usually considered to be a bit better for SD than FMJ. Of course, if you .45 is a semi-automatic, you may want to try a box or two of LSWC first to make sure it'll function OK before buying in bulk.
 
my .45 is a sa 1911 so ill give the lswc a try, but i assume having some kind of ammo on hand is better then nothing. I do have a little single stage press, but nothing extravagant. Im just worried that oneday ill walk into the store and see no hp ammo at all and be stuck with what i have on hand at home.
 
Ammo price have gone up from the past. Politics or no politics. So stock up . Either way you will be ahead. Example : I remember when 50bmg ammo was $1 a round. About 5 years latter one round is $5 or more ..so
1000 rds. $1000
now
1000 rds. $5000

give or take
 
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I do have a little single stage press, but nothing extravagant. Im just worried that oneday ill walk into the store and see no hp ammo at all and be stuck with what i have on hand at home.
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For the cost of 1000 rounds of each caliber, you could get a very nice progressive press that will pay for itself many times over.
 
This same bill seems to get put forth every year, and every year it dies in committee.
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This is not the same thing as a guarantee. As the terrorists say, "They have to be lucky every time; we only have to be lucky once."
 
I'm planning to get 500-1000 rounds of each centerfire caliber (5000 of .22lr) to store for a "rainy day"...probably FMJ (9mm) or SWC (.38/.357). Then buy up 100 rounds of SD ammo for each caliber for emergency use. Then stock up on reloading supplies to make my "plinkin' & practice" ammo for recreational use.

The big thing to worry about is how to store that much ammo. Make sure you have a climate-controlled area safe from the elements and theft. And make sure you have a good fire alarm & extinguishers nearby--bad place for a fire....
 
It's a terrible time to be thinking about stocking up. Prices are high and availability is low.

I would LOVE to be in the ammo business, it's one of the few markets where people put off buying until the prices rise and supply drops and then stop buying when the prices fall and supply is good. Most markets are just the reverse.
 
I know i could get a good progressive, but the main reason im stocking up is to have enough self defense ammo on hand JIC. At this point I am just going to be buying anything i can get my hands on. I will look for hollow points, first ofcourse, but will be buying all the fmj i can get. IF i remember correctly didnt the .45acp get its reputation for being a fight stopper with 230grain fmj?

I think im going to limit my buying to bulk purchases of remington express jhp and winchester usa jhp for starters, and what ever is economical in fmj.

I know reloading would be a awesome way to have a nearly inexhuastable supply of ammo, but you can not use it for self defense. Its a guarenteed jail sentance regardless of weather or not it was a good shoot or not.
Seeing as the main reason im stocking up is SD, that is a no no for me.
But i do plan on getting a 38/357, 9mm and a .45 mould.

Webleymkv you suggested i look into lswc for the .45acp, i dont see any ammo like that on winchesters or remingtons site?
 
My answer to the ammo shortage was a lead melting pot and learning to make my own hardcast .45ACP LRN and .38/.357 caliber LSWCHPs for my revolvers and Marlin 1894C. I have a hard time seeing how Congress will ever ban wheel weights and other source of lead and tin that are easy to acquire. I figured that making my own bullets on the sly might become a valuable ability.

Outrageous ammunition taxes or other fun and games like serial coding will be enough to make me fully embrace wheelguns, which are very viable self defense handguns.

Next step is getting more molds and making my own rifled slugs for shotgun reloading.:D
 
It's a terrible time to be thinking about stocking up. Prices are high and availability is low.

I would LOVE to be in the ammo business, it's one of the few markets where people put off buying until the prices rise and supply drops and then stop buying when the prices fall and supply is good. Most markets are just the reverse.
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So true. Fear and complacency seem to be two sides of the same coin.

I have never been a stockpiler. I have always bought just enough ammo to have two to four boxes each of 9mm and .30 carbine on hand in case of the EXTREMELY unlikely occurrence of a Katrina-like breakdown of police services. Other than that, I try to keep at least one unopened box of back-up ammo for all of my guns, in addition to any open boxes. As a rule, I don't keep a lot of FMJ ammo (except for my M1 Carbine, Lee-Enfield, and Nagant). I use that stuff at the range, and usually just buy it there when I go to shoot.

The one exception to my buying habits that I have recently made is this: I have started to buy the Federal 9BPLE at the rate of a couple of boxes every month, as it becomes available. I started buying it not out of fear, but because of the comparatively excellent prices I was finding on it, and found that it functioned well and shot accurately. When it became clear that I could afford to shoot more of it than I could my previous ammo (Winchester RA9TA-which costs about twice as much) I made it my carry ammo, and began buying more of it. It has a good reputation, and it seems beneficial to me to be able to spend as much time as you can practicing with your carry ammo.

One never knows what opportunities adversity can provide.
 
"They have to be lucky every time; we only have to be lucky once."
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Dear God, I hope it is not luck that is protecting us from terrorists. You would think that all the billions of dollars and tens of thousands of man-hours we have been pouring into antiterrorism initiatives are at least slightly better than luck! :)

I am firmly convinced that most people that are talking about ammo taxes and registering ammo are working for ammo companies. These types of legislation have repeatedly come up at the state and federal level and always die a quick death without ever getting into committee. The economy is in the toilet and a Senate and House full of Democrats can't pass legislation to save it, despite that fact that every governor in the country wants their hands on federal cash. There is no way the Democrats are taxing ammo or serializing it. But feel free to keep talking about ammo taxes because my father's gun store is making plenty of dough on your paranoia.

Me? I reload everything but the 6 rounds by my bedside table.
 
mordis said:
I know reloading would be a awesome way to have a nearly inexhuastable supply of ammo, but you can not use it for self defense. Its a guarenteed jail sentance regardless of weather or not it was a good shoot or not.
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Source, cites, examples?
 
I don't think a 400% tax will ever pass. First because it won't mean squat to the criminals who it is really meant to target. Second because it will devistate the game management programs in this country. The average box of rifle ammo is around $20 right now a 400 % tax would raise that to $100. I suspect we would loose 1/2 our hunters making most game management programs worthless and the loss of billions of dollars of associated revenue and jobs. It would also increase costs to and hurt our law enforcement and military. Not because of the tax, because they are exempt, but because of the closure of many ammo companies and their R&D. Low volume generally means increased cost.
 
Don h, i dont have accsess to it, but Mas Ayooob did a magazine article on using reloads for sd and in every case he cited the guy went to jail. I just cant risk that kind of thing. So if it means buying in bulk from midway then soo be it.
 
Exactly WHY would you need to stock up on self-defense JHP ammo? Buy 50-100 rounds and that's that. Spend the rest of your money on FMJ target ammo. Done. NEXT!
 
Personally, I am doing the reloading thing.

Yes, I'm reloading ammo that is being stockpiled for "social" purposes. No, I'm not even the least little bit concerned about Ayoob's assertion that the use of handloaded/reloaded ammo is a 1 way ticket to jail. Reasons: in the now, while there is some semblance of order, I'm armed with factory ammo. Hence, if I need to use my weapons now, his argument is moot, it doesn't apply. But, if the situation deteriorates such that I will need to break into the stockpile then it will have deteriorated to the point to where I'm not concerned about going to jail at all, or at least not regarding what kind of ammo I'm using. We'll be in a complete societal breakdown, there won't be any functional law enforcement to throw me in jail, and if there is they'll have their hands full enough with much more important matters (like restoring order) than inspecting my ammo. Or, we'll be in a state of insurrection, and if they manage to catch me alive they'll throw me in jail or a concentration camp or have me executed no matter what kind of ammo I happen to be using. Or, I'll be on their side shooting at the other side and I rather doubt that they'll care what kind of ammo I'm using. In any case, Ayoob's arguments are moot.

I say -- reload 'em to your heart's content. BTW -- once you are reloading, there's not a whole lot of difference between the cost of FMJ ammo and the cost of JHP ammo. Yes, the JHP bullets are more expensive but not a whole lot more. I figure that if I'm going to be making ammo I might as well make dual purpose ammo. Good for the range as well as good for social purposes.
 
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