It's 4 Am and your front door is smashed open....

A

Al Thompson

Staff Alumnus
And some Fedral Ninja runs in your place..

What do you do?

Part of the reason I'm asking this question is due to the number of 4473's that have my id on them. I'm sure that somewhere in the archives some program is just waiting to spit my name out when they press the "confiscate" button..

The other part is my impression that when they hit the front door, your options are now very limited..

I know that we have some LE and SOCOM types here. What would you guys do? (without compromising officer safety if some bad guy is reading these forums)

My game plan would be to bug out (I'm single) and put the fight on a more mobile footing. If I could read the tea leaves correctly, I would not be sleeping in the house at all..

Any thoughts?

Giz
 
Get a security system and sleep with the bedroom door locked...Otherwise, good guys or bad guys, you're screwed!

If your door comes down at 4AM and you are in deep sleep, you'll have company in the bedroom before you can even gain eye focus. If you have the door locked you might gain enough time to wake up and maybe even bug out through the window (not really a good idea if it's the fuzz).

Mikey
 
Yeah, unfortunately I sleep so soundly that I won't wake up until they have me handcuffed in the back of the squad car.

A ninja with an MP5 throws a flashbang through my front window, kicks in the door, busts into my locked bedroom, sticks his gun in my face and screams "POLICEDONTMOVE!"... and I slap the snooze button and roll over, mumbling to myself.
 
invest in a few dog's from the pound. i don't know about but i am up if the neighbor's dog bark's
 
gizmo,
The way I see it time is their (the home invader's) handicap, so you have to set your home up to give you the most time.......a good system would be a double security style system, its really not that expensive,......what I mean by double is a system that looks out from the house and one that looks toward the house( the one looking toward the house should not be obvious at all), it could include pressure sensitive plates on the entrance way....,invest in heavy duty metal frames for your doors and metal doors and there is a variety of locks that work,...there is a film you can get that you put over your windows and they cant be eaisly broken out, the film holds it together.(this film works in car windows too)....and last but not least a bug out hole and destinnation once out........there is a company in memphis that will build you a secure room in a closett, or a pantry or anyplace you can imagine....if you can get to the room and secure it, youve gained more time to effect what ever you will do......I know this is a little off topic, but Ive a friend who can actually access an old bomb shelter of the type they built in the 60's nuke scare, from his basement......the bottom line is how much do you want to spend?....In texas I used gravel, cactus around the windows and octollio in some areas as a barrier, had ironwork on all the windows and doors ( I had all the locks keyed to the same key, and use the locks with rvolving pin in the bolt), and two dobermans...I lived far out off of a highway and not far from mexico and because of the precautions and the dogs, there are people in my family alive today, one attmept was made and was unsucessful(there were 5 to 7 invaders)---had a neighbor not to far off who was a retired customs agent, once the yelling and the barking started he came and cut loose with a shotgun, good neghibor there....remember the 7P's...Proper Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance(borrowed from the seabees)..fubsy.
 
Security setups like those described above are always a good idea, but I wouldn't get too excited just yet. If a situation like this were to arise in this country, you will have plenty of warning months, if not years, in advance.

There will be at least a year of arguing and debating in congress until such legislation (banning & confiscation) is actually passed. Then there will probably be a 1 or 2 year "grace period" for citizens to comply. When they realize that they've only gotten 20% compliance, the grace period will most likely be extended another year.

If after all that they still decide to go ahead with "forceful confiscation" (after a year or two of supreme court debate over fourth amendment rights), then the logistics come in to play. There are several thousand Federal law enforcement agents... and there are 92.8 MILLION households in the United States (according to my 1991 almanac). You are on a very long list of people to visit!

If it actually gets that far (or they decide to bypass the legal steps all together) then this country will already be at war with itself. Alarm system or not, we'll all have plenty of time to make hot coffee and sandwiches and be up on the roof waiting.

Be concerned and be prepared, but I'd continue to sleep soundly for now. My humble (and possibly wrong) two cents.
 
JLR,
I'm very much with you on the ratio being in our favor, and not being overly reactionary, HOWEVER,
the very problem we're discussing is the completely arbitrary nature by which the ninja seem to apply their tactics. While the chances of receiving a "no-knock" warrant by misguided jerks that have decided that your exceedingly armed status makes you criminal is about as likely as getting struck by lightning, you would be foolish to stand in an open field with a metal hat in an electrical storm, too.

Take them seriously. Consider that a "no-knock" warrant can look a lot like a home invasion at 3:00 am. That stuff scares the heck out of me, and I'm supposed to be on their side... People are going to get hurt, if the current "assault team" attitude persists as it does in some locals.

One of the smartest things you can do is put a second barrier INSIDE the house. Make them take the time to introduce themselves. Then, GIVE it UP! Once they're in, you're tapped. The main thing is to keep from being charged with capital murder because you defended yourself. Think hard about this one, folks. You can't win a shoot-out.

If you do find yourself in a barricaded room, explain that you have EVERY intention of giving yourself up, at the arrival of your attorney. You won't beat the ride, but you'll stand a better chance of beating the rap. If the law allows them to bust in, they pretty much can do what they want, and you're in trouble if you don't throw yourself at their mercy. Thus, make it harder for them to bust in. Make them ask nicely.
 
Long Path,

Sorry, but I must respectfully disagree.

If *anyone* kicks in my door in the middle of the night, I'll come out shooting. Possession of a uniform and a badge DOES NOT give anyone arbitrary control over my life, especially in a situation like the one described.

I don't give a swut if they're the local Deputy Dawgs or Delta Force. They try to disarm me, they die. So will I, I realize, but that's OK.

Coinneach, feeling confrontational

------------------
"We are going to fight. We are going to be hurt.
But in the end, we will stand."
--Roland Deschain
 
Hope springs eternal, most of the LEO that I've been in contact with have said if they're required to go house to house to get guns, they're gonna be calling in sick as one said, "pretty dumb reason to get yourself killed". Anybody else talked to the LEO guys?
 
One of the reasons I specified Feds is due to the extreme lack of interest by the locals. I have never spoken to any cops that thought they would ever do search and seizures as described. Once their pension problems are explained to them, the story might change, but not likely. They have to live in the community.

The Feds are a different story. They incubate a "we vrs. them" mentality and seem to attract more than their fairshare of power mongers. If you'll note the lack of BATF/FBI office information in local directories, you'll start to see some of the problem. These folks are not part of the local LE community. No address, no accountability to the locally elected pols and usually no ability for local folks to interact with the leadership..

As for a nation rising of tensions, I disagree. I suspect as soon as someone in DC wants some high profile busts, one of us will be ID'ed as a "right wing militia" member with a bunch of guns and ammo. Don't forget that this PC your on can work two ways. I would not be surprised if the RWM "bustee" also becomes a pornographer or some thing. Strange things can appear on your hard drive at the touch of a button. Remember Randy Weaver and the alledged sawed off shotgun? Easy to do a little hacksaw work in the evidence room..

Giz

------------------
"Shoot low boys, they're riding Shetland ponies..." LG, RIP
 
I don’t remember the full story - I’ll have to rely upon a history buff. But here is the best I can recall:

During a war between Japan and China, a news reporter told a Chinese official
that for every Japanese they killed, they (Chinese) lost SEVEN.

The Chinese official pondered gravely for a bit, then brightened. “We lose seven for each
one they lose? Good! Soon, no more Japanese!”
--------
If the government is stupid enough to push
no-knock warrants on a grand scale, they will win most battles but (through
attrition) will lose the war.

We outnumber ‘em, guys. We just gotta stick together.
-------
How much better it would be simply to vote the rascals out or (plan B) by voting
for a non-traditional party (You know who!), convince the Republocrats to mend
their ways. Then physical force need never come into play.

Unfortunately, too many voters look for cures from the very ones who made them
sick.
 
If "they" want your guns, I sincerely doubt they'd come for them while they know you're at home with all those guns. It'd be like crawling into a mountain lions den to get his claws (yeah, you'll get 'em, teeth too).

For home security, lock the doors and windows real good, get a couple dogs and keep a loaded shotgun handy. Without spending a fortune, you can't get much more secure than that.

Coming into my home at 4:00 am will get whoever it is shot, a lot.
 
I would have to say that whatever comes in my house if they don't identify themselves then they will be shot. There is only one way they can get into my bedroom (no windows) is down a long dark hall with a light behind them. I can see them coming but they can't see me.

Have two dogs in the house. Both of which will wake me up before anyone even gets within 50 yards of the house. No, I'm not worried about a swat team breaking in. I'm prepared to die, but I can guarrantee you that I'll take out at least two with me.

If it is the local sherrif and he identifies himself, I will go without a fight. I know the man personally and know that he nor his department would be involved in confiscation.

Richard
 
I'm inclined to agree with JJR. Time is on our side. The way Gov drags its feet many years could pass between banning and actual confiscation. I have already celebrated 66 birthdays, so I ain't gonna worry too much about it.
 
"Soon, no more Japanese."!?!? ROTFLAO.

Seriously, I recall a case reported in the newspapers where a woman was awakened in the middle of the night by her door being kicked in, and when she heard steps approaching her bedroom she fired a 12-guage thru the door, killing one or two LEOs then surrendered when she saw the uniforms. She was acquitted of murder by reason of self-defense.

Now, it probably helped things that she lived in an area which had a recent rash of violent breakins, and it probably helped more that the no-knock warrant specified an address several blocks away, (How dumb was that?) she was totally innocent of anything at the point her door came down, but the fact remains that I will personally assume that if my door is broken down (which would really tick me off since I don't normally lock it) the people coming in are criminals, and begin blasting all of them very quickly, as in semi-auto and 30 round clip. If I then happen to notice uniforms, I will surrender like a good boy and clog up the court system. If allowed, of course, it strikes me that in a confiscation scenario the invaders will probably get into shooting first and asking questions later.

By the by, at least in THEORY, the gub't will not know where the guns are, and will have to search EVERY house, shooting first will create a lot of casualties among the antis real quick, too. Can't be done, folks. Not on a national scale. Which does not say that Waco should not make us all sit up and take note.

Larry P.
 
Don't know about the rest of you but I'm not responsible for my actions until after the first cup of coffee. Should take about 15 minutes to brew it. I may or may not get it in the long haul but neither will the illegal home invaders.

Just got a gun control proposal with a different twist. Makes me want to get some more lead. http://members.aol.com/nrubenstei/gcontol.htm
 
Gunfounder,
I couldn't make your link work. Hmmm.

Larry,
We see eye-to-eye on this thread! :D

All,

A year or so ago, Mr. Smart Aleck UPS man came here to deliver a package - running as usual. He knocked and immediately tried the doorknob. The door was locked.

I answered the door and the pompous ass asked, "Whatsamatter, you scared to be home alone?"

I replied, "No. I just don't want to shoot anybody by accident. Next time, just knock."

As I tucked the 1911 into my belt and took the package, Mr. UPS man suddenly developed a stutter, suffered an attack of extreme courtesy, and an apparent eyeball/slack jaw affliction.

He no longer opens the screen door.
--------
If the gov't reps come at 0400 hours, they'll get me. I have three kids coming and going at God only knows when so I've lost the knack of waking up at every little noise.

OTOH, busting in and screaming just might trigger a quicker, conditioned response.... (pun intended ;) )
 
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