In what condition is ur CCW carried?

[rickyrick]

Like I said earlier... Point and click works two ways....

I won't own a gun without an external safety...

Years ago I had one pointed in my face.... Safety was on... I was able to regain control of the firearm with the assaulter's finger in the trigger guard.

 

[Dragline45]

I call it choice.

A choice it may be, but an ignorant one.

You are now telling people if they don't agree with you that are not ready to carry a firearm.

First off its not it's not just me, its pretty much every industry expert. There isn't a single credible firearms instructor that advocates carrying on an empty chamber, I think that means something. I stand by what I said, if you don't feel safe carrying a loaded handgun, you aren't ready to carry a gun and should seek out more training.

I assume you then agree that anyone that doesn't get what you see as adequate training and don't carry with a round in the chamber, should not legally be allowed to carry a firearm in America.

You assumed wrong. Making presumptions like that is just foolish, not even sure how you came up with that.

A quote from the original post below, did you read it.

Yep, and I don't care.

Possibly but that can work both ways, their are plenty of people killed and injured because they did have a round in the chamber.

A three-year-old has shot his father and pregnant mother inside a motel room in Albuquerque, New Mexico.

A mother has been shot dead by her two-year-old son who found a gun from her handbag.
Veronica Rutledge, 29, was accidentally shot and killed by the toddler while she was shopping in a Walmart store in Hayden, Idaho.

As unfortunate as that is, that's the parents fault for leaving a loaded handgun accessible to their children, it has nothing to do with the gun being loaded. That's like a 3 year old child stealing their parents car, going for a joyride, and killing someone then blaming the car for having a full tank of gas instead of the parents for leaving the keys around.

 

[manta49]

First off its not it's not just me, its pretty much every industry expert. There isn't a single credible firearms instructor that advocates carrying on an empty chamber,

Neither did I but I don't think one size fits all in all circumstances. I give one example in an earlier post, my job involves crawling in under machinery, I am always getting clothing etc snagged in the machinery, do you think knowing that it would be sensible having a handgun with a round in the chamber with me. ?

As unfortunate as that is, that's the parents fault for leaving a loaded handgun accessible to their children, it has nothing to do with the gun being loaded.

Yes it is the parents fault. But not all firearms owners are responsible people, but knowing that you continue to advise people to carry with a round in the chamber, without knowing anything about their knowledge or experience of firearms. You might think that's good advice I think it's dangerous advice. IMO. PS If there was not a round in the chamber I doubt a two year old could have fired the handguns. I give two examples there are numerous other examples.

 

[Dragline45]

I give one example in an earlier post, my job involves crawling in under machinery, I am always getting clothing etc snagged in the machinery, do you think knowing that it would be sensible having a handgun with a round in the chamber with me. ?

In a proper holster there is no danger of that gun discharging, if you are really that concerned get a holster with a retention strap.

but knowing that you continue to advise people to carry with a round in the chamber, without knowing anything about their knowledge or experience of firearms. You might think that's good advice I think it's dangerous advice. IMO.

And this ties into what I was saying before, if you don't feel comfortable carrying a loaded handgun, seek out more training.

PS If there was not a round in the chamber I doubt a two year old could have fired the handguns. I give two examples there are numerous other examples.

Again, the 2 year old killing its parent with a handgun has absolutely nothing to do with the gun being loaded and everything to do with the parent leaving a loaded handgun accessible to their child.

 

[manta49]

In a proper holster there is no danger of that gun discharging, if you are really that concerned get a holster with a retention strap.

Take my word for it ,The strap could easily pull of without me knowing, still a good idea. ?

Again, the 2 year old killing its parent with a handgun has absolutely nothing to do with the gun being loaded and everything to do with the parent leaving a loaded handgun accessible to their child.

I did say it was the parents fault. But that doesn't change the fact if there was not a round in the chamber the gun would not of fired.

 

[Dragline45]

Take my word for it ,The strap could easily pull of without me knowing, still a good idea. ?

I don't see why not. I cant ever foresee a snag to cause a retention snap to unbuckle, the gun to unholster, and 3-10lbs of force applied to the trigger all at once to cause the gun to prematurely discharge.

I did say it was the parents fault. But that doesn't change the fact if there was not a round in the chamber the gun would not of fired.

No but it completely negates it. The issue isn't that the gun was loaded, it was that the parents left a loaded handgun accessible to their child, that is the root of the problem. We could play the if, and, or but game all day long, but at the end of the day those parents were shot for one reason, they gave a 3 year old access to a loaded gun

 

[manta49]

I don't see why not. I cant ever foresee a snag to cause a retention snap to unbuckle, the gun to unholster, and 3-10lbs of force applied to the trigger all at once to cause the gun to prematurely discharge.

So let me be clear what you are saying. If you carry a handgun you should carry it with a round in the chamber, in all circumstances no exceptions. And if you don't you shouldn't be carrying a handgun.

 

[Dragline45]

So let me be clear what you are saying. If you carry a handgun you should carry it with a round in the chamber, in all circumstances no exceptions. And if you don't you shouldn't be carrying a handgun.

Yep pretty much, I am a firm believer in consistency. I really cant think of a single instance where I would be carrying a gun and feel the need for it to be unloaded.

 

[rickyrick]

You are fortunate

Some places you're not allowed to have a loaded gun...
I would load and unload several times a day. Easier at times just to pop in an out a magazine

 

[Dragline45]

You are fortunate

Some places you're not allowed to have a loaded gun...
I would load and unload several times a day. Easier at times just to pop in an out a magazine

The only place I have ever been that does not allow carry of a loaded handgun is certain indoor ranges. Then of course there are places where handguns aren't allowed at all but that's a different story.

 

[CZ9Joe]

Dragline, why is your standard answer that "people need more training". I'm not incompetent with firearms. I do agree I could use more training. I think everyone that carries could probably benefit from even more training. I'm well aware that a chambered loaded firearm inside a quality holster is relatively safe inside that holster and that it isn't going to just "go off".
I do handle my firearms safely and I shoot on average once a week at a local range and I have for years now. I choose not to carry my firearm with one in the chamber for a couple of reasons. The main reason being that I am often around young children. I don't leave my gun laying around for children to play with or anything idiotic like that. But children are mischievous and I don't want to even take the remote chance of something stupid and tragic happening. What if I suddenly passed out while I was with kids and they became curious about what was hanging out of my waistband before another adult showed up? What if I had a long day and fell asleep on the couch before removing my iwb holstered firearm? What if I'm leaning over cleaning up a mess on the floor with some paper towel and one of them comes up behind me and grabs at my chambered loaded firearm and snags the trigger on the holster? What if an EMT that is inexperienced with firearms tries to remove my firearm from my holster after I'm in a car accident and accidentally shoots me with it? I personally don't want to even take the chance at any of these remote scenarios or any similar scenarios playing out. The idea of mildly increasing my odds of losing in a sudden violent confrontation is more appealing to me than living with the knowledge that my decisions led to the death of a child or some other mishap or tragedy.
I totally respect your want and need to carry a chambered weapon but I choose not to do that.
I've practiced drawing and racking quickly with snap caps in my firearm. I realize that under a high stress situation it is possible I won't do everything perfectly. But like everything in this life practicing until something is muscle memory helps enormously. I'd argue that under a high stress adrenaline filled situation, a chp holder is just as likely to accidentally prematurely pull the trigger on a gun with one in the chamber as I am to fail at properly racking the slide (response to your assumption that I would shoot some innocent bystander by having to rack my slide).
The other reason I don't carry one in the chamber is simply to lower the probability that I myself will do something idiotic and mindless while handling my firearm daily. Whether it be fastening it or removing it from my belt or sticking it in the nightstand safe at night. I'm a fairly bright guy. I respect my firearms and I handle them smartly. But I also recognize that everyone makes mistakes. All people occasionally do stupid things. Everyone can become careless sometimes and I'm no exception.
Having said that I realize that I put myself at somewhat of a disadvantage in certain situations when it comes to defending myself with my concealed firearm. But I also realize that having a firearm that can be put into ready condition fairly quickly will serve me well in a great majority of situations I might encounter if I ever have to make use of my concealed firearm (which is statistically a low chance anyway) and it is certainly better than carrying no firearm at all. I don't believe there is a wrong and a right answer to the condition you carry your firearm in. It is a personal preference. People should weigh the pros and cons and decide what makes sense for them personally.

 

[Cheapshooter]

Quote:
A three-year-old has shot his father and pregnant mother inside a motel room in Albuquerque, New Mexico.
Quote:
A mother has been shot dead by her two-year-old son who found a gun from her handbag.
Veronica Rutledge, 29, was accidentally shot and killed by the toddler while she was shopping in a Walmart store in Hayden, Idaho.

Two examples of negligence. Had the parents been responsible, and maintained proper control of their firearm it would have made no difference if they had a round in the chamber or not.
Had they on the other hand needed the gun to defend themselves, or their family that may very well have not been able to chamber a round in time to make it anything more than a heavy object.
Carrying a firearm is a great responsibility. Properly carrying it, and maintaining control of it is the utmost responsibility.

 

[rickyrick]

I carry chambered 90% of the time
Other times it's more convienient to carry unloaded. I cross borders daily.

I will not carry a gun with no safety... Like I said I've had one of my own guns stuck in my face years ago.

I'm a combat vet. I don't need training.

Hollering about training sounds like anti gunners battle cry.
I don't need training to vote, speak freely and many other natural rights.

Life of a working poor man has trained me plenty.
If someone chooses not to carry chambered... It's his choice.
One doesn't need training to choose. Doesn't make him dumb or idiotic.

Life is not a tactical scenario

 

[Cheapshooter]

I carry chambered 90% of the time
Other times it's more convienient to carry unloaded. I cross borders daily.

I still don't get it? There are places where you can carry concealed, but you can't have a round in the chamber, or even a loaded magazine?
Where are these jurisdictions?

 

[rickyrick]

Some places an unloaded firearm is ok. But loaded is prohibited. Depending on the definition an unloaded firearm is no round in the chamber and magazine removed. A loaded magazine on its own is not a firearm.

You should be aware of all firearms laws and restrictions in the locales that you traverse... They are far from universal.

Most do not have restrictions on unloaded firearms. Most are considered unloaded with the magazine removed.

For example, I am not allowed to carry in state x. I frequently cross into state x on my daily routine. I am licensed in my home state and others. But not in state X. Am I going home to deposit my firearm for a few hours in state x? No. So I put the firearm in a legal condition for state x for a little while and when I'm back in a state that I'm licensed then I reinsert the magazine. So instead of a constant chambering and UN-chambering a round while driving, it's easier to just not chamber a round.

 

[mrt949]

All mine are D.A.O.
HK P2000SK LEM
SEECAMP
RUGER SP101
BERETTA 21A.

 

[manta49]

Two examples of negligence. Had the parents been responsible, and maintained proper control of their firearm it would have made no difference if they had a round in the chamber or not.
Had they on the other hand needed the gun to defend themselves, or their family that may very well have not been able to chamber a round in time to make it anything more than a heavy object.

Are you saying a two year old racked the slide and the fired the handgun. ?

You said two examples of negligence and i agree and so do others, and then in the same breath some advice that all people should carry a firearm with a round in the chamber no exceptions .That obviously would include the people they are criticizing for being irresponsible and negligent, that's just crazy IMO.

As for them having to chamber a round to protect themselves, having a round in the chamber worked out really for them.

 

[rickyrick]

A person may need to rack the slide one handed even if they already had a round in the chamber. If your only contingency is pulling the trigger; a revolver might be a more favorable option for you.

People elect capacity over reliability when choosing a carry gun. A plethora of issues can arise with semi auto pistol.

The best bet for point and shoot tactics is a revolver. If you're fighting someone off with one hand, you're already in deep. Chances are your gonna need to rack that slide.
Your action may be full of dirt and blood, you may have accidentally ejected your magazine, you may have anyone of the possible malfunctions. Your first bullet may be in your own leg and part of your shirt is in now caught in the action.

You may end up very happy that there was not a round in the chamber

 

[Cheapshooter]

Are you saying a two year old racked the slide and the fired the handgun. ?

I'm saying had the parents were responsible gun owners they would have had better control of the gun! In that case, a child of any age could not fire the gun loaded or not.
Something you seem to be missing completely, just like in the thread falsely stating that Glock ha an unsafe design flaw, when a gun is carried, stored, and handled in a responsible way, it is entirely safe to have a round in the chamber.
What is not safe is trying to chamber a round quickly in a stressful situation!

As for them having to chamber a round to protect themselves, having a round in the chamber worked out really for them.

Had they needed the gun for self defense it would have. Being irresponsible, and careless in how they carried, or stored the gun is what did not work out so well for them.
Your argument sounds like something much more from the mouth of an anti second amendment gun grabber than a responsible gun owner.

 

[manta49]

I'm saying had the parents were responsible gun owners they would have had better control of the gun! In that case, a child of any age could not fire the gun loaded or not

Did you read my post. ?

Quote Manta49.You said two examples of negligence and i agree and so do others,

You are missing the point there are plenty of negligent irresponsible gun owners out there, but people are advising them to carry a firearm with a round in the chamber, does that make sense to you. ? My advice would be think of getting some proper training, before carrying a handgun with a round in the chamber seems reasonable to me. Not a blanket statement to anyone without knowing their experience or knowledge of firearms the only way to carry it with a round in the chamber, that's irresponsible advice , IMO.

Your argument sounds like something much more from the mouth of an anti second amendment gun grabber than a responsible gun owner.

How do you figure that out please explain I am curious.

As for Glock handguns they are perfectly safe with a round in the chamber, in a proper holster carried by someone that followed all the safety rules. But as we all know not all people are like that. That's why some people think an extra level of safety a safety catch etc. Could help prevent some N/Ds.