Illegal search at Wal-mart?...

I don't mind the checkers and such.

You have to remember that the prices you pay for goods includes the price of the loss of goods (stolen).

I don't feel that I'm "giving up my rights" and I don't worry about it since I don't steal.

I guess some would take a hardball stance, that is their right to do so.

But, I would have "fun" with them if I was so inclined (just to be a jerk) and get one of those tags that hasn't been wiped and then put it into my shoe :D.

Wayne
 
Illlegal Search at Wal-mart

There are several Wal-Mart stores in my area and one in particular, the Alarm goes off so much that I automatically hold my receipt in my hand when I exit. I have had the alarm go off on me numerous times, I have had my merchandise checked by the Employee at the door and 99% of the time, it turned out to be the Alarm that was the problem. On a couple of rare occassions (sp) I had purchased some merchandise that weren't properly deactivated, usually a CD or DVD. While I find it time consuming, I don't feel that my Rights are being violated. Hey, its their Store, they used no force or demands upon me. :) :)
 
Number 6 stated
"Yes: What delusions are you under? Besides the one that Wal-Mart checking you bags somehow constitutes "state action" or is otherwise under "color of law?"
Your erroneous assertion about a "42 lawsuit" is, presumably, an inaccurate claim of readiness to file a civil rights lawsuit under 42 USC 1983. As such, they are referred to as "1983 actions."
Additionally, as was stated before, Wal-Mart is not a governmental entity. Ergo, your vaunted civil rights lawsuit is a non-starter. : "

I think you missed my point. I refuse to have my bags checked, period. That is my right. If I am detained and my bags are checked with no probable cause that I had stolen anything that becomes actionable.

I am well aware that it is 42 U.S.C.A. Section 1983; I will forgo abbreviating if it offends you so much. :rolleyes:

There is an excellent website at: http://www.crimedoctor.com/false_imprisonment.htm
Here is an excerpt;
"Some retailers misinterpret the state merchants’ statute and believe they can detain a customer for almost any rule infraction while they collect the person’s identification, fill out trespass forms, or take their photograph. For example, detaining a customer in an office for refusing to stop for an exit bag check or after a door sensor (EAS) alarm could be deemed as false imprisonment without reasonable cause to suspect that they had stolen anything."

If you think that "civil rights" are not an issue in unlawful detention suits against merchants may I suggest that you do a little more case review.
 
I did - it's YOUR turn

"I am well aware that it is 42 U.S.C.A. Section 1983; I will forgo abbreviating if it offends you so much. "

If you truly were "well aware" of the statute, you would have cited it correctly. You would also have known that it is triggered by STATE ACTION. Once again, for the learning-impaired, some retiree in a Wal-Mart smock is NOT a state agent. Your claims of bringing a 1983 action based upon some checker's detention are ludicrous.

A false detention or assault action against an overzealous merchant may be brought, but NOT under s. 1983. Try to keep up......
 
I guess you guys dont realize how much money walks out the door at walmart every year as it is that doesn't set off the alarm. Then, if you were an investor or owner or the boss (this puts egg all over your face) you sure would say : "look at all that money I lost that I could be holding right now!! What do I pay all those people to do anyways if they are practically GIVING my merchandise away!" I would estimate about 1/4 million dollars--yes, $250,000 walk out of every store every year. That may not seem like much at one giant store but put them all together and see how many millions add up just for that company. Times all the companies you see in the stocks page of the newspaper and man, I ran out of toes and fingers to count. I sure wouldn't like to be giving away millions for free and then give more to 'unsatisfied customers' that break the stuff and return it claiming it was defective. THEN when you complain why you don't get a fat raise at the end of the year (if you work there) you know why. It goes to pay for all that loot someone got for free 99. This just makes getting the boss to offer more than minimum wage and all the fries you can eat at mcdonalds not happen.
 
3 weelin geezer
I have no problem with what you just said. I understand the losses. You are a bit niave (IMHO) to think that this relates to raises. That is only propaganda from the retailers. They are going to keep every dime they possibly can. I was further elated when the removing of a sensor tag here became a felony. However the numerous times I have shown up to testify this just get pleaded down to a lesser charge.
Those that steal, should be caught, and the third offence should be a hard time felony. But the stores don't have the right to hold me responsable because the proper employee training, and loss prevention measures are not in place.
 
Cha-ching!!!

Interesting question: I know I just paid for my stuff, cashier knows I just paid, what happens if I keep on walking? The old chick at the door certainly won't be stopping me. For those who live in small towns and are familar faces in them you know what I mean when I say calling the cops isn't an option. They'll show up, have a good laugh, look at those out of towners who work in Wally World with a quizzical glance and forget the whole incident.
Click to expand...


Bottom line: Walmart's minimum wage "old chick at the door" is NOT a sworn officer of any police agency and has NO powers of arrest; if they detain/restrain you in any way, they are guilty of false arrest or something else that a copmetent attorney will gut them for in court.

You and your attorney stand to make ALOT of money, thanks to WalMart's stupidity. :D :D :D
 
isn't there somethign like a citizens arrest or something, where they can hold you until law enforcement arrives?
 
jefnvk: isn't there somethign like a citizens arrest or something, where they can hold you until law enforcement arrives?
Click to expand...

Yes there is, and you can use what force is reasonably necessary to detain them. You better be sure they comitted a crime though!
 
Your state will probably have something kind of similar in their laws.

The legal argument that you'll have to win is whether or not the bloody alarm at the door constitutes "reasonable ground to suppose..." that your bags may contain stolen property.

Personally, I'm of the opinion that the sky-high rate of false alarms rendered by the electronic scanners takes away any reasonable ground.

LawDog
Click to expand...


That's exactly what I was going to say.

Once you force them to testify that they get false alarms from the "theft deterrent devices" all the time (for example, when I buy DVDs there, every so often a paid-for DVD sets off the alarm; hence, false alarm!), that utterly shreds any claim that they have that a buzzer really means "theft in progress."

By the time they've been working there a week, I'll bet any of these people already know that 9 times out of 10, they're simply going to find the item that set off the buzzer right there on your receipt.

That's probably why the response I've had with my paid-for DVDs has been so very energetic. :rolleyes:

-blackmind
 
Package Check

I think the original post had to do with the electronic article surveillance (EAS) system and the inconvenience it caused the person posting. Please understand I do not work for Walmart (although I do consider them a good company) but, in order to understand (then bash if you will) what is happening, please consider: the retail industry annually reports losses due to "shrink" in the neighborhood of 63 BILLION dollars. Most retailers simply add the percentage (averages 2.30 as a percentage to sales) to the retail price so the good guy shopper pays for the theft. Not exactly a fair trade-off. While it is true that the largest dollar amount per theft is due to internal dishonesty, the stores that allow you to touch and pick up merchandise - then carry it to a cashier for payment (as opposed to those that keep everything behind the counter or in locked glass cases) experience a rather large loss due to shoplifting.

So, in an effort to reduce the price and cost to the honest shopper, many stores have installed those EAS units at the door. In the early days (20 years ago) they were quite primative, but the current ones are pretty good. The problem is not usually "false alarms" but a failure on the part of the cashier.

Walmart hires many older and/or even handicapped workers and quite a few work as cashiers. The ones I come in contact with are pretty well trained in customer service and are some of the nicest people in retail. They do not, however, always do everything right to cancel the EAS implant.

As far as I am concerned, the slight inconvenience of stopping, showing my receipt and having someone who reminds me of my grandmother glance in my shopping bag is just that - a slight inconvenience.

I have seen people paying by check who became all upset because they were asked for some identification; I tend to be more upset IF I AM NOT ASKED FOR I.D. In fact, all of my credit cards have the signature panel stating "Require Picture I.D" instead of my signature.

But, that is not my point. Bottom line is, if you choose to enter an establishment you are an "invitee or a guest" and should expect to abide by the rules of the establishment. In my case I also try to spend my money with companies that, if not in agreement with me, do not actively support causes to which I am opposed. I don't shop at Costco, won't buy Levi's or Nike and I won't enter a retail establishment with the "No Concealed Weapons" posting. Doesn't matter whether I have a concealed weapon or not and it is not the legal issue that keeps me out; it is the concept - if they can not respect my training, experience and intelligence and know that I am not a threat, then I won't give them my money.

Sorry for the long post, but I could not say this in fewer words.
John
Charlotte, NC
 
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