Illegal Immigrant invasion or War in Iraq (Bringing "freedom" to the middle east)
- Thread starter Doug.38PR
- Start date
contender6030
New member
Border security is the biggest problem IN the US at this time BUT we need to finish what we started in Iraq!
Got this in an e-mail today, Looks like a good idea for the USA to follow.-----
Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.
A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown.
Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state and its laws were made by parliament.
"If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you," he said on national television.
"I'd be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia, one the Australian law and another the Islamic law, that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that's a better option," Costello said.
Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country.
Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off".
"Basically, people who don't want to be Australians, and they don't want to live by Australian values and understand them, well then they can basically clear off," he said. Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques.
AMERICA and Canada..... ARE YOU LISTENING?
Quote:
IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.
However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia.
However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.
This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.
This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language!
Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture.
We will accept yo ur beliefs and will not question why, all we ask is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.
If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.
We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means keep your culture but do not force it on others.
This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this.
But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, "THE RIGHT T O LEAVE".
If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here.
You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.
Got this in an e-mail today, Looks like a good idea for the USA to follow.-----
Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks.
A day after a group of mainstream Muslim leaders pledged loyalty to Australia at a special meeting with Prime Minister John Howard, he and his ministers made it clear that extremists would face a crackdown.
Treasurer Peter Costello, seen as heir apparent to Howard, hinted that some radical clerics could be asked to leave the country if they did not accept that Australia was a secular state and its laws were made by parliament.
"If those are not your values, if you want a country which has Sharia law or a theocratic state, then Australia is not for you," he said on national television.
"I'd be saying to clerics who are teaching that there are two laws governing people in Australia, one the Australian law and another the Islamic law, that is false. If you can't agree with parliamentary law, independent courts, democracy, and would prefer Sharia law and have the opportunity to go to another country, which practices it, perhaps, then, that's a better option," Costello said.
Asked whether he meant radical clerics would be forced to leave, he said those with dual citizenship could possibly be asked to move to the other country.
Education Minister Brendan Nelson later told reporters that Muslims who did not want to accept local values should "clear off".
"Basically, people who don't want to be Australians, and they don't want to live by Australian values and understand them, well then they can basically clear off," he said. Separately, Howard angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques.
AMERICA and Canada..... ARE YOU LISTENING?
Quote:
IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.
However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia.
However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.
This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.
This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language!
Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture.
We will accept yo ur beliefs and will not question why, all we ask is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.
If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.
We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means keep your culture but do not force it on others.
This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this.
But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, "THE RIGHT T O LEAVE".
If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here.
You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.
Jeepmark2005
New member
Outstanding ! ! !
Absolutly 100 % right. Why didn't we think of that ! ! ! What can I say? That is dead on.
Absolutly 100 % right. Why didn't we think of that ! ! ! What can I say? That is dead on.
Jeepmark2005
New member
Why didn't we think of that ! ! !
IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.
However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia.
However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.
This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.
This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language!
Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture.
We will accept yo ur beliefs and will not question why, all we ask is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.
If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.
We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means keep your culture but do not force it on others.
This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this.
But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, "THE RIGHT T O LEAVE".
If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here.
You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.
IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians.
However, the dust from the attacks had barely settled when the "politically correct" crowd began complaining about the possibility that our patriotism was offending others. I am not against immigration, nor do I hold a grudge against anyone who is seeking a better life by coming to Australia.
However, there are a few things that those who have recently come to our country, and apparently some born here, need to understand.
This idea of Australia being a multicultural community has served only to dilute our sovereignty and our national identity. As Australians, we have our own culture, our own society, our own language and our own lifestyle.
This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom. We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society, Learn the language!
Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push but a fact because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, Because God is part of our culture.
We will accept yo ur beliefs and will not question why, all we ask is that you accept ours and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.
If the Southern Cross offends you, or you don't like " A Fair Go", then you should seriously consider a move to another part of this planet.
We are happy with our culture and have no desire to change, and we really don't care how you did things where you came from. By all means keep your culture but do not force it on others.
This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this.
But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, "THE RIGHT T O LEAVE".
If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here.
You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.
easy question
Its illegal immigration for me. Seeing as how there will never be freedom much less peace in the middle east, its an easy decision.
The people in the middle east have been fighting amongst themselves forever, i doubt they will stop because we want them to.
Its illegal immigration for me. Seeing as how there will never be freedom much less peace in the middle east, its an easy decision.
The people in the middle east have been fighting amongst themselves forever, i doubt they will stop because we want them to.
Last edited:
Esquire M Busterbury
Moderator
contender, that would be nice if we made the same announcement, but also included radical Christians in there as well. Lets deport Pat Robertson! I find him and the message he conveys to be detrimental to our country and stupid people everywhere who might have tuned him to his B.S. 700 crap.
Mr. Busterbury,
I don't know. With all his faults (and he and the so called-Christian right have them. I get tired of him putting his foot in his mouth and worshipping the Republican party.), I have never heard Pat Robertson or any of his supporters advocate flying airplanes into buildings or blowing themselves up to kill other people or abuse women or kill women for not being covered from head to toe, or chopping someones head off.
But anyway, back on topic, +1 Contender. As Mr. Busterbury said, that would be nice
I don't know. With all his faults (and he and the so called-Christian right have them. I get tired of him putting his foot in his mouth and worshipping the Republican party.), I have never heard Pat Robertson or any of his supporters advocate flying airplanes into buildings or blowing themselves up to kill other people or abuse women or kill women for not being covered from head to toe, or chopping someones head off.
But anyway, back on topic, +1 Contender. As Mr. Busterbury said, that would be nice
Esquire M Busterbury
Moderator
If there were 'liberals' in those buildings he might...
Try Jerry Fallwell...
That moron said specifically that 9/11 happened because of all the "f@9907s" in this country. Let's also throw in that one church (Westboro Baptist?) that goes to military funerals to insult the mourning families and fallen solider telling them that "they're going to hell". Religious nutcases be they Christian or Muslims just really annoy me to death, and just get my blood boiling. Believe me I do agree with most of what the Australian leader said with the exception of Christianity being prominent. Ever wonder why the Founding Fathers chose NOT to put up a cross on any national symbol?
Epyon
EDIT: On a lighter note, let's round up all the Christian nutcases in this country, and all the fanatical Muslims in the Middle East place them on a barge in the middle of the Pacific Ocean and have them duke it out, the winner gets to sink with the barge which is covered in C-4!!
(mods if I'm being too over the edge please feel free to delete this edit as you wish.)
That moron said specifically that 9/11 happened because of all the "f@9907s" in this country. Let's also throw in that one church (Westboro Baptist?) that goes to military funerals to insult the mourning families and fallen solider telling them that "they're going to hell". Religious nutcases be they Christian or Muslims just really annoy me to death, and just get my blood boiling. Believe me I do agree with most of what the Australian leader said with the exception of Christianity being prominent. Ever wonder why the Founding Fathers chose NOT to put up a cross on any national symbol?
Epyon
EDIT: On a lighter note, let's round up all the Christian nutcases in this country, and all the fanatical Muslims in the Middle East place them on a barge in the middle of the Pacific Ocean and have them duke it out, the winner gets to sink with the barge which is covered in C-4!!
(mods if I'm being too over the edge please feel free to delete this edit as you wish.)Camp David
New member
Doug.38PR said:
Both are critical issues in terms of Homeland Security. But you stated one issue incorrectly; i.e., the War on Terror (what you called "...bringing democracy to the middle east.."). Our War on Terror addresses terrorism in several nations. Bringing democracy is a part of that mission, not the entire mission. Addressing the immigrant invasion is indeed part of Homeland Security and is a high priority. But it is not directly illegal aliens from Mexico and Latin nations threatening our national security. They are a problem and we need to deal with them in due course. But they have been a problem for several decades. Indeed, at the time of westward expansion and the Louisiana Purchase, a proper barrier fence should have been built on our southwestern border. The current administration is not at fault here, but the government over 200 years allowing our borders to be a joke! Most third-world nations have better border security than we do! We need to fix this and stop the blame game. Immigration Reform needs national priority, as does the War on Terror. While the former is critical, the latter is more deadly to civilians and soldiers alike.
Easy Answer...
..safety and security within our borders is priority...outside our borders is our immediate next priority...Bush has it backwards...but then Bush has many things backwards...amazing that he can tell truths and lies with equal sincereity..Bush will go down in my history book as a President who fought hard to protect our country from abroad so illegal-aliens could come and go a they please...WIERD dipstick!! FAILURE PREZ!! Supports open-trade where investors win and American workers lose...runs up our national debt into oblivion ..your grandchildren will urinate on yer graves for that catastrophe in the making...in fact you might see that disaster yourselfs, before you die off...and I wanted to believe in this president..the Aussie Peter Costello's remarks were refreshingly honest, open & made good sense...
..safety and security within our borders is priority...outside our borders is our immediate next priority...Bush has it backwards...but then Bush has many things backwards...amazing that he can tell truths and lies with equal sincereity..Bush will go down in my history book as a President who fought hard to protect our country from abroad so illegal-aliens could come and go a they please...WIERD dipstick!! FAILURE PREZ!! Supports open-trade where investors win and American workers lose...runs up our national debt into oblivion ..your grandchildren will urinate on yer graves for that catastrophe in the making...in fact you might see that disaster yourselfs, before you die off...and I wanted to believe in this president..the Aussie Peter Costello's remarks were refreshingly honest, open & made good sense...
Both issues directly affect the security of America so BOTH are EQUALLY important to address... AT THE SAME TIME.
I couldn't vote because there was no choice for: "Solving the Immigration Problem and Resolving the War in Iraq are EQUALLY important and therefore BOTH should be addressed AT THE SAME TIME!"
I disagree with the idea that foreign security takes a back seat to at-home security because it's THE SAME THING. Extremist Muslims are already in this country and have already tried (but stopped) to carry out attacks here. Allowing those nut cases to roam freely in the Middle East just let's them train and prepare better to take their campaign over here in the US.
Carter
I couldn't vote because there was no choice for: "Solving the Immigration Problem and Resolving the War in Iraq are EQUALLY important and therefore BOTH should be addressed AT THE SAME TIME!"
I disagree with the idea that foreign security takes a back seat to at-home security because it's THE SAME THING. Extremist Muslims are already in this country and have already tried (but stopped) to carry out attacks here. Allowing those nut cases to roam freely in the Middle East just let's them train and prepare better to take their campaign over here in the US.
Carter
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
A short comment.
Bringing freedom to the Middle East has two connotations. One is that America has a zealot's mission to bring our version of democracy to the world. I think that borders on the avoiding foreign entanglement advice of some wise folks.
The second is that it is a strategy that will make the US safer.
If the latter was the case, then I would support the effort. If the former, then GWB and his cronies need to get beyond their simplistic view of world culture (GWB doesn't read anything - IIRC) and realize that the world and culture is complex and this is foolish.
Our goal is to make the Middle East less of a threat - bringing freedom to them (or our version of it) is irrelevant. If they are happy in a Moslem state but that state doesn't want to threaten us - I really don't care in the practical world. In the abstract, there are aspects of that culture I don't like.
George doesn't understand this. Thus, he spouts zealotry and cliches.
About immigration - neither party leadership is interested in it because of venial partisan issues. Is having a good policy important - will it bring down the country - what does that mean?
If you think that having a flood of LEGAL Hispanics threatens the WHITE man's world - then you have a problem. Such cultural venting has been done through the history of the US - no Jews, No Italians, No Chinese, etc. etc.
If you think illegal immigration should be controlled because they are illegal and their undocumented labor hurts us - I agree. However, the illegals are good for GWB's economic conservative puppet masters and thus he has been uninterested. But, wait - Here I come to save Terry Schiavo and sign the AWB II (but I don't mean it).
Such simplistic questions to complex questions that want to evoke a tough guy answer.
Bringing freedom to the Middle East has two connotations. One is that America has a zealot's mission to bring our version of democracy to the world. I think that borders on the avoiding foreign entanglement advice of some wise folks.
The second is that it is a strategy that will make the US safer.
If the latter was the case, then I would support the effort. If the former, then GWB and his cronies need to get beyond their simplistic view of world culture (GWB doesn't read anything - IIRC) and realize that the world and culture is complex and this is foolish.
Our goal is to make the Middle East less of a threat - bringing freedom to them (or our version of it) is irrelevant. If they are happy in a Moslem state but that state doesn't want to threaten us - I really don't care in the practical world. In the abstract, there are aspects of that culture I don't like.
George doesn't understand this. Thus, he spouts zealotry and cliches.
About immigration - neither party leadership is interested in it because of venial partisan issues. Is having a good policy important - will it bring down the country - what does that mean?
If you think that having a flood of LEGAL Hispanics threatens the WHITE man's world - then you have a problem. Such cultural venting has been done through the history of the US - no Jews, No Italians, No Chinese, etc. etc.
If you think illegal immigration should be controlled because they are illegal and their undocumented labor hurts us - I agree. However, the illegals are good for GWB's economic conservative puppet masters and thus he has been uninterested. But, wait - Here I come to save Terry Schiavo and sign the AWB II (but I don't mean it).
Such simplistic questions to complex questions that want to evoke a tough guy answer.