If you have to draw.....

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Also note that the OP posited that one had to draw his gun. That is the starting point for the discussion -- a justified threat to use lethal force in self defense.

So let's not waste time on the question of when or if display of a gun is appropriate. For the purposes of this discussion it is.
 
A firearm is a tool of last resort.
If a firearm has been drawn in defense, there must have been a threat of serious bodily harm.
If the threat backs down, then
1. Go to a secure location/ensure the threat is gone.
2. Secure the firearm/reholster.
3. Call the police to report the attempted crime.
 
If I have reason to pull my gun, I'm going to use it. If I'm not justified in using it, I should have never pulled it.
 
Bennyboy said:
If I have reason to pull my gun, I'm going to use it. If I'm not justified in using it, I should have never pulled it.
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If that's your position, then perhaps you should review your state laws on use of deadly force. For an overview of the principles involved, Kleanbore wrote a very good post on the matter here.
 
I'm not a member on that forum and cannot see the post. But for what it's worth, I'm in Georgia. And don't think I'm some wannabe cowboy lookin to shot someone. I'd do everything I could to avoid it and thus, once I do, I'm going to fire. I'm not pointing it and giving the bad guy a choice. He made his choice when he forced me to draw.
 
Sorry about that. I didn't realize that you had to be a member to see that thread. Try this one.

I'm not accusing you of being either a wannabe, a cowboy, or a wannabe cowboy. However, there are more than a few folks that think if they draw, they have to shoot. Deciding that "if I draw, I'm going to shoot" can land one in hot water fairly quickly.
 
Originally Posted by Bennyboy
If I have reason to pull my gun, I'm going to use it. If I'm not justified in using it, I should have never pulled it.
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That is an old saying that people referred to originally make a point that guns should only be drawn when needed. We understood growing up that it meant to be prepared to use it counts for the reasoning. I hate to see it grow to this belief.
 
I wasn't offended Spats, no need to apologize. And Wreck-n-Crew, I've heard the same growing up, and what I said is not my derivative of that. What I said is how I feel personally, it's not that I will feel compelled to fire upon pulling my gun. Instead, think of it as I'm simply saying I'll have been forced, in which case I'll have also been forced to fire. I can assure you, it would take more to make me draw than most. Not scared of totin' a whoopin'. :)
 
Bennyboy said:
...What I said is how I feel personally, it's not that I will feel compelled to fire upon pulling my gun. Instead, think of it as I'm simply saying I'll have been forced, in which case I'll have also been forced to fire...
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What you feel is beside the point. What is important is understanding clearly the laws related to the use of force in self defense. Things can change quickly.

It might well be that in a particular situation you would be justified drawing your gun; it could even be wise to draw your gun. But if before you fire things change, you might not be legally justified in shooting.

It appears that some study of the laws relating to the use of force in self defense would be in order. Have a look here and here.
 
Thanks guys. I guess this is just one subject we'll have to disagree on. I can't make my points with words but I'm not talking about a legal situation here, I'm talking about a life and death (what it would take for me to pull my gun). Even if for some reason it was NOT justifiable, I would do it if it meant living. Anyway, we could go into it all night, make scenarios, discuss it, argue, etc. Still doesn't change what I know to be my threshold or tolerance. If I pull, I shoot. Period.
 
What I said is how I feel personally, it's not that I will feel compelled to fire upon pulling my gun. Instead, think of it as I'm simply saying I'll have been forced, in which case I'll have also been forced to fire. I can assure you, it would take more to make me draw than most. Not scared of totin' a whoopin'.
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I thought that as a possibility and often times communication is not as easy on a forum as in person when talking. Also you can see how easy it is for a prosecutor or detective to misunderstand as well.
Can't tell you how many times I have to retract a statement or clarify it with better wording. Happens to most of us sometime or another.
 
Bennyboy said:
...I'm talking about a life and death (what it would take for me to pull my gun). Even if for some reason it was NOT justifiable, I would do it if it meant living...
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If it truly meant living it would be justifiable. But if your attacker has broken off his attack, or fled or otherwise ceased to be a threat, shooting would not be necessary to save your life; and if you shoot you will be committing a crime.

Bennyboy said:
...If I pull, I shoot. Period.
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And maybe go to prison for the rest of your life.
 
Call the cops first.....

....then consider yourself lucky that you don't have to endure the expenses of legal defense.....

....or finding more carry ammo....
 
It's cool Wreck-n-Crew. Even harder to make a point on an IPhone. Takes too long, haha.

Frank, thanks for the heads up. I know I'll be justified, so it's all good. And let me add, that in the 1-2 seconds it takes for me to know I need to draw and to put my sights on target, if the bad guy turned to run, dropped his weapon, etc, I would not fire. I'm not going to execute someone. However, if at the time my sights are lined up, the threat still exists, I'm firing. There won't be negotiations.

I promise this is the last time I try to get my point across. Take it for what it's worth, probably nothing. :).
 
Bennyboy said:
. . . .in the 1-2 seconds it takes for me to know I need to draw and to put my sights on target, if the bad guy turned to run, dropped his weapon, etc, I would not fire. I'm not going to execute someone. However, if at the time my sights are lined up, the threat still exists, I'm firing. There won't be negotiations.
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Well, this ^^^ is a far cry from what you posted earlier:
Bennyboy said:
If I have reason to pull my gun, I'm going to use it. If I'm not justified in using it, I should have never pulled it.
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and
Bennyboy said:
If I pull, I shoot. Period.
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I will also add:
Bennyboy said:
Frank, thanks for the heads up. I know I'll be justified, so it's all good.
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We sincerely hope that if you do ever have to draw and shoot, you'll be justified. Bear in mind, though, that you won't get to decide if it was justified. That's done later by a variety of other folks, like prosecutors and juries.
 
I don't see where what I said is a "far cry" from what I said initially. I had to expand on it because it was being picked apart and any negative one could draw from it was being exploited. Any reasonable, logical person could have read that and taken it for what I meant, not nit picked it to death.

Finally, concerning the legal consequences: if that was my main concern, I wouldn't carry a gun at all. I'd let myself be mugged or harmed or whatever and hope the legal system did its job against the perp. But since I don't place my faith (or fear) in that system, I carry to defend myself. Judged by 12 or carried by 6. I'll take the first regardless.

Anyway, grain of salt.
 
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Nothing was being exploited, Bennyboy. I quoted exactly what you posted. You were simply taken at your words. Now you claim that "reasonable, logical" people would have understood it for what you meant, but not what you said. You said what you said. If you needed to expand to make it more precise, that's fair enough. What you posted is not our fault, though.
 
Spats:

In fact, I'd like to apologize. I shouldn't have said anything about being reasonable and logical. I'm sure you are both.

I should have said that what I posted was being looked at in a cynical way. Instead of thinking, "he said if he pulls and the guy is begging for his life he is still going to murder him in the streets" it could have been thought of as "he's saying that if he is scared enough to pull his gun, he's going to end the situation as quickly as possible because it must've been very serious".

I just don't view my gun as a tool of persuasion. That's all, not saying my way is better than anyone else's, just different I guess.

Anyway, sorry again. I wasn't trying to insult anyone.
 
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