If we leave Iraq, what happens to the supporters of democracy?

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Greg Bell

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Rushing for the ExitIf we leave Iraq, what happens to the supporters of democracy?
By Christopher Hitchens
Posted Monday, Oct. 30, 2006, at 6:14 PM ET
To say that "exit strategies" from Iraq have become the flavor of the month would be to exaggerate the situation to the point of absurdity. Exit strategies are not even the fall fashion. They are the regnant topic of conversation all across the political establishment and have been for some time. Even the Bush administration has some share in this discourse, having now abandoned the useless mantra of "staying the course" without quite defining what that "course" might be—or might have been. (A rule of thumb in politics is that any metaphor drawn from sporting activity is worse than useless, but at least one doesn't hear people saying that in Iraq we are "at the bottom of the ninth" or some such horse manure.)
Many of those advocating withdrawal have been "war-weary" ever since the midafternoon of Sept. 11, 2001, when it was discovered that the source of jihadist violence was U.S. foreign policy—a mentality now reinforced by the recent National Intelligence Estimate circulated by our emasculated, demoralized, and incompetent intelligence services. To this way of thinking, victory is impossible by definition, because any response other than restraint is bound to inflame the militancy of the other side. Since the jihadists, by every available account, are also inflamed and encouraged by everything from passivity to Danish cartoons, this seems to shrink the arena of possible or even thinkable combat. (Nobody ever asks what would happen if the jihadists had to start worrying about the level of casualties they were enduring, or the credit they were losing by their tactics, or the number of enemies they were making among civilized people who were prepared to take up arms to stop them. Our own masochism makes this contingency an unlikely one in any case.)
I am glad that all previous demands for withdrawal or disengagement from Iraq were unheeded, because otherwise we would not be able to celebrate the arrest and trial of Saddam Hussein; the removal from the planet of his two sadistic kids and putative successors; the certified disarmament of a former WMD- and gangster-sponsoring rogue state; the recuperation of the marshes and their ecology and society; the introduction of a convertible currency; the autonomy of Iraqi Kurdistan (currently advertising for investors and tourists on American television); the killing of al-Qaida's most dangerous and wicked leader, Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, and many of his associates; the opening of dozens of newspapers and radio and TV stations; the holding of elections for an assembly and to approve a constitution; and the introduction of the idea of federal democracy as the only solution for Iraq short of outright partition and/or civil war. If this cause is now to be considered defeated, by the sheer staggering persistence in murder and sabotage of the clerico-fascist forces and the sectarian militias, then it will always count as a noble one.
But the many disappointments and crimes and blunders (the saddest of which is the utter failure to influence Iran, and the corresponding advantage taken by Tehran-backed militias) do not relieve us of a responsibility that is either insufficiently stressed or else passed over entirely: What is to become, in the event of a withdrawal, of the many Arab and Kurdish Iraqis who do want to live in a secular and democratic and federal country? We have acquired this responsibility not since 2003, or in the sideshow debate over prewar propaganda, but over decades of intervention in Iraq's affairs, starting with the 1968 Baathist coup endorsed by the CIA, stretching through Jimmy Carter's unforgivable permission for Saddam Hussein to invade Iran, continuing through the decades of genocide in Kurdistan and the uneasy compromise that ended the Kuwait war, and extending through 12 years of sanctions and half-measures, including the "no-fly" zones and the Iraq Liberation Act, which passed the Senate without a dissenting vote. It is not a responsibility from which we can walk away when, or if, it seems to suit us.
Some time ago, I wrote rather offhandedly that the coalition forces in Iraq act as the defensive militia for those who have no militia. I get e-mails from civilians and soldiers in that country, as well as from its growing number of exiles, and this little remark generated more traffic than I have had in a while. Just look at the report in the Oct. 30 New York Times about the kidnapping of an Iraqi-American Army interpreter in the (still) relatively civilized Baghdad neighborhood of Karada. A few days earlier, according to the residents who tried with bare hands to stop the abduction, the same gang had been whipping teenage boys with cables for the crime of wearing shorts. (It is always useful to know what is on the minds of the pious.) A Sunday Washington Post headline referred to the "tipping point" in the erosion of congressional support for the Iraq intervention. Well, the "tipping point" between the grim status quo in Karada and its full-scale Talibanization is rather more acute. And does anyone want to argue that a Talibanized Iraq would not require our attention down the road if we left it behind us?
There are many different plans to reconfigure forces within Iraq and to accommodate, in one way or another, its increasingly tribal and sectarian politics. (Former Ambassador to Croatia Peter Galbraith's suggestion, arising from his admirable book The End of Iraq, involves a redeployment to the successful and peaceful north, with the ability to answer requests for assistance from the central government and the right to confront al-Qaida forces without notice.) But all demands for an evacuation are based on the fantasy that there is a distinction between "over there" and "over here." In a world-scale confrontation with jihadism, this distinction is idle and false. It also involves callously forgetting the people who would be the first victims but who would not by any means be the last ones.
 
Two Choices

1. Occupy Iraq until militant Islamic fundamentalists no longer exist.

2. Leave and let those who live there choose what they want and enforce it themselves.

The problems in Iraq can not be solved by US troops and we have no reached the point where Iraq is the destination hot spot for terrorists on holiday. Sound bites of "They hate freedom" aside they are flooding into Iraq because we are there. We need to scale back to an eventual withdrawl. Leave whatever weapons and equipment the elected Iraqi gov't requests and provide intelligence and logisitical support but US troops acting as living mione detectors for IEDs is not the long term solution.
 
Many of us are not war weary, nor advocate withdrawing from Iraq. We just want a different tact in the war such as actully putting enough warfighters on the ground to be effective and contol the fires that always seem to be shifting troops from emergency to emergency and better solutions instead of killing them all and let God sort them out planning.
 
Muskateer,

We need to scale back to an eventual withdrawl. Leave whatever weapons and equipment the elected Iraqi gov't requests and provide intelligence and logisitical support but US troops acting as living mione detectors for IEDs is not the long term solution

That sounds like the same lies we told the South Vietnamese before we left them to the wolves.

Eghad,

Many of us are not war weary, nor advocate withdrawing from Iraq. We just want a different tact in the war such as actully putting enough warfighters on the ground to be effective and contol the fires that always seem to be shifting troops from emergency to emergency and better solutions instead of killing them all and let God sort them out planning.

If the Generals want more troops, I totally agree that we should send more troops.
 
In answer to the original question, I'll put it bluntly: Who cares?
They do not pay our taxes and our armed forces are not sworn to protect them. The American military's job is to fight on behalf of American interests.
If that conflicts with theirs....sucks to be them.
 
So, we tell these people we will help them; encourage them to come forward despite death threats from all sides; promise them we will protect them, and then abandon them to be slaughtered when we get bored. Brilliant, far-sighted strategy you have there.:rolleyes:
 
So, we tell these people we will help them; encourage them to come forward despite death threats from all sides; promise them we will protect them, and then abandon them to be slaughtered when we get bored. Brilliant, far-sighted strategy you have there.

In case you didn't notice, the Iraqis are slaughtering each other now, with our troops there. I'm not bored with the war, I just don't think there is anyone in that country that is worth a drop of our soldiers blood. They want freedom, let them fight for it themselves.
 
If the Democrats win, I figure I will just convert. At least the Muslims have sense enough to be on their own side.
 
That sounds like the same lies we told the South Vietnamese before we left them to the wolves.

Awesomesauce. Leaving Vietnam was the only good thing we could have done in that situation.
 
So, we tell these people we will help them; encourage them to come forward despite death threats from all sides; promise them we will protect them, and then abandon them to be slaughtered when we get bored. Brilliant, far-sighted strategy you have there.
Hey, this wasn't my brilliant far-sighted plan. *My* brilliant far-sighted plan was to not invade in the first place. Since it wasn't *my* plan they decided to go with, *I* said they should've gone in with more troops. They decided not to. *I* advocated doubling our troop strength there. They didn't do it. *I* advocated bringing our troops out of the cities to act as a rapid response force for the Iraqis. They didn't do it.
Since it's so apparent that the white house isn't paying me any attention, please stop blaming me for their failures.

Here's something for you to ponder on your way to the mosque: The legitemately elected government in Iraq now answers to Muqtada Al-Sadr. They are now a satellite state of Iran. Our people fought and performed admirably at the lower levels but it all amounted to nothing because there was no top-level plan.
We need to quit wasting American lives, equipment, and capital on this failed venture and rebuild our military so we can face the coming enemy. Not that they'll listen to me this time either :rolleyes: ...
 
This is much more simple than people make it. Stay and fight Muslim extremists over there, or leave and fight them here. If we cut and run Al Quida will, for the first time, have an entire country to train in, (Iraq), and another country to fund them, (Iran). More Americans will die if we run than if we fight. These people want nothing from us. They simply want to exterminate us. Bill T.
 
For the first time The Base will have an entire country to themselves?

Are you not counting the Sudan, or Afghanistan, or the tribal region of Pakistan, or the money from the Saudi royal family?
 
"Are you not counting the Sudan, or Afghanistan, or the tribal region of Pakistan, or the money from the Saudi royal family?"

Sure, but thats nothing compared to what Iraq with an open border to Iran can, and will provide. We are all over Pakistan like stink on dog crap. Money from the Saudi's is sporadic, and being monitored by us. Thus far, (5 years since 9/11), they haven't been able to do crap. If we run that will change quickly. Bill T.
 
Awesomesauce. Leaving Vietnam was the only good thing we could have done in that situation.

How about restarting the B-52 campaigns that forced the North Vietnamese to the table? How about targetting the industries in the North? Either of those would have been more effective than helping to cause the problem and then deciding we didn't want to be there anymore, and let the problem (which we were responsible for) kill millions.

Of course, concerning Iraq, Pelosi has said peace won't be achieved until the US pulls out. Exactly what kind of peace that is (peace of the dead or peace of the subjugated) is unknown.
 
"How about restarting the B-52 campaigns that forced the North Vietnamese to the table? How about targetting the industries in the North? Either of those would have been more effective than helping to cause the problem and then deciding we didn't want to be there anymore, and let the problem (which we were responsible for) kill millions."

Last I recall the Viet Cong didn't fly jets into our buildings and kill 3,000 of our civillians on our own soil. But hey, what would that matter? Bill T.
 
"At least the Muslims have sense enough to be on their own side." Bravo!

Some would say that our country would not have gotten its start if it weren't for the assistance of European allies at the time. I want to give Iraq the opportunity to get their start with a more democratic form of government. They don't have to be our friends, but I would prefer it so.

For the anti-war faction, the same thing will happen to Iraq that happened to South Vietnam when we retreated (read redeployment) from their country. Different situation, but the result will be the same. One difference is that the war is with religious fanatics (from our perspective), and they intend to spread radical Islam worldwde. They are achieving their objectives. Those objectives are not consistant with our beliefs and way of life. A recent poll indicated that 70% of Americans believe there will be a worldwide war between radical Islam and and "the Western nations". (I saw this on the news.) From my perspective, this war started with the bombing of the US Marine barracks in Beirut (1982, I believe) and it took until 9-11-2001 for many American leaders to finally take it seriously. Unfortunately, many still do not take it seriously. (Oh, can't happen here.) Serious it is! A reasonable comparison may be made with WWII era Japan and our fight in the Pacific.

I like to compare our tactics in Iraq with Star Trek TV show.... fighting the Borg. We need to keep rotating our phaser frequencies. It took a while to figure out tactics that work, but we'll get there with the radical faction of Islam. This war is likely to last decades and Iraq is the time and place that the US decided to start the fight. It is only the beginning.

Patience is a virtue. Let's be patient.
 
"At least the Muslims have sense enough to be on their own side."

Don't bet on it. $hities are killing Sunni's. Republicans haven't got around to killing Democrats as of yet. Bill T.
 
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