If one wants an RKBA president, it's time to cut down the field to One!

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Glenn E. Meyer

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Listening to the talking heads this morning, I've come to the opinion that the only way to get to a president with a decent opinion on the RKBA is too support George W in a decisive manner and get the others out of the field.

It is clear that a Democratic victory will bring more defeats for the RKBA. Watching John Podesta just laugh at the suggestion that smart guns would put at risk wives who might need to use the husband's gun for self-defense made me shudder. He said we should really think about saving the children and the police offer whose gun is taken from him. About 50
cops are killed each year. 4000 women prevent rape with guns. How many would be at risk
with a hubby only smart gun?

I watched McCain - boy - does he have weird affect. They were talking about the Cuban kid and he was smiling happily at all the wrong places. He then went on a riff about how tax cuts should go only to the poor. Screw him.
My parents didn't graduate high school. My mother grew up in an orphanage before the days of big taxes. Now that I am making a decent salary - am I a cash cow? Cut the damn government.

McCain is no friend to the RKBA either. The man thinks he will take over the Dole wing of the party.

Forbes looks like a melted plastic Frankenstein doll. He spouts bizaare phrases
and looks like the sequel to Chuckie Runs For President. He was asked about the SC flag issue and went into a robotic tirade about how as long as Old Glory flies blah blah.

Finally, he said it was up to the people of SC but the verbal path he took convinces me that he will go over with the general public like an iceberg to the Titanic. His positions on abortion will not attract any centrist votes.
If you care about that more than the RKBA, you have to enter that in your evaluation of the election outcomes.

Forbes is also quite egocentric. While Dole was a loser, Forbes was willing to savage him for his own gain. He is willing to do that to Bush so that if he (Forbes) loses, Bush is hurt. I get a feel that he would enjoy that.

Keyes, Bauer and Hatch are marginal. They may be entertaining to watch but could not carry the general election.

Bush has the most reasonable demeanor and presentation for the general election. He would not be an automatic losing candidate for Hispanic minorities as the others might be.

He has been pro-gun in TX (except unless you
are one who denounces CHLs) as compared to
most big name Republican governors. I don't feel that he would be a part of an anti-gun effort. Perhaps he would learn from the mistakes of his father on these issues.

He is not seen as anti-women. His position on abortion is not an automatic disqualification.

To conclude: it is to our RKBA benefit to quickly eliminate the others from the race and prepare to face Gore or Bradley by a clever appeal to the centrist vote and preserving the RKBA.

Such a platform would argue that:

1. Existing laws are adequate to do the job
2. CHLs and self-defense data are convincing
that law-abiding citizens need firearms
and use them successfully.

In a second term, perhaps proactive steps could be taken. Maybe earlier with the right
Congress.

It is not the time to vote for losers and
then complain about the result.

The Votes Are in the Center
 
Glenn,

We live only a few miles apart but have a great difference of opinion when
it comes to Little George.

GW was pro-gun and promised to bring in CHL in order to whip the
incumbent tyrant Ann Richards. GW is not pro-gun. He repeatedly states
his intent to institute more gun control. Though he is less anti-gun than
Sarah Brady, Bush is not “pro-gun” nor will he be an RKBA President.

The ONLY Republican nominee who is pro-gun is Dr. Alan Keyes.

If GW becomes President, even if Keyes becomes Vice President, I will
make a $100 bet with you that Bush will sign further restrictions on our
Right to Keep and Bear Arms!

If you MUST have someone from the less Socialist wing of the Democratic
Party, please support Keyes.

Otherwise, if you want an “RKBA President” there is nobody offered by the
Republicans.

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Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
 
Keyes is pro. Junior isn't ("reasonable restrictions... remember that from just a few months ago?").

Harry Browne and Don Gorman, who are the LP's leading contenders, are pro. Being Libertarian, they see RKBA as unquestionable and absolute (and please spare me the circular-logic of viable candidates).

If Junior wins, we'll see, at best, minor continued infringements. At worst, he'll start by banning all full-cap mags, which he's already stated he'll do. You call that pro-gun?

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"If your determination is fixed, I do not counsel you to despair. Few things are impossible to diligence and skill. Great works are performed not by strength, but perseverance."
-- Samuel Johnson
 
Gentlemen,
If I may respectfully disagree with you and side with Glenn on this one. I'm in favor of picking 'none of the above' as well. Realistically, GWB, with Keyes as VP, is our best hope for now. IMHO
What are our chances with either Gore or Bradley? Slim or none come to mind...

Dennis, I'll take you up on your wager, but not for $. How about a couple of cases of your Shiner for all my ol' Pat Buchanan campaign buttons? ;)


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...save the 2nd., for it saves us all.
No fate but what we make...

[This message has been edited by foxfire (edited January 16, 2000).]
 
Foxfire,

Hilarious! I'm cracking up here! I'd like sharing a case of Shiner Bock with you, but I would hate to win all those Buchanan buttons!! :D
------

All,

I have less problem with people supporting Li'l George if the supporters admit he's anti-gun. But I gag when people call him pro-gun because of his strategy to unseat Gov. Richards.

Obviously GW is not *AS* anti-gun as anyone the Socialists..., er,... the Democrats would offer us, but GW still supports gun control - he has said so repeatedly! (pant! pant!)

(Calmly now.) I am truly frustrated and feel betrayed that gun owners and Second Amendment advocates refuse to unite and support a true RKBA candidate.

Obviously I'd prefer a Libertarian. If that's not viable (Hi, el Jefe!), then at least support Keyes! Not just at the primary, but also with our correspondence to every Republican we can find (including those running against him), the Republican National Committee, Letters to the Editor, etc.

Dr. Alan Keyes is the only pro-gun candidate in the Republocrat Party. With him as President, we would have control over that bully pulpit! Think of the Supreme Court Judges Keyes would nominate! Real Constitutional scholars! We knows, perhaps Li'l George would even learn something about the U.S. Constitution....

80,000,000 gun owners, and we can't get half of them to vote for their freedom. It's shameful.

------------------
Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
 
If there is anything to guide us in our pursuit to restore freedom in this great nation, it's the main stream media. That's right! Make your decision based on what the main stream media spills into America's naive brains and take exactly the OPPOSITE approach, and you will be on the right track to freedom restoration.

In this case, the left wing establishment plays us all like a rare violin, handing us candidates that will all deliver the inevitable leftist agenda, regardless of their rhetoric or platform. Alan Keyes is the most likely Republican candidate in the group to bail first. So forget about him. The establishment has the two players all picked out for us, Gore and Bush, so save your breath about the others.

The restoration of freedom will require the talents of a candidate that is clearly opposed by the mainstream media. One that they ignore and hope will go away. One that they know is the biggest threat to the leftist agenda yet. That candidate is Pat Buchannon.

They have ignored the Libertarian party, along with any of their potential candidates, and squashed the ability of any of them to effectively get their message to the American public. This is the reason that we should be backing this party's candidate.

Listen to Pat Buchannon's stance on American sovereignity, freedom, Bill of Rights, global organizations, and foreign policy and you cannot help but support him.

The race for the presidency has become a side show between career politicians vying for the opportunity to grab the golden ring. Many Americans have unfortuneately jumped on board for the ride, completely forgetting what needs to be done to restore our freedoms in this country. Someone needs to let the hot air out of Washington D.C., because the balloon has expanded far to wide. No career politician will ever return our freedom, we need a man with guts, determination, and principle.

Look away from the candidates offered. Look at the ones they don't want us to hear from, and that is who we really need in that office.
 
It's only fair to evaluate GWB by what he actually pushes for- so here it is, taken from his own website:

----------

Supports stronger enforcement of existing gun laws, would provide more funding for aggressive gun law enforcement programs such as Project Exile in Richmond, Virginia
Supports automatic detention for kids who commit crimes with guns
Supports requiring instant background checks at gun shows by allowing gun show promoters to access the instant check system on behalf of vendors
Supports law-abiding American's constitutional right to own guns to protect their families and home
Supports the current ban on automatic weapons
Supports banning juveniles from possession of semi-automatic "assault" weapons
Supports increasing the minimum age for possession of a handgun from 18 to 21
Supports banning the importation of foreign made, "high-capacity" ammunition clips
Supports voluntary safety locks
Opposes government mandated registration of all guns owned by law abiding citizens

----------

As a twenty year old handgun owner, I despise his belief that I should be a criminal for owning a pistol.
 
I would not hedge my bets with GWB. Like his father he will change his mind on a lot of issues. He's a politician and will say what is required to get into office. He has already reversed himself on quite a few issues, depending on the crowd at hand. He may be better than Gore adn any other liberal putz the DNC can muster, but he will continue to erode the Constitution. I'd vote for Keys as president, but I am planing on voting Libertarian even if they "dont have a chance". As always I vote my conscience and not because I want to vote for the winner.

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If stupidity hurt, most government officials would be in agony.
 
I'm with you, Coinneach.

GWB is a conservative, which means he wants to CONSERVE the system, with a few minor changes here and there. How can any thinking person want to perpetuate a system that is rotten from top to bottom? I'm not saying the original intent of the founding fathers is bad, far from it. But self-serving politicians have so corrupted this country and its political system that it's little more than a straight democracy, rather than a representative republic, which was the original intent.

I also understand the "thinking" that goes something like this: "GWB may not be the ideal candidate, but he is the most viable and, therefore, we should all rally behind him. If we don't, look at the alternative." Now THERE is a principled argument to vote for GWB! Vote for GWB because he doen't suck as bad as the other guy. With thinking like this, we are all doomed to having not only our gun rights suppressed, but all of our other rights. Those who support GWB are living in a fool's paradise if they think he's going to be in their corner when the going gets rough, such as if another big (as in many victims), senseless act of violence occurs involving guns.

Remember, the Republicans have been around for a long time; they have helped to preside over the ever-increasing tyranny of our government. They are no friends of freedom. Sure, we may win some battles here and there, but we're losing the war. Does anybody reading this really believe that the overall trend ISN'T toward more and more infringements upon our rights?

Granted, the Libertarian party doesn't have a prayer of winning this year's presidential election (things will have to become much worse than they are now, and they will, before that happens), but so what? I'm voting for the LP anyway. I just can't bring myself to vote for more of the same medicine that's killing our country. I'll stand by my principles (true freedom for all to find their own way to Heaven or hell as each individual sees fit--as long as they're not trampling on another's rights) to the bloody end.
DAL

P.S. Coinneach, what is the LP doing from the other end of the line, meaning, are they organizing grass-roots campaigns? Aiming for the White House is fine, but real change is going to have to come from the bottom up, not the other way around.

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Reading "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal," by Ayn Rand, should be required of every politician and in every high school.



[This message has been edited by DAL (edited January 17, 2000).]
 
New Bush campaign slogan:

"Bush Junior, Less Anti-Gun Than Sarah Brady"



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Keep yer stick on the ice.
 
Keyes is not the only pro-gun canidate.

Gary Bauer on Second Amendment Rights

"I fully support the right of the people to keep and bear arms which is guaranteed by the Second Amendment of the U.S. Constitution. Like many law abiding gun owners, I'm alarmed by the growing encroachment of government on this individual freedom. We must remember gun ownership is a right guaranteed by the Constitution. As president I will protect and defend this right."


Steve Forbes

"Steve Forbes believes that all law-abiding American citizens have a Constitutional right to legally protect themselves, their loved ones and their property. He supports the Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms. He supports the national instant check system to prevent felons from purchasing guns. He supports automatic jail time for any criminal who attempts to buy a gun, and automatic jail time for anyone possessing a gun in the commission of a crime."


Contrast these two to Bush's position statement. Bush uses the word "ban" three times...

[This message has been edited by BTR (edited January 17, 2000).]
 
Just watched Bradley want to register all handguns to save the children.

Do you want him? Do you really think
Keyes or Bauer has a chance?

Bush with a GOP congress is better than
Bradley or Gore with a Dem congress.

While you list Bush's positions -
let me give you the Dem one:

NO guns for you!
 
Even in a calm moment of introspection I am not able to understand those
who advocate giving up “just a bit more” freedom rather than making an
honest attempt to regain our freedoms at the ballot box.

Not long ago, a TFLer exclaimed his disdain and disgust for the preceding
generation who empowered our government and weakened our people. Yet
the current generation fights to wallow in the same dung-filled trail!

We continue to argue about matters we can not solve now because we have
too little power. We divide and weaken ourselves with our disagreements.
Then, with the back of our hands dramatically pressed to our uplifted brow,
we advocate more losses of freedom in the name of precluding tyranny.

We feed our freedoms to our monstrous government hoping to satisfy the
insatiable. We are feeding our childrens’ freedoms to the dogs of government, or worse - perhaps to the dogs of war.

To the critic of the WWII generation I say this. Future generations will hate
you, young man. You are far more guilty than were your predecessors.

The WWII generation foolishly but honestly believed their government and
gave up freedoms in the name of order and charity. The present generation
recognizes the perfidy of the elitists but supports them out of fear, inertia,
personal benefit, or a misguided effort to minimize damage that could be
avoided.

If I may paraphrase the youngsters of the ‘60s,

“Giving up freedoms to preserve freedoms is like (bleep)ing for virginity!”


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Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!



[This message has been edited by Dennis (edited January 18, 2000).]
 
Dennis, I am the "young man" (is 30 really that young?) you were speaking of and I realize that you are correct. I do have hope though. Lot of libertarians out there, and the message is comming out. Listened to Walter E. Williams again today, and he'll be on again tomorrow. He's sitting in for Rush Limbaugh so listen to him. I'm doing my damndest to straighten out my generation and so I'll leave you to fix yours. As you know, I'm working on my teachers cert. and will hopefully have an impact on at least 100 kids a year. I tried running for office this year on the LP ticket, but Gillespie County has no LP chair, so now I am becoming the LP chair. I speak (a lot) about liberty to everyone I know, and by golly I even have converted a few people over to our cause. This has become my purpose in life, and I now have reason to get up in the mornings with a smile. I think that Keyes is the hope we have left, and if we're lucky, he'll select Congressman Ron Paul for his VP! Now go gettum.
 
Yikes! Sorry, KJ, I didn’t mean to get personal. But it goes to show 30 is a lot
younger than *I* am - I had NO idea who said it. The idea sure rang a bell with
me though.

Congratulations on your involvement in politics and especially (ahem!) in the
proper Party!

Starting with the kids in school is the best way to turn this country around. I sure
do wish you the best of luck. I’ll keep banging away out here....

A Keyes/Paul ticket in the Republican Party. Hoo boy! Can you imagine the
debates???

I’m going to bed and dream of THAT one!!


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Either you believe in the Second Amendment or you don't.
Stick it to 'em! RKBA!
 
The only real hope for the RKBA (and a consitutional government) is the success of the Libertarian Party. Despite the media blackout of our candidates and initiatives, and in Massachusetts of all places, we are coming on strong:
http://www.la-ma.org/libcan2000.htm

By running lots of candidates, even if just to get on the ballot, gives us exposure and recruitment opportunities. We have been doubling membership every election cycle, and we hope to top even that this go around. It's time to take back our government, and return to the rule of law. And I feel strongly that only the Libertarian Party can achieve this.

Jim Condit
Candidate,
Representative 27th Middlesex
 
jimc_617, I couldn't agree more.
DAL,
Former Republican

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Reading "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal," by Ayn Rand, should be required of every politician and in every high school.
 
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