Hunting conversion - mosin nagant 91/30 vs swiss k31

B

BigMike349

New member
I'm looking to purchase one of these fine rifles and do a hunting conversion for a more sporty look (new stock, add a scope). I've seen more modern conversions for the mosin, you can get mosin ammo cheap and I wouldn't feel as bad converting one as opposed to something more valuable like a k 31 but I hear the k31 is more accurate, a better design and not much more expensive. What would you say would be the best bang for my buck?

Feel free to suggest another rifle if you think there is a better option out there for me to look into.

Thanks in advance!
 
No question that the K-31 is much more refined, more accurate weapon- and also 2-3 times the price of the 91/30.

The GP-11 ammo is still a great value at $.55/round for target, but you'll pay more for hunting ammo unless you reload.

Not aware of aftermarket stocks for it, and scope conversions are limited- Swiss Products has a clamp-on, and a drill and tap side mount. I have the d&t mount, but the clamp-on supposedly works well. Whatever scope mount you use on the K-31 it's an offset mount because of the top eject.

I'm (obviously) a fan of the Mosin-Nagant platform- but you can't compare it on any level with the K-31. It's in another league. OTOH, you can't do "as much" with the K-31 on the customization side as with the Mosin.
 
I would look on Gun Broker and see what you can find already "sportized". There are always some M1917 Enfields with custom stocks also.

Doug
 
best bang for your buck would be a rem 700 ADL, savage axis or ruger american. I tried to do the same thing to a mosin nagant and failed miserably. there is just no cost effective way to make a decent sporter out of them. either you spend a lot of money making a decent sporter or you end up going the cheap route and end up with a cheap piece of junk. there is no middle ground.

the cheap mosin ammo is going to be hotter than any hunting ammo available so you're not going to be able to switch back and forth without a resight. the surplus stuff aint very accurate and the hunting stuff is in no way cheap and there are very few premium bullet selections for it.
 
Samco global also had smoe yugo mauser barreled actions in stock. Grab one of those and a stock from boyds and all you need is a scope mount and any 2 piece mod 98 base should work.
 
There's been a Sporterized K-31 at my LGS for ..... 2, maybe 3 years now .... $350OTD, with dies, brass, and some loaded ammo. ..... no takers. I'd buy it, save for the goofy bore diameter ...... that, and I need another oddball caliber like I need a third big toe.......

http://www.thebh.com/

I have a couple of mosins , and one is a parts gun (not collectable) ....though it does shoot pretty well as is ...... it shoots better than I can see.

I'm thinking of putting a pistol scope on it like this guy did:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49iG-i_Mi84
 
Goofy bore diameter................... like .308?
Click to expand...


The original bullet diameter for the M11 7.5 Swiss round (7.5 Schmidt-Rubin) is .306" (some of my sources list .307"), as opposed to .308" .... .308" bullets can be made to work, true ..... but couple that with the rifles they are chambered in- straight pulls in which the case head is not fully supported- ....... to my mind, that's just not something I want to mess with ....
 
jimbob, not everything is exactly down to the thousandth. some of those rifles were slightly overbored, some slightly underbored. 7.62 tokarev has a 307 diameter barrel and I have seen numerous reloading manuals list either tokarev or 7.5 swiss data involving 308 diameter bullets. they may be a little tight in the bore but if it was really as dangerous as you think it is to load 308 bullets in a 306-307 bore then reloading authorities would not list such data in the first place.
 
I can understand the Rus not having an exact bore diameter. Mosins with bore daimeters in the range of .310-.314" They also built the gun robust enough to not come apart unless SERIOUSLY overpressured: a full case of 2400 won't completely destroy one.

The Swiss? Germans make fun of Swiss meticulouslness.

"like a swiss watch" ring a bell?.

I know .308" bullets should work .... I also know that when you exceed the design parameters of a peice of German equipment, things can go pear shaped quickly .... I'm not going to be putting oversize bullets in a 50+ year old straight pull bolt action .....it'd be like putting an extra-power spring in a swiss watch with the caution - "carefull, don't wind it too tight."

Why spend 350 bucks on something that you have to be so carefull with, can't get proper bullets and brass for easily .....not to mention repair parts ...

For the same money, I could get something a whole lot easier to feed and maintain.
 
Why spend 350 bucks on something that you have to be so carefull with, can't get proper bullets and brass for easily .....not to mention repair parts ...
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someone paying $1,000 for an M1 garand comes to mind... can't feed them modern factory ammo unless it's been made specifically for that rifle. the fact of the matter is that 306 is the measurement from the lands not the grooves. the actual bore diameter is quite a bit bigger(up to .13 or .319 total). since these are military rifles, chances are that they have been shot quite a bit and the diameters are no longer 306 but worn closer to 308. a 308 diameter bullet is not going to make contact with the entire bore and therefore will not create any serious pressure build up. you may get slightly under spec velocities but considering all published data for the 7.5 uses 308 anyway you would be golden. if you have a pristine bore your rifling may wear faster than otherwise but the difference is negligible. there is no problem at all loading 308 into a barrel with 306 lands.

as for no easily found brass, here's the result of 37 seconds of searching.
midwayusa's got it
 
Jimbob, he is right. I have been shooting a Schmidt-Rubin 1889 and a couple of k-31's for about 20 years. When I first got the 1889 (pre-internet) I looked high and low for 7.5mm bullets (I took the designation literally) and ended up with some .300 caliber Hornady Carcano bullets. When I couldn't find any more I tried some lead cast bullets that I used in my 30-30. They worked fine although I admit to firing the first couple with a lanyard. Finally, Al Gore invented the Internet and I learned that regular .308 bullets are used by nearly everyone. I have not looked back. I don't know anyone who has slugged the bore of a K-31 but I can attest to about 1000 rounds through mine without any issues.

BTW - Now I buy factory Prvi ammo for the brass. They use .308 bullets.
 
tobnpr said:
No question that the K-31 is much more refined, more accurate weapon- and also 2-3 times the price of the 91/30.

The GP-11 ammo is still a great value at $.55/round for target, but you'll pay more for hunting ammo unless you reload.

Not aware of aftermarket stocks for it, and scope conversions are limited- Swiss Products has a clamp-on, and a drill and tap side mount. I have the d&t mount, but the clamp-on supposedly works well. Whatever scope mount you use on the K-31 it's an offset mount because of the top eject.

I'm (obviously) a fan of the Mosin-Nagant platform- but you can't compare it on any level with the K-31. It's in another league. OTOH, you can't do "as much" with the K-31 on the customization side as with the Mosin.
Click to expand...

2-3 times the cost would be a big deal if a Mosin were more expensive. 129 for a mosin and 250 for a k31 is not that bad to me. After market stocks are made for the k31 by boyds. I think their laminate Monte Carlo style is really cool looking. Also, you can get a top scope mount from rock solid industries, but it will cost as much as the rifle.
 
Call me wishy washy, but I agree with both of you.
Old military rifles, and my favorite - the K-31, make wonderful range day guns, and are great fun to show to folks.
But, with all the newly minted budget priced rifles now being made, why do things the hard way?
For what - a couple of hundred dollars more or even less, there's all kinds of modern rifles available, using commonly found ammo and scope mounts.
 
Thanks for your input so far. I definitely don't want to buy a surplus rifle that is already sporterized. Personally I would rather build my own over time, spreading the cost out. Also, if the price is comparable I would prefer to build my own dream rifle, instead of settling for someone else's design.

I do realize that I could get an inexpensive, modern made rifle instead...but that's just not what I'm interested in. I do appreciate the recommendations though, and If I did go that route, I would probably get a Ruger American.

There is something about customizing a really good design that just appeals to me. Maybe the nostalgia...I'm a sucker for that.

from what I've heard so far...

Mosin - easier/less expensive to modify/accessorize. Would make a decent, but not great hunting rifle if calibrated for hunting rounds. If not calibrated for hunting, it will end up being a fancy mosin for just throwing cheap ammo at targets. could be more trouble then it is worth.

K31 - excellent and unique design, supurb accuracy. slightly more expensive. also more expensive to modify. would make a much better investment. more practical hunting applications due to quality

I'm definitely leaning more toward the K31. With further research, the stock iron sights are very good so I'm figuring if I wanted to I could use the rifle as is (maybe with a new stock) for hunting while I saved for a scope and "top of the line" mount.

I also saw a Mauser was recommended, but no supporting evidence as to how it is any better than either of these 2 rifles.

Let the debate continue...
 
Call me wishy washy, but I agree with both of you.
Old military rifles, and my favorite - the K-31, make wonderful range day guns, and are great fun to show to folks.
But, with all the newly minted budget priced rifles now being made, why do things the hard way?
For what - a couple of hundred dollars more or even less, there's all kinds of modern rifles available, using commonly found ammo and scope mounts.
Click to expand...

Maybe I'm young and stupid
Maybe I'm a complete sucker for nostalgia
Maybe I want the feeling of self accomplishment that comes with making somthing to my own specifications

or maybe I just think that this:

http://tinyurl.com/q9vvhyh

Looks a hell of alot better than any of the cheap stuff on the market today.
 
I also saw a Mauser was recommended, but no supporting evidence as to how it is any better than either of these 2 rifles.
Click to expand...
1. well, depending on the kindof mauser it is, some some manufactured in way more numbers than the swiss so it would upset less collectors, not that most people decide what gun to get based on what other people will think of them.

2. you are starting very basic, a barreled action, you won't have a bunch of spare parts laying around when you are done, it also give you more incentive to go more custom since you already have to decide on every single part.

3. 8mm is a little more readily available and slightly cheaper but if you reload there are way more premium bullet options in 308 than 323.

4. more aftermarket options for the mauser.

all that aside there are few advantages of a mauser. both are very refined designs and 7.5 has better ballistics over range.
 
3. 8mm is a little more readily available and slightly cheaper but if you reload there are way more premium bullet options in 308 than 323.
Click to expand...

There are Mausers in other calibers than 8MM ..... 7x57 being the most common.
 
Boyd's stock looks great. I didn't know they made these. I have 2 Boyd stocks, one for my M1 and another on a CZ .22. The brown laminate matches my two Remington 700's and I see one in my future to replace my beech stocked K-31. Thanks for the tip. I have a beech and a walnut. The down side of the K-31's is the weight. I think the Boyd stock may drop a pound or two from the Swiss one.
 
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