How To Stop California Confiscation

Gary H,

I think the idea of registering now so that you can continue to shoot your AR is a short-term solution, at best. I expect that you will not have long to continue to legally shoot it, anyway.

You may be dismissing the idea of "burying" them too quickly. If you think an AR will have value as a defense weapon to you in the future, I expect that this is the only way you're going to be able to keep one. Enjoy shooting something else, and know that your AR is there for you when you need it.

I expect that when you register the gun it will be worthless. As some poster's have said, this is going national. California is simply leading the way. I don't claim to be an expert, but it seems to me that registration just helps make your gun more tracable at a later time even if it is out of state.

You've defined an interesting problem. You want to keep your gun, and be able to shoot it, all completely legally, even though the laws are being written now to begin the process of making this impossible.

Best of luck to you,


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Brady
(No relation to that $%#$ bill)
 
My last post on this topic.

Everyones point of view is clear. I think that we do what we feel is right. I purchased my first gun eighteen months ago, so I've not had much time to consider these issues and that is why I'm just now coming to the conclusion that I must get politically active. I agree that my approach is a short term issue. In fact, that was the whole purpose of my post. This is a large country and government does many bad things, but that does not mean that my local PD is going to come after me and my family. I guarantee you of one thing, if they do come, neither myself, nor any of you will be in a position to stop them. I just don't believe that it will come to that. If it does come to that, how will all of these very independent, self-reliant gun owners ever become a military force? If you can't become an effective political force, how can you expect to become an effective fighting force. I suggest to you that your chances of success are much greater in the political arena. Also, if you are going to fight the government, please don't post your plans on a public board. It may very well work against your own interest.
 
White Separist sounds and looks like White Supremist. We can get the Blacks to hate good ole Mrs. Weaver also with the right wording.
 
Gary, you can send me your toys but keep in mind that my FFL will have to fill out the forms and if they're pistols I'll have to go get pistol permits. Gee, a record. My state will probably be one of the last to go but we have had a stong influx from the northern states and the MMM is already working on major College towns, it won't be long. I don't think that there is a member here who wouldn't try to help in some way but the states would have to be picked carefully and even with that the Federal legislation would give a paper trail a mile long and they would probably pass some kind of law prohibiting just such a transaction. Your suggestion is a good one in the beginning but in the end you have to get your toys back. Unless you are willing to drive across the country and the "new owner"(in my state) will have to have you get a permit for the pistols, which you can't do because you aren't a resident. If he gives them to you and you go back to Kalifornia and are stopped on the border,he's in trouble when the guns are traced because he is the owner. It ain't gonna happen. This plan won't work Bury your guns or register and allow them to come and get them, then destroy them! That is your choice. If you bury you might be able to set up a range in your basement to practice, but you never know when they're comming so you better bury them. With all the State and Federal laws on the books I dare anyone to say they are not breaking some kind of law. The term "law-abiding" takes on an all new meaning.
 
...but that does not mean that my local PD is going to come after me and my family.

Sorry, but I think you are "dead wrong" on that opinion. They WILL come, as surely as the sun rises, IF you tell them you have evil guns. If you want to "invite" the brutalization of your family by masked gunmen by registering, so be it.

The rest of us are unlikely to follow your example, however.

Not meant as a flame; it's just the objective reality of the way things are...

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"The whole aim of practical politics is to keep the populace alarmed (and hence clamorous to be led to safety) by menacing it with an endless series of hobgoblins, all of them imaginary." - H.L. Mencken
 
Hey Kali folk,

Take the lead from your Canadian brothers and sisters. Simply don't do anything. Don't register, don't turn in your firearms, band together and buy lawyers. Money is tight for most people, but 10,000 people all tossing in to a legal pot $100 adds up to some heavy lawyer bait. FIGHT! FIGHT! FIGHT!

If one half of all the gun owners in Kali, simply stood up with one loud voice and said "NO! DAMN IT!" Those idiots in Sacramento would crap themselves. As long as gun owners keep going their seperate ways, we will loose our freedoms. The skeet and trap boys think they won't be effected because "its only handguns and assualt rifles they want off the street", hunters think that grandpa's old Winchester 30-30 will be safe becasue "No one will ever stop me from hunting...it is my right!" WAKE UP! It is right around the corner and then everyone will look at each other and say "How could YOU let it happen?" Look in the mirror, it all starts with YOU!

The idea of confiscation would be another violation of the Consitution. The seizure of property without just compensation. Take my guns, I'll swear out a warrant for the arrest of the governor for theft of private property. And I will go to every court in the land if I have to to have my day.

As a side note, that someone else mentioned the NRA being too willing to compremise. Yep, they sure did when they were only one million strong. At one million, the NRA didn't have the political juice to really do anything. They were constantly on a defensive posture. I think in a lot of ways, the NRA did the best they could with the political muscle they had to use at the time. When the NRA was only one million strong every time Klinton or Bore opened thier pie holes, they demonized the NRA and its membership. Now the NRA is 4.6 million. Guess what? The Kommander and Thief and his little rat Al haven't said diddle about the NRA. Numbers talk. Large numbers of voters talk even louder. If you don't belong to the NRA or GOA, JOIN NOW! It doesn't cost all that much. A months worth of pocket change will buy you a one year membership.

Okay, the upshot is Patriots of California, unite, practice non-violent civil disobedience, do not register your AR's, do not surrender your property. Pool your resources and hire a lawyer that will fight for your rights.

Second, jump in and get involved. Join the NRA or GOA. Volunteer some time with a candidte that represents your beliefs. Go to a pro-gun rally and be seen and heard.

And, for the love of God and Country VOTE!!!!
If you do not vote, you have absolutly no moral right to complain becasue you are not part of the problem, you are the CAUSE of it.

Whew doggies....did I go off on a rant. Too much coffee today.

Joe Portale
Tucson, AZ

"Cry FREEDOM" - anonymous
 
Gary,

Each of us must do what he feels is right, according to his own mind. If you believe that disarming yourself on the orders of the government is the wise and proper thing to do, then I promise not to try stop you.

I have decided that a different course is needed. While it may well be true that we cannot individually stand off a SWAT team, it does stand to reason that some of our fellow citizens may well seek retribution against the officers responsible for carrying out such actions. If the "boys in blue" understand that there may well be a huge price to be paid for blindly following un-Constitutional orders, then they just might develop enough spine to not do so.

I'm not in any hurry to shoot anyone, or have anyone shoot me. But I will NOT give up my firearms simply because the government says so.

Not now.

Not ever.

And the answer to your question of "how to stop confiscation" is to make them utterly afraid of the consequences of their actions. Yes, it is rapidly coming to the point where we may have to defend our rights in the same manner as Washington and Company once did, though in a much different manner.
 
Gary H., Ruger 45 and All: If you are going to register your AR15, just take it to the smelter today and save the headaches. A year after the detach mag SKS's were registered in Kali, they were banned. The same will happen with each class of registered firearms. If you do not know where this is leading, I suggest you do a little research on Russia in the 20s and Germany in the 30s etc. ***** When the government bans the semi auto rifles, it is time to realize that the purpose of the 2nd amendment being created in the first place is about to come to fruition. As TJ said, the 2nd is the only amendment we will not need until the government tries to abolish it. That time is coming. **** It is a shame that you will not be able to take your AR15 to the range anymore, but so what? Get it zeroed in one last time, get a stock of ammo for it, and start looking for a cache. Burying is a very long term solution which may be wise, but may be too permanent. Take a page from the Irish playbook and scout out some "hides" or caches: old wells, foundations, abandoned barns or factories or junkyards, best if a lot of scrap metal is all over the place naturally. Put your "militia weapon" into a protective sack with ammo and cleaning gear well disguised and and slide the bundle into an old rusty pipe, truck engine, pump housing etc. Tell no one about it. Leave "telltales" to indicate if snoopers have been near. When the time comes, and we will all know when, rise at 0-dark-30, recover the package, and as millions of us swore to do, "defend the constitution against all enemies, foreign AND DOMESTIC, so help me God". Then replace the militia weapon in its cache before dawn and go to work.
 
Well, this is an unfortunate thing...but to quote that @**hole Chairman Mao...Power is in the barrel of a gun" and the govt realizes this and are scared of it. I'm glad they are scared...they need to be. I don't advocate violence, but if it comes down to the LEOs being given orders to confiscate, perhaps they will just become conscientious objectors and refuse, handing in their badges...most cops I know of would never do their friends and family in...and if they did, they deserve to be flogged....my two cents
 
Fish, any LEO's that are going to be confiscating are gonna be on a team and that is a voluntary job the officers can leave the team at anytime. So turning in the badge is a bad Idea when you can just work normal patrol. Let the swat guys that could care less about peoples rights enter peoples homes and take the heat that could result.

As I have said a few times on threads like this. I will register on the first month of sundays.

Again, you dont need to use ffl's out of state to "get rid" of your guns you just use the clinton way "gun show loop hole", done.

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The beauty of the second Amendment is that it is not needed until they try to take it. T JEFFERSON

Do you really think that we want those laws to be observed? We want them broken. We're after power and we mean it. There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breakings laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted-and you create a nation of law breakers--and then you cash in on guilt.
A RAND

Carry concealed so as not to spook the herd. "Some TFL Member?"

Some Problems require an LGM-118A Solution.
 
Although I am very politically active and will continue to be, I do not believe the trend of licensing and confiscation can be stopped without the use of force.

There will be no miracle event that "wakes the people up". Society is on a pre-determined course at this point.

Firearms will be removed from society unless we actually fight for them. Plain and simple.

CMOS

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NRA? Good. Now join the GOA!

The NRA is our shield, the GOA will be our sword.

[This message has been edited by CMOS (edited September 27, 2000).]
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gary H:
My last post on this topic.

This is a large country and government does many bad things, but that does not mean that my local PD is going to come after me and my family. I guarantee you of one thing, if they do come, neither myself, nor any of you will be in a position to stop them. I just don't believe that it will come to that. If it does come to that, how will all of these very independent, self-reliant gun owners ever become a military force? If you can't become an effective political force, how can you expect to become an effective fighting force. I suggest to you that your chances of success are much greater in the political arena. Also, if you are going to fight the government, please don't post your plans on a public board. It may very well work against your own interest.[/quote]

Quite obviously millions of jews (and gypsies and other groups) never _really_ believed that _their_ German government would "come after them" even under Hitler. Else they would have left before it was too late. Such things happen, even in modern democratic western nations like Germany in the 1940s and in modern America. History isn't over.

As for how to become an effective fighting force? Two words: guerilla warfare.

Pistols and icepicks. Do you know how to build a zip gun? How about make improvised explosives and build boobytraps? They're both laughably easy, and the US government even produces manuals telling you exactly how. They're available at most gun shows.

If you learn these things, even if the government _does_ seize all your firearms, you're not out of the game.

I have to agree with those who say, if you're not willing to do something as easy and relatively risk-free as refuse to register your guns, you're kidding yourself if you think you'll actually risk a violent confrontation when they come to _take_ your gun.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by internetfish:
Well, this is an unfortunate thing...but to quote that @**hole Chairman Mao...Power is in the barrel of a gun" and the govt realizes this and are scared of it. I'm glad they are scared...they need to be. I don't advocate violence, but if it comes down to the LEOs being given orders to confiscate, perhaps they will just become conscientious objectors and refuse, handing in their badges...most cops I know of would never do their friends and family in...and if they did, they deserve to be flogged....my two cents[/quote]

"Political power flows from the barrel of a gun," according to Mao. And he's right.

No, most cops _won't_ turn on their family and friends. So what? Neither will most people in _any_ occupation. But anyone organizing confiscation squads who was two brain cells to rub together will do what tyrants have done forever--send you to get _my_ family and friends, and send me to get _yours_. Then we're both enforcing the rules against total strangers.
 
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