How powerful is the NRA and where is it headed

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Thank you, Buzz. I was getting a little tired of the simulated street-brawl with Bill T.

Well, therein lies the rub, right? You're saying to me that the only way to deal with the problem of not wanting to be associated with the negative stereotype is to deal with it and join, right? If I just join up, then I can try to change the stereotype one person at a time, as I meet them and they see that I'm not some war-crazed survivalist stock-piling MRE's and sitting in his radiation-proof basement stroking his latest copy of Soldier of Fortune magazine.

Certainly, other stereotypes (racial, sexist, etc...) have been broken in this way, through slow change, one person at a time. But, it doesn't help the fact that to make this change, I have to actually become affiliated with a stereotype that I do not want to be affiliated with.

If you don't want to be associated, the best way is to be associated??? Is there anything ELSE I can do???
 
"The second one... I don't want to be associated with the negative stereotype."

So you would rather be accepted and loved by gun hating liberals, rather than be a member of a well organized group who is fighting for your Second Ammendment rights? Tell me, should the NRA apologize every time they defeat a liberal gun ban as well??? Bill T.
 
"If you don't want to be associated, the best way is to be associated??? Is there anything ELSE I can do???"

Yes. You can continue to sit on your butt and let others do the dirty work for you.

Tim
 
What if I just tell those who ask, "I own several handguns. I have a conceal-carry permit, and I carry often. And, I'm not one of those "NRA freaks" those guys on the news keep screaming about. I'm a good person, and I have guns."

Is there no merit in this course of action? Or, is this just reinforcing the negative stereotypes of the NRA? In other words, why should I belong to the NRA, rather than just be a good person independent of political affiliation?

(I'm starting to get encouraged, now. The conversation is starting to pick up, and some GREAT points are being made, here. Thank you SO MUCH Tim and Buzz for getting this line moving again!)
 
What if I just tell those who ask, "I own several handguns. I have a conceal-carry permit, and I carry often. And, I'm not one of those "NRA freaks" those guys on the news keep screaming about. I'm a good person, and I have guns."
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If you're telling them you're not an NRA freak, then you're telling them the NRA is composed of freaks. If you are really interested in helping the RKBA movement, destroying the stereotype of the largest and one of the most effective organizations supporting said movement is a great way to do it.
 
What if I just tell those who ask, "I own several handguns. I have a conceal-carry permit, and I carry often. And, I'm not one of those "NRA freaks" those guys on the news keep screaming about. I'm a good person, and I have guns."
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Samuri, I think you put too much stock into what other people think. Look at it this way:

You won't join the NRA because you are afraid of what others will think about you when they discover that you are a member of the NRA. On the other hand, you propose telling folks that you own several handguns and you carry a concealed handgun. How do you think they'll react to that? I'd say that many folks will be far more disturbed to learn that you are carrying a gun vis-a-vis belonging to the NRA.

So I think I'm just not understanding the problem here....

why should I belong to the NRA, rather than just be a good person independent of political affiliation?
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You can belong to the NRA and remain independent of political affiliation. The NRA doesn't just support Republicans. For example, the NRA has endorsed Ben Nelson (a Democrat) over Pete Ricketts (a Republican) in Nebraska's senatorial race.

If you don't want to join the NRA, you could still send a donation to them. I'll presume that they'll take money from non-members. The NRA does a good job defending the 2nd Amendment, and your contribution would help. :)
 
"Why should I belong to the NRA, rather than just be a good person independent of political affiliation?"

Because you accomplish not a damn thing in advancing your cause. Why do you worry so much about the NRA's "Image"?? This is a simple numbers game. The Liberals have well organized, well funded, groups who are out there trying everything they can to take away your right to own a firearm! The NRA fights this. They do a good job. If your not a member then you are simply doing nothing more than was said above, sitting on your butt letting others do your dirty work for you! This work must be done or you'll just wind up being a "good" person who doesn't own any guns. And whats with this "good person" crap anyway? Are you implying that if your an NRA member your "not a good person"? Your one of those people who worrys more about what people think of you, than what you can do. Thats too bad and you help no one in the process, let alone yourself. I can tell by your posts your one of those guys who wants everything sugar coated with a glass of Kool-Aid on the side, or else you feel "offended". Sorry, thats not the way life is. Do you think the liberals will give a damn about how you feel when they take away your guns??? Bill T.
 
Bill, calm down, go back to your basement, eat an MRE, and read your magazine. I'm ignoring you now. You are clearly unable to converse in a civil manner, and I don't believe you're offering anything at all of relevence to this discussion.

Tim and Buzz, any thoughts?
 
Samurai, look at it this way. Why do you own firearms? The public perception of gun owners is about as bad as for the NRA. At least, that's what the media would have you believe. So why do you wish to affiliate yourself with a group with such negative publicity? I presume that it is for two reasons: 1) you don't care what they think because owning firearms is more important than the minimal (if any) impact public perception would have;and 2) you know the stereotype is false.

The NRA is pretty much the same way. The benefits of membership (namely, providing them resources to protect your rights) are great, and the stereotypes are wrong.

The NRA will be working to protect your rights even if you are against it. Why not make its job easier by not working against it?

By the way, do you actually describe the NRA as freaks?

As for further thoughts, we've provided quite a bit to think about. Perhaps it would help if you would articulate your own thoughts on the issue further.
 
Fremmer, I understand your point that we shouldn't be concerned about what others think about us, and that we should do what we feel is right regardless of the social implications. But, in dealing with the NRA, or any other lobbying group, public image is EVERYTHING. That's the whole point of a lobbying group, to put forth the views of its members. My question is, if the public image of the NRA does not reflect my views, then are there any other good reasons to be a member?

Buzz, I think you hit the nail on the head on your last post. You're really starting to win me over on this issue. What you're saying is that if I reject the possibility of being in the NRA and not being a fanatic, then I deny the NRA the opportunity to redeem their public image. Because the NRA is a necessary group that performs a necessary balancing function in the government, it is important that they be an effective lobbying group. And, as such, it is important that I do what I can to help them redeem any negativity that they incur while lobbying for the rights that I enjoy. Is that about right?

Are there any other comments? If not, does anyone know where I can join up?
 
"My question is, if the public image of the NRA does not reflect my views, then are there any other good reasons to be a member?"

This is what scares the living hell out of me far more than any gun grabbing liberal ever could!! Bill T.
 
Samuri, I can tell that Bill has stong feelings about the NRA and this discussion. And I understand Bill's frustration. I'm not trying to criticize you, but I think this is why Bill is frustrated:

The NRA does a lot of good things to help gun owners. They are the only serious lobbying group that stands between you and legislation that will take your guns away from you.

You like guns, and you like shootin' them. We all do. But don't rely on other people (who are not afraid of this purported reaction of hysteria upon discovering that you are a member of the NRA, and which I think is overstated) to help the NRA keep your guns, your mags, and your ammo in your possession. Like semi-automatics, do you? Great. Without the NRA, your mag limit would be 6. Try that out for your 9mm. And you own several handguns? Sounds like an arsenal to me, and a dangerous one at that. The NRA has defeated proposals to require folks like yourself to have an arsenal license (which means you have to disclose all of your guns to the government and then pay a huge tax to keep them in your "arsenal").

He's just frustrated that you like guns but won't help the NRA to defeat the creeping threat of anti-gun legislation. And no, talking to people is not enough. You need to give money (money is the only thing that counts in D.C.) to the NRA so that they can pay people to lobby the congress and enact favorable gun legislation and defeat unfavorable legislation. Lobbying is what works on the Hill, and the NRA does a heck of a job with it.
 
Buzz, I think you hit the nail on the head on your last post. You're really starting to win me over on this issue. What you're saying is that if I reject the possibility of being in the NRA and not being a fanatic, then I deny the NRA the opportunity to redeem their public image, is that right?
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Bingo. You have it exactly right. And it's not just about the NRA redeeming its public image; it's about you helping tell the truth. And ultimately, telling we are always making a decision between telling the truth (the good and the bad) or telling a lie. And our silence is all too often consent to the lie.

As for joining, I hear www.nra.org is a good option for that. ;)
 
I see a life membership is now $750.00. Back in 1976 when I joined for life it was $175.00. Back then I had to make the choice of buying a new shotgun, (which is around what one cost back then), or help the NRA fight to keep the guns I already own. I chose the latter. Today that decision hasen't changed much. Just the value of that same dollar, and the price of that same shotgun and NRA Life Membership. The way I saw it then, without one you wouldn't be able to buy the other. As I said, not much has changed. Bill T.
 
"Tim and Buzz, any thoughts?"

I get tired of flame wars, name-calling, etc. so I am trying to be as cordial as possible, but truth be told, I agree with Bill T 110 percent. It's a game of numbers and dollars, and image has little to do with it. Anyone can join or not, image notwithstanding. In my view, joining helps more than not joining. If you join, you will be villified in the press, and you will receive mailing soliciting donations. You can make your own choice.

Tim
 
Perhaps another question is in order that would be more to the intent of the conversation.

For those who have posted to this topic, and who choose not to join the NRA, tell us what alternate course of action you have taken this election year to promote and protect our second amendment rights?

What specific act can gun owners count on you to have done in support of those rights?

The NRA question would be somewhat mute if non-joiners were opening a second front through a different venue.

But if they are sitting on the sidelines, limiting their efforts to posting to groups such as this one, I am sorely disappointed.
 
I updated my previous post, so I wanted to post it again...

What Buzz has said is that if I reject the possibility of being in the NRA and not being a fanatic, then I deny the NRA the opportunity to redeem their public image. Because the NRA is a necessary group that performs a necessary balancing function in the government, it is important that they be an effective lobbying group. And, as such, it is important that I do what I can to help them redeem any negativity that they incur while lobbying for the rights that I enjoy.

So, regardless of whether the NRA has the "perfect image" for you, and regardless of whether the NRA accurately reflects ALL of your political beliefs, we should all belong to the NRA, because they NEED to represent us, and we need THEM to represent us.

Anyone else?

oh, and p.s. - It's "www.nra.org". If you try "www.nra.com", it won't work. (Thanks, Buzz.)
 
"So, regardless of whether the NRA has the "perfect image" for you, and regardless of whether the NRA accurately reflects ALL of your political beliefs, we should all belong to the NRA, because they NEED to represent us, and we need THEM to represent us."

I couldn't have put it any better! Bravo! Bill T.
 
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