How much do hi-caps matter?

David Scott

New member
In the thread on the HS2000, Makarov has reservations because:

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Don't think high capacity mags will be available to the general public though[/quote]

The question is this: How much does the availability of hi-caps matter to you when considering a new purchase? I understand the moral outrage at the stupid and pointless mag limit, but given that most defensive encounters only expend a couple of rounds, and given that a trained shooter can swap mags quickly, is the difference between 10 rounds in the mag and 14 or 15 really significant enough to make you pass by an otherwise worthy handgun?
 
David, If the user of a particular firearm is
a good shot anyway; then I don't think that
high capacity magazine's are a necessity.
In today's world of autoloader's, one should
be able to take out an adversary with the
"polictally correct" 10 round magazines.
Or better yet, with a 5 shot revolver!!! :)
Just an opinion folk's; what is yours?

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member
 
Hey Dan. Haven't heard much fom you lately. I agree. My carry piece is an S&W pre-agreemant model 49. A 5 shot "J" frame with 125 gr.Plus-P hollowpoints during the "dry" season, and a pre agreement S&W 6906 during our hot humid rainy seasons. The 6906 is hi-cap (12 in the mag and one up the spout, but I would not feel handicapped with 10 and 1.) So the ban on full capacity magazines does not bother me in that aspect. If I can't hit 'em in 5 or 10, I deserve whatever happens to me.
What does bother me, is the arrogence of those jackasses in the Congress who distrust us so much that they wish to restrict out capability to defend ourselves. Apparently, yours and my life are worth less to the than a soldier or LEO. I got news for them. NOT TO ME! I have as much right ti life as they don and seeing as I help pay their over inflated salaries, they'd best be cool. I might vote to fire them, come November.
Paul B.
 
I believe a firearm should have the capacity it is designed to hold. I am a firm believer in hicaps, and I buy them for all my guns. "Better to have them and not need them then to need them and not have them" - my personal motto.
 
I'm with BB. Between my guns, I think I have somewhere around 30 hi-caps. I have often bought hi-caps for guns I didn't even own yet (right now I 3 hi-caps for the 9mm HK USP Compact which I don't own... yet). Just watching the video on the North Hollywood shootout lets you know how important firepower really is. Will I ever be involved in something like that? I hope not. But I'd rather be overprepared than not.

I think it was Shakespeare who said "It is better to have extra rounds and not need them, then not to have had extra rounds at all".... or something like that.
 
I don't carry, so my problem is slightly different. My house gun sits next to another house gun which is also loaded. That said, I use a SIG220 with a 7-rd mag and don't feel underarmed. I usually don't even "top it off" by loading one into the chamber and refilling the mag. 7 rds seems to be good enough for me.
But like you said, it's infuriating to be told that I couldn't have the "real" capacity mags for a gun that's designed to use them!
 
Looking at the 10 round 9mm CZ magazines you will notice that the reduced capacity mags have a plastic hollow box floor plate assembly, that consumes 1/5th of the magazine length.
The metal floor plated, standard capacity magazine seems better engineered.

IMHO as long as you are going to have a full sized grip, it might as well contain a full load of ammo.

If i am going to be limited to only 10 rounds of ammo, then i will take a larger caliber gun with 10 bigger rounds that fill that grip.

dZ
 
Well, I shoot only revolver (8-shot), have about 2 1/2 years shooting experience and about 18 months competition experience. After a bad day (lots of dumb things) I just finished at 36% of the top score in an IPSC competition where ALL the other shooters had autos and over 90 of the 100+ shooters had high cap magazines. Very definitely pre-ban mags--14+.

That is my current level against local club shooters as well.

A fellow revolver shooter in our club who started out the same time I did shoots 6-shot and is up around 45% or better. He practices a lot more than I do and it shows.

So what is a high cap worth? Depends on the shooter.

[This message has been edited by Guy B. Meredith (edited September 27, 2000).]
 
If I had shot ten rounds, and the fight wasn't over, I would be more concerned about drowning in a pool of pee, having exhausted the capacity of my pants...

Munir

[This message has been edited by munir (edited September 27, 2000).]
 
I would not feel underarmed if I had 10 rounds instead of 15. However, I would feel better armed if I had 15 rounds instead of 10.
 
In a personal defense situation, a high capacity mag has never been useful. I have a bunch of them for various weapons, but I'm not kidding myself about their necessity.

ljlc
 
In the words of a World War 2 vet I know when discussing the 1911,"If you can't stop him with 7 rounds you deserve to die."
I don't agree with the dying part but that sums it up well.
Thanks,45automan
 
Like most law abiding firearms owners, I resent the hi-cap ban, because it is so utterly stupid, affects only the law abiding, does nothing to reduce crime or make the U.S.A. any safer, and because those who got it passed act like they've done society such a great favor. What self-serving political ?#!%&@!!

That being said, if my handgun comes with pre-ban magazines which hold more than 10 rounds, I'll use them if I want to, AND I'll load as many rounds in them as I want to, up to their capacity, because that is what they were designed for, and they are legal. If my gun comes with ten-rounders, I don't really feel a pressing need to go out and spend a hundred dollars apiece for hi-caps, because I think the chances of the average citizen ever needing that many rounds are slim to none. If I really felt that I was going into a situation where I might need many rounds, and I couldn't get or afford high capacity magazines, I'd just buy and carry more ten round magazines until I felt I had enough. Like many of you folks here, I've had combat handgun training, and I can keep feeding ten round magazines until I run out of them or the barrel melts, whichever comes first :). For that matter I can pretty much use a revolver with speedloaders the same way...despite lawmakers' best efforts to reduce my ability to defend myself.

It also gives me heartburn that I recently had a conversation with a PA local police officer who believes it is illegal for anyone other than a police officer to load more than 13 rounds in ANY magazine in this state. He indicated that he would arrest anyone (other than a policeman) whom he found with a ANY magazine loaded with more than 13 rounds, and that pre-ban or license to carry didn't make any difference. He said he THOUGHT it was even illegal to load up more than 13 rounds on a range. I asked him politely to cite the statute, and I'm still waiting. It's been a couple of weeks now. (I had a thread going on this subject). Encounters like the one I had with this local officer are almost enough to make me just go back to carring revolvers and speeloaders, just so I wouldn't have to deal with or worry about dealing with getting arrested for a non-crime. He made me feel like a common criminal, which I am not, and to be honest, he scared me.

Sorry, am I ranting? It's just that, even though I don't think it is likely that I would ever need more than a few rounds in a self-defense encounter, and therefore personally feel no great need to carry hi-caps, I don't like being told I CAN'T have them. The hi-cap ban just 'frosts my but-tocks' because it is one more little chip out of our civil rights.

I do not intend to offend anyone. This is just one issue I feel strongly about, because it is a matter of principle.

-10CFR



[This message has been edited by 10CFR (edited September 27, 2000).]
 
It's not that you need "full" capacity magazines, it's just that we've been stuck with "reduced" capacity magazines for full size guns! I don't know what all this "hi-cap" nonsense is, none of my magazines hold more than they were designed to do, so none of them are "hi-cap". Let's not fall into the trap of the anti's and start validating their stupid terms.
 
To recap a previous post, remember the infamous Miami shootout that caused the FBI to change many of its gun policies. Two agents were killed when their revolvers went empty simultaneously. The BG advanced and killed them both while they were reloading.

Granted, its not statistically likely, but I think they would have thought hi-caps were very important.
 
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by branrot:
I have often bought hi-caps for guns I didn't even own yet (right now I 3 hi-caps for the 9mm HK USP Compact which I don't own... yet).[/quote]

That's interesting, considering the USP Compacts came out after the '94 ban. Are you sure they aren't the 15-round USP mags?
 
Dave R.

One correction. The two (2) FBI agents killed in Miami were armed w/ S&W 459s. One agent had fired both of his mags and was killed w/ an empty gun.


More is better but it will not necessarily solve the problem.

FWIW both of my off duty guns do not hold more than eight (8) rounds and I feel safe.

Mike
 
I don't need hi-caps any more than I need my fish/ski boat, my 21-speed bicycle, etc. etc.

What I REALLY don't need is one class of pusillanimous, effete citizens, commonly known as DemocRATs, making decisions about what I need and don't need.

A highly intelligent person, whom I greatly respect, once told me that the greatest insult that one person can heap on another person is to have that other person think that you know how to live that other person's life better than the other person does. Ain't that what this is all about???

[This message has been edited by WalterGAII (edited September 27, 2000).]
 
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