How far can 26 in. 1:12 twist .223 reach?
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mapsjanhere
New member
JBM calculator gives you a maximum range of a (berger match) 55gr at 3300 ft/s with 3600 yards. You not only need superhuman shooting, you also need a dead target. It takes the bullet 25s to get there.
Mapsjanhere beat me to it.
Simply put, the bullet with the highest ballistic coefficient and muzzle velocity will carry furthest. If you want to know the extreme range for range safety reasons, I can tell you a Sierra 55 grain boattail MatchKing fired at 3400 fps with 32.99° of bore elevation will travel 3610 yards and will impact at a velocity of 365 fps with 16.3 ft-lbs of energy.
For any other bullet, you need the MV and BC to know where they will land. In addition to the JBM calculators, there is a good one in QuickTARGET Unlimited that does all those maximum extreme range calculations. Just don't expect to hit anything out that far on purpose.
For other purposes, you have to specify what you need to be able to hit. For example, your bullets will make it to a 600 yard target just fine, but by the time they gets there they will normally suffer more wind influence than a target shooter likes to see. So unless the air is dead still, your score won't likely be championship level. If you're shooting small varmints, you'll have to limit your range to something a good bit shorter than that.
Simply put, the bullet with the highest ballistic coefficient and muzzle velocity will carry furthest. If you want to know the extreme range for range safety reasons, I can tell you a Sierra 55 grain boattail MatchKing fired at 3400 fps with 32.99° of bore elevation will travel 3610 yards and will impact at a velocity of 365 fps with 16.3 ft-lbs of energy.
For any other bullet, you need the MV and BC to know where they will land. In addition to the JBM calculators, there is a good one in QuickTARGET Unlimited that does all those maximum extreme range calculations. Just don't expect to hit anything out that far on purpose.
For other purposes, you have to specify what you need to be able to hit. For example, your bullets will make it to a 600 yard target just fine, but by the time they gets there they will normally suffer more wind influence than a target shooter likes to see. So unless the air is dead still, your score won't likely be championship level. If you're shooting small varmints, you'll have to limit your range to something a good bit shorter than that.
Jim Watson
New member
Exactly the opposite; a faster twist is required for heavier (longer) bullets.
The other posters are talking about absolute maximum falling out of the sky range. The EFFECTIVE range of a 55 grain .223 with some accuracy and enough residual energy to kill is perhaps 300 yards or a bit more on a windless day.
When I was in USMC boot camp, we were taught that the maximum effective range of the M16A1 rifle (firing 55 gr ball ammo) was 500 meters (about 550 yds). IIRC, the US Army at that time taught that the effective range of the M16A1 rifle was 300 meters (about 330 yds). This is where the argument about the meaning of "effective" usually begins (usually based on the ability of the average rifleman to hit the intended target).
All that aside, the 5.56X45mm NATO round (essentially the same as 223 Remington) was designed to have enough energy remaining at 500 meters to pierce an infantry helmet and/or incapacitate (kill or disable) a man. So, put the bullet on the X, lay a man out. Miss, and it's a whole different story. My question to you is what is your effective range?
I'm sorry yes I forgot the number "12" though higher ( than say "9") actually means less twisting because there's less revolutions per given barrel length.
Working on getting the kid a .223. And see Remy seems to have their varmint 700s in 1:12 and their tacticals in 1:9.
Our local range goes up to 600 yds and he dreams of hitting steel that far out ever since he's been shooting his 22 at the 100 yd (max) silouhette range.
chadstrickland
New member
Just asked a friend of mine in the army and he says textbook is 600 meter for m4 and 800 for the m16
I have 2. Was running thru considerations like recoil for a 10 year old. Could be completely fine but don't want him getting bad flinch or something. Plus looking at .223 for reloading economy. He can go thru ammo like he does chicken nuggets. I'm not even considering a youth model because he's getting tall so fast.
I was asking about the .223 and it's range thing so I could get an idea how much he can "grow" with the .223 before I had to hand over one of my .308s.
Thanks for the help.
My son loves chicken nuggets so I will definitely agree that you will need to reload to keep up with your son. I have a 1:12 twist 223 with a 22" barrel that I use for varmint hunting. If the range is where you will be shooting, I would lean towards the faster twist with heavier bullets.
If he will be shooting off bags or a rest of some sort, a heavier rifle will absorb much of the perceived recoil and flinch at that point should be a non-issue as long as quality hearing protection is also employed.
I personally do not feel that a 223 is something a person can "outgrow" so to speak. It can be configured in many different twists to perform well with a multitude of different bullet weights for everything from varminting to long-range paper killing.
If he will be shooting off bags or a rest of some sort, a heavier rifle will absorb much of the perceived recoil and flinch at that point should be a non-issue as long as quality hearing protection is also employed.
I personally do not feel that a 223 is something a person can "outgrow" so to speak. It can be configured in many different twists to perform well with a multitude of different bullet weights for everything from varminting to long-range paper killing.
Don't forget the .243. It'll reach those ranges with a lot less wind drift than a .223 and a lot less recoil than a .308. I use a 22-250 for most of my varmint shooting, but the .243 comes out when it's windy and it does a fine job. My grandsons love it! I guess I'd better start looking for another one soon, for when they "borrow" this one.
Looking into 1:9 barreled models and Remy 700 tactical is more expensive than the Varmint (and easier to find in a shorter 20 in. bull barrel)...considering the CZ 527 Varmint Laminated (24 in. barrel already has a detachable mag, heavy barrel...and whatever a "single set" trigger is) and of course the heavy barreled Savages (I've seen them shoot well...if it weren't for the look of that barrel nut....). Howa/Weatherby I have to look at their twist rates. There are reasonably priced with the #2(?) barrel.
I don't know what your budget is but ruger's m77 V/T models are quite accurate. Anyone who says different has not shot one. They come with an adjustable two stage trigger, 26" medium-heavy contour barrel, laminate stock with wide fore-end well suited to bench rest shooting. They have a high msrp but can be found in excellent condition on the used market for a very reasonable price. In fact, I haven't seen a v/t model sell on gunbroker for over $600 in a long time.
I have two of these rifles, one in 25-06 and one in 22-250, and they are both easy sub-moa rifles.
I have two of these rifles, one in 25-06 and one in 22-250, and they are both easy sub-moa rifles.
Jim Watson
New member
You might well wing a VC at 600 yards with a 55 grain bullet if everything was just right, but that is way beyond the reasonable civilian sporting range.
On twist rate needed, it depends first and foremost on the length of the bullet, secondarily on its the weight, and least on its muzzle velocity. When people ask how heavy a bullet they can stabilize with their barrel's twist, they don't realize the question carries the implicit assumption the bullets they are comparing all have the same proportions, because only then do length and weight correlate.
In reality, with a given twist, you can stabilize a heavier bullet if it is shorter in shape. For example, a typical flat base bullet is shorter for its weight than a typical boattail, so you can fire a typical flat base that's a little heavier than you can a boattail. You could, for example, shoot the 64 grain Berger Match Varmint bullet (flat base) and for which Berger recommends a 12" twist, and actually get a higher ballistic coefficient than you can with the 55 grain boattails available. The problem is, you can't shoot the heavier bullet as fast, which costs you most of the BC advantage.
Second, when it comes to wind, all that matters are the ballistic coefficient and the muzzle velocity. In both cases, bigger is better. If you have a .224" bullet with a ballistic coefficient of 0.4 and a .308 bullet with a ballistic coefficient of 0.4 and you fire them both at the same muzzle velocity, the effect of wind on both will be exactly the same. Differences in weight and wind drag are all taken into account by the ballistic coefficient. Where the bigger round beats the smaller one is in how much energy it delivers to a long range target. For sniping that becomes important.
One other advantage for the .308 is its typical 10" twist is comparable to a 7.2" twist in a .223. It comes ready for long bullets, standard, so length for standard ammo was never a design limitation with it. As a result, 150 grain .308" ball bullets typically have a BC about 0.1 higher than 55 grain .224" ball bullets. At 600 yards, and allowing that the .224" bullet will be starting out faster, figure that where a 10 MPH wind blows the 150 grain .308 ball about 3 ft to the side, it will blow 55 grain .223 ball about 4 ft to the side. That's not exact, but should give you some rough idea of the difference you are dealing with when you are limited by a 12" twist.
In reality, with a given twist, you can stabilize a heavier bullet if it is shorter in shape. For example, a typical flat base bullet is shorter for its weight than a typical boattail, so you can fire a typical flat base that's a little heavier than you can a boattail. You could, for example, shoot the 64 grain Berger Match Varmint bullet (flat base) and for which Berger recommends a 12" twist, and actually get a higher ballistic coefficient than you can with the 55 grain boattails available. The problem is, you can't shoot the heavier bullet as fast, which costs you most of the BC advantage.
Second, when it comes to wind, all that matters are the ballistic coefficient and the muzzle velocity. In both cases, bigger is better. If you have a .224" bullet with a ballistic coefficient of 0.4 and a .308 bullet with a ballistic coefficient of 0.4 and you fire them both at the same muzzle velocity, the effect of wind on both will be exactly the same. Differences in weight and wind drag are all taken into account by the ballistic coefficient. Where the bigger round beats the smaller one is in how much energy it delivers to a long range target. For sniping that becomes important.
One other advantage for the .308 is its typical 10" twist is comparable to a 7.2" twist in a .223. It comes ready for long bullets, standard, so length for standard ammo was never a design limitation with it. As a result, 150 grain .308" ball bullets typically have a BC about 0.1 higher than 55 grain .224" ball bullets. At 600 yards, and allowing that the .224" bullet will be starting out faster, figure that where a 10 MPH wind blows the 150 grain .308 ball about 3 ft to the side, it will blow 55 grain .223 ball about 4 ft to the side. That's not exact, but should give you some rough idea of the difference you are dealing with when you are limited by a 12" twist.
big al hunter
New member
I looked at the same model and the answer I got for the same question is this.
The single set trigger from CZ is a standard trigger unless you push it forward first ( toward the barrel ). It is then set and will break at a few ounces rather than pounds.
May not be ideal for a beginner but a very nice feature for the experienced target shooter.