How Dangerous is thumb decocking?

T

TCW

New member
I plan on getting a cz-75. I've always had de-cocker guns (Sig P226, Ruger P97D). My logic has always been: If I need to get off a shot, I don't want to do anything but pull the trigger. On the other hand, I enjoy single-action shooting....so the de-cock feature makes sense to me. (Glocks are great, but they're not for me!)

For the sake of variety, should I vary my collection with a CZ-75B or just get a CZ-75BD? Is the risk of thumb de-cocking worth it?

This is sounding pretty lame...Oh well. Just wanted feedback from CZ75 owners.

Thanks!
:)
 
I find it the CZ 75/97 to be very easy to thumb cock. However, I have come to like the "cocked and locked" option so much now that I no longer use DA. I actually dislike the DA/SA transition on most pistols now after owning CZs. I wish all pistols featured a "cocked and locked" option.
 
Thumb decocking is no problem for anyone with enough knowhow,dexterity and brains to shoot a handgun in the first place. :) Consider how long it was a common practice before DA guns with decockers. Cocked and locked carry is also a nice option to have when you want it. Plus it totally eliminates the need to decock if that`s still a stumbling point. If you`re *really* uncomfortable with it the BD version is fine. BTW it decocks to half cock which shortens the DA pull some. I just manually decock my 75B to halfcock for carry. Marcus
 
The CZ-75B has a safety that works the way God and John Browning intended. Why would you ever want to decock it? Just carry it cocked and locked...

M1911
 
I have no problem thumb decocking my cz75b. It's great having an pistol you can have it both ways, double action or cocked and locked. If I had it for my house gun I would have the hammer down and one in the chamber. But if I want to shoot a pistol match with it it's cocked and locked.
 
I strongly advise you to stay...

...with the manual of arms with which you are most comfortable.

CZs are excellent pistols...if you're looking for something less than full-size, check out the Compact PCR; it has the decocker you want and is so much lighter than a standard 75 that you'll be pleasantly suprised.
 
If a gun doesn't have a decocker, IMO, I would drop the mag and rack the slide, but NOT thumb decock. I would carry that type of weapon either cocked and locked, or with a full mag and chamber empty, and rack the slide to load. I am uncomfortable with guns designed for cocked and lock condition being carried hammer down on a live round ( I don't know the CZ manual of arms, so I don't know if the DA version is designed for hammer down, that is, whether it has an inertial firing pin block, and whether it can fire if the hammer is inadvertently dropped when decocking). I know that some 1911s have firing pin blocks that prevent inertial strikes, but don't prevent hammer strikes if clumsily decocked. If I wanted a gun to carry hammer down, it would be a revolver or Sig or Beretta or other gun designed for DA/SA action. Just my opinion. FWIW, there are other threads that deal with hammer down on 1911's.
 
I do not see any problem with thumb decocking. I may get some flames but figure if you can not decock a auto you may best not even own a gun. Kind of like having a car and not knowing how to back up or how to park. Its the same drill as with any revolver as I have yet to see one with a decocker. First rule is point it in a safe direction and the second is to practice it a bit. It is very safe and easy to do if you practice a bit and pay attention, always be sure it is pointed at something you do not mind putting a round into just incase.:) And the CZ with a round up the pipe and the hammer down is just as safe a Smith sixgun with a full load and the hammer down. With the nice DA pull on a CZ I just go with chambered round and hammer down as it is designed for that as well as cocked and locked too. The best of both worlds in one gun, imagine that.:)
 
More parts!

There are both advantages and disadvantages to having a gun capable of both DA and "cocked and locked" carry.

I am a big fan of the CZ line, but one disadvantage might be that the "B" models have more parts that can break. To have a gun capable of firing DA or "cocked and locked", you need more parts . I looked up the number of parts in my CZ 97B manual and it is over 60! That is a lot more than the Glocks or polymer Rugers. Now, I wonder how many parts the CZ 75 SA (single action only) has? Any CZ 75 SA owners here to provide that info? I bet there are less parts than the standard CZ 75 "B" models.
 
I have been decocking my 75b by hand since i got it and have had no problems. I just practiced with an empty gun for a while until i was confident with it and now i don't worry about it. If you are not comfortable with this then by all means get a decocker. Either way you are getting a GREAT pistol.
 
I think the greatest hazard in thumb decocking (and there are hazards) presents itself after a self-defense shooting or similar stress inducing incident where your fine motor skills have deteriorated significantly.
 
Thumb Decocking

I think thumb decocking is extremely dangerous. Since you must pull the trigger to do it, you take off the safety that would otherwise prevent the hammer from hitting the firing pin. If the hammer slips off your thumb while you are decocking, the gun will fire. Of course, you should always keep the pistol aimed in a safe direction so that neither you nor anyone else will be harmed if a round is fired. Because of this danger, I prefer firearms with decockers (but still aim the gun in a safe direction, just in case), or pistols which are double action only and cannot be set in a cocked position.

I believe that a private gun owner is much more likely to fire a round accidentally, injure himself or others, damage private property, or run into trouble with the authorities, than to use the gun against bad guys. So safety is paramount for us "civilians." Even policeman and soldiers in this country rarely fire a weapon except in practice. Only a tiny percentage of policemen have ever fired their weapons against a bad guy.

Drakejake
 
I personally hate the heavy trigger pull of DAO pistols. I don't think I would keep a DAO pistol if it was given to me (I'd immediately have to sell it). To each his or her own, but for me make it "cocked and locked" when possible.
 
Thumb decocking is filled with DANGER, as pointed out above. The hand just does not allow sufficient control if anythin slips.

Instead, you should use the support hand to thumb-finger PINCH the sides of the hammer as you pull the trigger, then _take_ _your_ _finger_ _OFF_ _the_ _trigger_ before lowering the hammer.

I cannot recommend even this procedure on any semiauto without a firing pin block safety. The key here is that if something slips, the forward trigger will prevent any discharge...IF the mechanical devices do not fail. Remember the cliches about what a "safety" is?

Thumb de-cocking with a modern revolver or a firing pin block semiauto should be done only on the firing line and when your're pointing the firearm straight downrange. Even then, you should practice taking your finger all the way out of the trigger guard as soon as the hammer notch gets forward of the sear.

Just MNSHO
 
While I don't want a medal for admitting it, I take strong issue with those who say an ND while thumb decocking means I should not own a gun. IT IS NOT AS SAFE AS BACKING UP A CAR.

It is so unsafe, I now refuse to do it.

I had an ND while decocking my COMMANDING OFFICER'S model for about the zillionth time.

Lack of Dexterity, sweaty palm, I don't know, but I do know I intentionally pulled the trigger and attempted to lower the hammer with the strong hand thumb.

The weapon pivoted in my hand, my thumb DID NOT come off the hammer, at least until it was bent into a wierd angle by the slide recoiling.

As I did several other things "right", there was no damage other than a hole in the cieling and probably some long-term hearing loss.

Think about it, you are violating the basic safety rules by intentionally pulling the trigger and pointing a weapon at something you do not intend to destroy. Insisting that only morons have NDs this way does not alter the fact that you are advocating intentionaly breaking the safety rules.

[Edited by CITADELGRAD87 on 04-12-2001 at 03:30 PM]
 
Half cock safety

Let's get something clear, CZ 75s have a half cock safety to protect from an AD in case the hammer slips while decocking. It's pretty hard to have an AD with a CZ 75 and it's even harder on a CZ 75B. But, if you don't feel comfortable with it nothing that anyone says will convince you. If you don't want to go cocked and locked or manually lower the hammer and if you want a CZ 75, look into a model that has a decocker. ;)

In a stress situation with a CZ 75 it's best just to flick up the safety and go cocked and locked. It's a lot easier to remember than using a decocker and a lot less of a hassle than manually dropping the hammer. ;)

Everyone that owns an auto should practice how to manually drop the hammer. Why? Murphy's Law that's why. Once at the range one of my buddies tried to decock his P226 when the lever broke in his hand. At the range he had the luxury of dropping the mag and emptying the chamber. What if this had been a defense situation? He would've had no choice but to make it safe by manually dropping the hammer.
 
Here's how I do it.

1. Start with muzzle pointed in safe (less dangerous?) direction with your finger outside the trigger guard and the safety on.

2. Place the index finger of your off hand on the face (front, flatpart) of the hammer and your thumb on top of the round part.

3. Remove safety.

4. Pull trigger and ease hammer down. Once the hammer goes past the half cock notch you can release the trigger, which engages the firing pin safety.

5. Slide index finger out from between slide and hammer as it goes down while still controlling the hammer with your thumb. The hammer will actually be past the half cock notch and under almost no spring tension by the time you have to fully remove your index finger.


I've done this hundreds of times with no discharge. Practice it a bunch with an empty gun. Do it SLOWLY. Don't do it when you are distracted and can't pay attention to what you are doing.

After a shooting I would elect to reholster the weapon cocked and locked. This process requires fine motor skills which disappear under stress.

Works for me. Don't screw it up.

Regards,
David
 
CZ 75 BD was best option for me

The gun is used as a bedside gun and in IDPA-style shooting at my gun club.

I chamber a round and can safely and easily decock with one flick of the thumb to half-cock, where the DA pull is much shorter. (Still point in safe direction when decocking.) At home, the gun then goes into the push-button safe under the bed. At the range, the gun then goes into the holster. I practice drawing and shooting double action from half-cock, and also drawing, cocking with the strong hand thumb and shooting single action.

Regards.
 
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