Help me choose a caliber for Remington 700 BDL

Choose caliber

Dogger:
"How can you go wrong with the 06" may be a better question. This may be a bit socratic but its a good way to decide.

Art.... you mean to tell me you got some "breezy kids stuff" out there?
We got more last night. Just enough to be a pain.......
 
Dogger, I don't know, really, what to tell you about dealing with recoil. It bothers some folks more than others. I've pretty much psyched myself into ignoring it.

Weight of gun, I think, has more to do with "comfort" than cartridge. If you're target-shooting, or hunting from a stand which is not a long walk from wherever you leave the house or car, it doesn't really matter if the rifle is heavy.

As example, my '06, "fully dressed", is 9-1/2 pounds. I've toted it on walks of 12 to 15 miles in very rough country. Sure, it sometimes felt like 50 pounds at the end of the day, but that's just part of the deal. But shooting hot loads off a benchrest is just no biggy at all.

In fact, if it warms up a bit, I've got some load-testing comparisons for accuracy that I wanna do later today. (In Terlingua, water freezes at 60F. :) )

I guess to a certain extent, you're just gonna have to go out and borrow or rent, and shoot various rifle/cartridge combinations and see what you think.

Good luck,

Art
 
Sooo...the '06 is "the world's best cartridge", huh??? Welll, maybe NOT!!! It is very versatile, I'll grant you that...but NOT "world's best"!!! I don't think MY PET, the LOVERLY .308 Wingchester, is the BEST...."the BEST"...that'd have to be something like the hugely versatile .375 H&H or...something easily capable of downing ANYTHING that walks on the planet...not some pipsqueak "smallbore"!!! Now, as far as dogger's dilema, I think that the WELL-KNOWN advantages of the SHORT-ACTION cartridges are a place to start...while not IDEAL for Elk, if the hunter is patient and accepts only IDEAL shots, the .308 and 7mm-08 WILL KILL ELK-!!! The short-action cartridges are GENERALLY ACCEPTED to be more accurate--AND more EFFICIENT--than their long-action cousins...and they CERTAINLY have less recoil...which means that "Joe Averagehunter" can probably shoot them BETTER than he would shoot something BIGGER-!!! And, after all, confidence in one's equipment AND ability IS IMPORTANT here...no getting around that...and I, for one, am more CONFIDENT of my ability to PRECISELY place shots with the .308 than with any "larger-capacity" or "higher-velocity" cartridge. I guess you pays your money and you takes your chances....mikey357
 
.308

Dogger,
Shooting for fun and some hunting is what I got from your initial post. Factory match loads are available, but .308 gives you the option of plinking with surplus ammo and if you reload there's lots of brass available as well as a great number of different bullets and weights from all manufacturers. It's my favorite followed closely by the 30-06.
 
Boomer

So much food for thought I feel stuffed. Several of my amigos have recommended the 30-06 and .308, but these are the same guys who whine about 20+ rounds at the range and leave the .308s/30-06 at home in favor of the 6.5s and .243s. Their rifles tend to be on the lighter side of 7.5 pounds though.

I have heard that the 30-06 is not amenable to handloading reduced loads due to case size? Any truth in that?

Shucks, I might have to spring for a .30 cal after all. After reading the latest Handgunner I am even thinking about a .375!!!!

NOT!

:)
 
Rifle caliber

Art, Dogg and everyone else:

This thread is a good exampe of something I have noticed. ITS AN AGE THING.

Art and I are close to the sme age. I don't know bout others but I might surmize that those suggesting the 308 are a "bit" younger.

For folks my age the 30-06 is THE VERSITLE gun. For some others of you its the 308.

Its kinda neat to see this evolution don't you think.

Both rouds have their goods and bads... Tough choice
 
'06 reduced loads

In the '06, 20 grains of 2400 behind any bullet lying around the loading bench makes a no-recoil plinker. That load will drive a 169-grain gas check at around 2,000 ft/sec. (If you're sighted in for "full-house" loads, you'll hit about 12" or 15" low at 100 yards. Be advised.)

A nice squirrel load is five grains of pistol or shotgun powder behind a 00 (000?) ball.

If you're feeling experimental (and mischievous), take a 220-grain lead bullet and drill a .220 hole in the end. Insert primer(s) and then a drop of glue...

Next question?

:), Art
 
Man, this is straying fast. Before we digress further from the original question, I'll answer it once and foreall. The 270 Winchester is obviously the best choice ;) Heck, anyone can see that!!
 
Sorry Art, I'm not real experienced here. What does that primer thing do? Make the bullet explode on impact? If so, what's to keep it from going off in the barrel from the heat and pressure of the gas?
 
I have never inserted primers in rifle bullets before. I have used them in the .357mag. hollow points. They don't have much of a report when shot against rocks. Just a little pop. Maybe they need a little red dot in the hollow point and then cap it with a primer. This should be done only by a professional,the dim witted and those of us that never made pipe bombs as children.;)
 
Brouhaha, about all I know is that a primer in the nose of the bullet seemed like a good idea at the time, and I figured it would make small pieces of shrapnel inside a treelimb...I dunno that it made any difference, but I did hit the tree limb, so the bullet had stayed together...

Regardless, it can't hurt a barrel which withstands 50,000 psi and a burn-temperature of some 2,000 degrees.

Seems to me a .45-70 bullet has lots more room for experimentation. :)

I think the digression has come about because this thread-that-won't-die has become sorta circular...

Art
 
This has been a great rambling thread, and informative.

In terms of what constitutes the best elk rifle, the best wisdom I ever heard was that it was the (1) largest caliber that you could (2) carry all day and (3) not flinch when you shoot it.

Bringing this back to my original question, the 270 or 280 would qualify as the most capable elk rounds of those proposed. However, in terms of “fun shootability” and varmint hunting my guess is the 25-06 would win hands down, and could be pressed into elk service given a premium bullet such as the 115 grain Nosler Partition or Bear Claw. Federal provides factory loads in both. Would anyone pursue elk with these?
 
in trying the answer the QUESTION YOU ASKED, i would suggest the 7-08 based on the primary and secondary use of the rifle. that 308 case is a sweet little case and with some varget you can put bullets in/near the same hole all day with your 7-08...if you can't it's the gun's fault. Plus, there are some great bullets out there to try...the 168 grain Sierra matchking, the 162 grain Hornady a-max.
 
Remington is chambering the Model 700 Classic in 7mm-08 this year. I am drooling... :) This could be the one... Although there seems to be a buttload of controversy about Remington 700 safeties malfunctioning...
 
Huntschool: in your post of 1/19 you said something about the moderator sending Dogger to the "244/6mm Art". I'm not familiar with this cartridge, and it doesn't appear in the Ackley manuals or Barnes' Cartridges of the World. Could you have been referring to the "244 Earg" ( Earg/esplitten Loudenboomer aka the 244/416 Ackley Improved Rigby ) or maybe the 244/348 Archly?
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what caliber?

Dogger: i have a Remington 700 chambered in 6mm ACK IMP.

It shoots all manner of bullet weights [1&8 twist] Shilen select match barrel, It loves 107's & shoots 55 noslers & 58 V-max very well. In fact i have a load for V-max at @ 4000 fps that shoots .4 moa. Its my favorite varmint load so far.

Go with a 6mm you will love it.
 
Rusty, it just shows to go ya that commas are important. :) If you add a couple of commas either side of "Art", in Huntschool's post of 1-19, things will become all lit up and severe clear.

:), Art
 
I just can't STAND to keep quiet anymore!

Dogger, take a look at the muzzle velocities of the different bullets you can use with these different calibers. Pay attention to sectional densities and ballistic coefficients. Think about trajectories.

In a previous post you seemed to lean toward .270 and .280, which is sensible enough, but then you mentioned .25-06 as an alternative. That was clear thinking!

There IS no better all-around cartridge than the .25-06 for all-around shooting in the lower 48 states. Think of it: the .25-06 can drive a 120-grain Partition at about 3100 fps. The BC is up around .390, and sectional density is .260.

As compared to say a .308 Winchester, with which a 165-grain bullet is about the heaviest you can drive with any ooomph, well...the .308 165-grain Partition has a sectional density of about .248, and the BC is about .410. The big difference is you will be able to drive the .308 bullet at about 2700 fps.

The .25-06 will shoot flatter, with less recoil. It will be practically as accurate, and you may well shoot it better because of the lessened recoil. And when you load it up with varmint weight bullets, look out! There is NO comparison between the .25-06 and the .308.

If there is any doubt that the .25-06 will take down an elk, well, the livingrooms of America are full of experts who say you have to have a .300 Mag to hunt elk, but the woods are full of hunters who take elk with calibers much smaller than that. It's all shot placement and bullet performance. If this were not so, then every early-American explorer and mountain man would have been eaten by grizzlies or some other critter or would have starved to death. And the Native Americans were nothing more than bear-feed with their bows and arrows. I guess the bows made good toothpicks for the bears.

When lighter, varmint weight bullets are the subject, well...the tables tell the story. The .25-06 is the obvious choice. The .308 can drive a 110-grainer at about 3300 fps. Not bad. The 30-caliber varmint bullet has a BC of about .200. The .25-06 will drive a 75-grainer at almost 3700 fps. BC will be about .200 for this weight bullet. Which do you think will shoot flatter?

There is no better all-around cartridge for the lower 48 than the .25-06. If you want a rifle exclusively for elk, then something larger may be a better selection, but for versatility, the .25-06 can't be beat!
 
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