Hello to all! Also Which gun should I get?

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Definite Otaku

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Hello! Everyone I am an Otaku (Not in the Strictest sense...) But to those who get that, at least I'm not the only one here.

But I was directed to this site for firearms info from the VWvortex forums. (Car guys love to shoot too!) I just wanted to introduce myself!

Looking at a USP 45 or a Glock 17!
Reason: Trying to get into U.S. Customs. The 17 is standard issue but I can carry anything I want. I like the USP 45 so my hearts set on that one! But the Glocks are nice too! On the very off chance I do not get into Customs, I still want a polymer frame pistol before the new CA laws go into effect next year. (New "safety" training crap that superceeds the last one) I could probably afford one, (If I can get both so be it!) But I would like peoples opinions of them.

I know the strengths of each one and the drawbacks (if any) to each one. For Glocks the use of no hammers and no external safeties kind of apeals to me. At the same time, I have been used to guns like the 92's and 1911s which are formated like the USP.

Calibur is an issue only in a weird sense of feel. In fact I like large frame handguns but a Glock 21 full size does not feel right (some odd sense of what a Glock should feel like) so I like the standard frame like the 17. But for a USP, anything less than 45 does not feel right either...

Just your opinions please and hope to be discussing more soon!
 
Hate to distress your wallet, but you will probably have to get at least one of each, and due to the caliber confusion-more than one of each model!
 
Car guys love to shoot too!
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I drive a Jetta and shoot a Glock - and I like both. :)
Which leads me back to your question, a USP 45 or a Glock 17? Without doubt both are good quality handguns with a good reputation. The reasons I chose a Glock 17L over a 9mm USP Expert were the difference in price, behaviour during recoil, trigger reset - and emotion. For the price of the HK I got a Glock with a bag of accessories, mags and ammo. The higher bore-axis and the steeper grip of the Expert led to more muzzle flip. And - most important - I immediately liked the design philosophy of the Glock.

I'll let someone else talk for the USP, but I'd take the Glock. I'm sure that I could shoot better with it than the USP. I also prefer the 9mm over the .45ACP. The 9mm delivers the same energy at lower costs more accurately to the target.

Make your own considerations and draw your own conclusions. You'll shoot well only with the gun you like. When I shot my Glock for the first time, the holes were all over the target. But because it was the pistol of my dreams, I kept training and improved my scores. If I had bought what others had recommended me, I might have blamed the bad scores on the gun and blamed my friends for making me waste money.

Anyways, buy what fits you best. :)
 
*T.Stahl wrote "I'll let someone else talk for the USP, but I'd take *the Glock. I'm sure that I could shoot better with it than the *USP. I also prefer the 9mm over the .45ACP. The 9mm delivers *the same energy at lower costs more accurately to the target. "

I just spent a few minutes with my ballistics SW. There is NO WAY the 9mm and .45acp deliver the same energy! Using Hornady XTP bullets and Hogdon HS-6 powder, this is how they compare:

9mm- 147 grn XTP bullet, 6.3 grn HS-6 = 950 fps.
muzzle energy is 295 foot lbs.
The Taylor knockout factor is 7.08

.45acp - 230 grn XTP bullet, 8.4 grn HS-6 = 850 fps.
muzzle energy is 369 foot lbs.
TKO factor is 12.60

Lower costs absolutely! More power NO! As far as accuracy that is the job of the shooter. Choose which ever you are most comfortable with.
 
. I like the USP 45 so my hearts set on that one!
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Get what your heart desires. If you are successful into making it into the U.S. Customs program you can rest assured that you will have sufficient practice with whatever duty weapon they may have.

Good Shooting
RED
 
Glocks and USPs are fine handguns, and you'd be well served with either one. I always considered the USP to be kind of a Glock for people who like external hammers and safeties, and traditional triggers. The Glock is the better deal without a doubt...I like USPs just fine, but they're way overpriced.

FWIW, my gunsmith doesn't care much for polymer guns, but he says that the USPs are the plastic pistols he sees least often in his repair shop...they just don't seem to break. Glocks have a reputation for reliability and robustness as well, though.
 
And after you're done with those...get a real HK...

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I still want a polymer frame pistol before the new CA laws go into effect next year. (New "safety" training crap that superceeds the last one)


Please fill me in on th new law, is this just for the polymer pistols or all pistols in general
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With which can you shoot best? Which just plain "feels" better in your hand?

My personal opinion is that the world is full of quality handguns, and by and large there's not a nickel's worth of difference between them except in the eye or hand of the user.

Since the purpose of a handgun is to hit one's target, whichever model lets you do this best seems to me to be the one to carry.

$0.02, Art
 
Bowhunter, there are factory 9mm loads that achive more than 400lbsft from even a 4" barrel. Maybe you should not compare standard-weight .45 bullets to extra-heavy 9mm bullets that leave less room in the case for powder.
My statement about the better accuracy of the 9mm is based on the fact that the record in the discipline I shoot was shot with a 9mm Luger, followed by .45ACP, .357Mag and .44Mag, IIRC. (the only four calibers allowed).
 
I compared the heaviest .355 jacketed bullet listed for 9mm loads. All the bullet manufacturers I've seen stateside list the 147 grain as the heaviest .355 bullet. Maybe in Germany there are other options. I have yet to see anything heavier here. I carry a 9mm and shoot it well. I shoot my .45 better, and my IZH-35M better still.
I'd like to get my hands on some of those bullets. Are you sure they are heavier? Maybe the bullets are seated deeper?
Who makes them?
 
What gun does U.S. Customs use? Get the gun that the US Customs use.

To me HK is overpriced and overrated. Nothing wrong with HK, I just think that you can get a better deal with a Glock or Sig.
 
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bowhunter,

The typical FMJ 9mm bullet weight is 115gr or 124gr, and they both have about 345 fpe at 1160 and 1120 fps, respectively. You don't gain anything worthwhile by going to heavier bullets in 9mm.

Saying that typical 9mm and .45 ACP cartridges are comparable in energy is certainly reasonable. As for accuracy, the 200 yard shot is easily doable in 9mm. Just aim 3-1/2 feet high, which isn't hard. At that range, the .45 is just about spent with over a 6 foot drop.
 
Thanks for the replies.

For new laws: In California you need to take a DMV like firearms safety test to purchase a pistol (of any kind) Minor nusance but again just another step toward disarmament. The new legislation would move to include thumb printing, actual demostration and knowledge of the weapon and safe practices. Again another hurdle to jump.

Customs Issues Glock 17 standards as there service weapon. Everyone I have talked to in Customs has no gripes with it and give it great praise. Again everything is still tentative with my hiring. Still waiting on that final background investigation to clear.

My dad has a Beretta 92 and Loaded 1911 springfield, but I want a polymer.
 
With the Glock 17 being the U.S. Customs standard issue it seens like getting full capacity mags would be easier and less money.
 
Blackhawk,
The post I was responding to had said he used "extra heavy" bullets. I'm trying to figure out how a heavier than normal 9mm round can outperform or even equal a standard .45 load. The ballistic tables tell me they can't. As far a accuracy, like I said, it is only the ability of the shooter and his equipment that determine accuracy. Also, the original poster may join Customs. Show me an agent taking a 200yd shot on the job and I'll show you the same individual unemployed that afternoon. I don't see why that's relevant.
 
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