Hard use Reliability/Durability: P320 vs VP9 vs PPQ

D

DeusComedis

Inactive
Hello,

After years of only using all-metal DA/SAs, I'm looking for a new full size poly/striker pistol. Glock is still an option, but the ergos make my hands angry, so it's off to the side for now. At this point it between the main German-made strikers: P320, VP9, AND PPQ M2. This is a gun expected to be very reliable, stand up to adverse outdoor conditions where good cleaning/maintenance might not be possible, and be accurate.
- I've shot them once each, and the feel was pretty good on all, though I dont have enough trigger time to know if I significantly prefer the ergos of one over the others.

- Plan on running it with a can frequently.
- Running a good amount of +P/+P+ through it.
- Eventually putting on a red dot.

So, can anyone can anyone comment on comparative...
- Mechanical reliability
- Accuracy (assuming best barrels for both/possibly custom match)
- Resistance to elements or rough handling/drop
- Internal safeties
- Trigger: do any get significantly better or worse over time?
- Any mag/feed issues.

It's mainly for practice, and I want it to be something I can't shoot for a number of years without have to toss or constantly refurbish (I usually go 150-250 rounds a week)

Thanks.
 
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Glock's MOS, from what I 've seen thus far, is not a reliable fixture.

It seems like the Springfield XD series has something that looks pretty good in striker-fired that accommodates red dot attachments.
 
Hard use Reliability/Durability: P320 vs VP9 vs PPQ

P320 is made in the US.

If you want to run a red dot look to see if any offer a factory option with a slide that is milled for it otherwise you'll have to send it off to someone to have the slide cut. That's not the end of the world but it will add cost and I'm not sure how that may affect warranties. SIG had such models at SHOT Show, called the RX, but I haven't seen any in the wild yet. I do not believe Walther or HK offer such an option. Look for threaded barrel options for the can, which I believe can be had from all of the three. I don't see an issue with +p ammo with any of them. I don't use +p+ nor do any of those companies advise using it in their pistols so if something happens you're on your own when it comes to warranty, though people do it anyway (if you Google +p+ and the more you can find reports from folks to get an idea how it will run).

In owning all of them the only comment about reliability I'll make is the VP9, IMO, has an internal design that seems less tolerant of debris and perhaps not as durable. I felt accuracy was the same among the three. They all have a drop safety. I never buried mine or handled them "roughly" but you can look that up on YouTube or Uncle Malice here has done testing on his own. Triggers are subjective IMO. I never had feed issues but I do think the feed ramp on the PPQ is somewhat steeper than other designs. As far as long term durability I don't know.

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I think you'd be well served by any of them, honestly.

I have a personal aversion of Sig after several ordeals with their abysmal customer service, so I have divested myself of all Sig products at this point. I do think they still make good guns, but so do plenty of other companies, so I went that route.

I have the VP9 and PPQ. Both are very good. In my personal testing in the AZ desert, I would say that the PPQ has shown to be a little bit more "torture test" resistant... but that's kind of a silly thing, really.

The PPQ has the better feeling trigger when dry firing, yet I still seem to shoot and ENJOY shooting the VP9 a little bit more.

With that said, I think I would personally choose the VP9 by a narrow margin over the PPQ - but neither of them are on the chopping block of my collection.

I owned both the P320 Compact and full size models. I really torture tested the P320 Compact and in all honesty it ran like an absolute champ. It was the only gun that I've tested to date which rivaled the Glock 19 in what it would "put up with" as far as abuse that no normal person would ever subject their guns to.

All 3 are good guns and I think you'd be well served by any of them. Go handle them in the store and see what feels best to you.
 
"...the ergos make my hands angry..." Usually means it doesn't fit your hand right. Or the ammo is too hot. +P/+P+ will do that. +P/+P+ ammo isn't necessary or really useable with a suppressor either.
Where a pistol is made has nothing to do with it though. If it hurts to shoot use something else. That one's no good for you. Any compact is going to have more felt recoil than a "full size" pistol anyway.
 
Glock's MOS is not a finished product but is you choose to run Glock there are quality aftermarket slides that do work for the red dot. Go see one source tactical for there red dot slides.

But it really comes down to what you want. I say buy all three. I couldn't afford to so I built the one source tactical one up.
 
LWD is well known for glock slide cuts. You can also buy a slide from them all pimped out.

Sorry, I should clarify, lone wolf.
 
We don't do SHTF or Zombies here because they're often a way to talk about shooting people without having to deal with irritating issues like legality and responsibility.

That said, the focus seems to be hard use/durability/reliability issues so I'm going to do some edits to reflect that and get rid of the potentially problematic terms.
 
I compared all three and selected the Sig P320 Compact. I've been completely satisfied with it and am confident I made the best choice.
 
I prefer the VP9. I really like the trigger and the ergonomics of the pistol. Mine was manufactured in Germany. HK is building them in the USA now. Anyone that questions the reliability of HK pistols has never owned one. The VP9 is no exception. I'm at a point in my life that I can and do buy any pistol I want. I've been blessed with that ability. The HK VP9 is an exceptional buy from a company with an exceptional background. It carries well and has the best trigger of all those mentioned. Nightengale (SP?) holsters built me a nice rig with an extreme forward cant. That makes carrying a full sized pistol fully concealed a snap. The ability to adjust all side panels and the back strap to fit your hand perfectly is an added benefit. All this for an HK priced under $600. It's rugged, accurate and affordable for any shooter wanting a quality striker fired pistol. Whats not to like?
 
I'm currently on ~round 750 and 2 range trips in to a 2,000 round endurance test I'm doing on my VP9. No cleaning or lubrication between range trips. Not only has it functioned flawlessly, it hasn't even remotely slowed down cycling. Frankly I expect it to hit 2,000 painlessly.

I bought the pistol on a lark, but it is fast earning a permanent roster slot due to competence.

320 I haven't even held yet. No comment.

The PPQ...I carry a PPS M1 every day, and briefly owned a P99AS, so I trust my life to Walther. Their quality is high. My subjective impression thus far, owning Glock, Beretta, Walther, Ruger, Sig, and HK handguns? The HK and Beretta would tie for clear high level of workmanship and quality of materials/attention to detail. It's crazy to say for a poly gun, but I think the VP9 has the same level of factory polish and care as my Beretta 92 or Sig 220R. It's simply a very good gun and in my opinion bests the Walther option, which is very good and would also serve well if it fits you better. My VP9 is 2014 German production, Ulm proofed (as is my Walther PPS M1, actually).




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HK is building them in the USA now.
Click to expand...

I can't find anything that confirms this or even really suggests it, even on HKPro. Where did you read it? Are you sure you weren't thinking of the HK45/45c?
 
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VP pistols are made in Heckler & Koch’s Oberndorf factory in southwest Germany.
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The above quote is from the UK US web site. I don't have a dog in this hunt, but if I did it would be HK.
 
Of the three, the P99/PPQ is certainly the most proven design, as it has been around almost 20 years that this point, and has established a reputable for reliability and durability.
 
Walther PPQ 9 mm Reliability

I have nothing to say about the other guns you mentioned, but insofar as the PPQ is concerned, it is one of the finest pistols I've ever owned. Durable, reliable, extremely accurate, and the sweetest trigger I ever fired. German engineering at its best, and then some.
 
In terms of grip comfort and triggers, you have three of the top four. Toss in a Steyr M9-A1 or L9-A1 and you'd have them all.

They are all well made with none of them being superior to the others. Accuracy wise they are also very good and I put the PPQ as exceptional. I prefer the paddle style magazine release of the VP9 and PPQ M1. The PPQ has the best reset out of the bunch with the Steyr having the best take up. The Sig is the only one that can come without a trigger tab. I've found them all to be 100% reliable from the models I own or have shot.

You can't really go wrong with any of your three choices or even the Steyr.
 
I like the VP9, mine gets shot a lot and it still looks and functions like a brand new one. I like the PPQ equally. The Sig would be a very close third. That said I'm not sure any recommend +P+ ammo. If you need that much power you and your gun might be better served by stepping up to .357sig or .38 super. Just a thought.
 
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