Handgun Accuracy, What is your take?
- Thread starter pilpens
- Start date
I do shoot off hand most of the time and am able to keep my .22 groups in a 2" target and my centerfire groups bigger at 15 yards (average group - standing still, two hands, 5 shots). At 15, I have been shooting 1 or 2 rounds from low ready, from different angles, different initial POA then aim at target, and moving into shooting stance. The range I frequent do not allow shooting from holster or shooting on the move but I have done it a few times at private ranges.
I shoot on the bench once in a while and at 25 for groups. Most 25 yard shooting is plinking at shotgun shells or similar at the backstop with same 1, 2 shots, angles, etc as at 15 yards.
I think that I shoot my rimfires better than my centerfires mainly because of the trigger and sight radius. My centerfires have heavier trigger and shorter barrel than my rimfres. I am sure that (anticipation of) recoil has some effect, too. Also, I shoot my rimfires more often than all my centerfires combined.
With all the practice that I have done so far, I SHOULD be the best shooter ever but I am not...way NOT. In my world, I am.
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For years I have taken my new guns to the range and spent as much time as needed to see what the gun is able to do .To me that means using a rest and shooting quite a bit at various ranges. Once I'm satisfied that we have a very good idea what the gun is capable of then I spend the rest of my time trying to match that standard,with that gun.But every trip to the range I take a little time to run high speed drills, my standard target for this is a wine box at 15 yrds the idea is out and empty as fast as I can,for that all bullets in the box is plenty accurate, I would love to have a good way to practice with the target moving at me, and have rigged up old tires to roll at me, great practice but a pain to set up and get to work right.
Alex
Alex
For me, it's about the purpose. I'd expect a hunting revolver with a 6" barrel to be more accurate than a .380 pocket gun for a number of reasons. I have a .357 Blackhawk that will outdo any other handgun I've shot, but I don't CC it. That job goes to my .38, which will outdo just about any shooter.
Accuracy defined
I don't know anyone with a centerfire caliber pistol who can get even 3 inches from rest at 25 yards. Anything 9mm and up getting under 4 inches at 25 yd. is quite a feat.
leave it a that. besides centerfire pistols are usually designed for close combat and protection. 15 yards is way more than sufficient for most pistols beyond 22lr. And for those with the 3.5 inch barrels, 6 inches at 25yards is asking for a lot. any barrel less then 4.5 inches is a joke for expecting accuracy. remember, your ammo already takes up 3/4 of an inch so with the 3.5 your getting 2.75 inches of rifling to stabalize the round. nowonder i see so many flyers out of them pocket rockets. Ruger mk2 or 3 22/45 5.5 inch barrel & cheap nc star 2.5 x 30 scope with fiocchi supermatch=( 5shots/ 1 inch/ 30 yards, nough said) accuracy defined = Ruger kp512 and anything else is just too much money spent for what your getting. looks like we found the next pound for pound champion.
by the ways thats a beauty you got there Japle-( is that goverment issue?). 
I don't know anyone with a centerfire caliber pistol who can get even 3 inches from rest at 25 yards. Anything 9mm and up getting under 4 inches at 25 yd. is quite a feat.
leave it a that. besides centerfire pistols are usually designed for close combat and protection. 15 yards is way more than sufficient for most pistols beyond 22lr. And for those with the 3.5 inch barrels, 6 inches at 25yards is asking for a lot. any barrel less then 4.5 inches is a joke for expecting accuracy. remember, your ammo already takes up 3/4 of an inch so with the 3.5 your getting 2.75 inches of rifling to stabalize the round. nowonder i see so many flyers out of them pocket rockets. Ruger mk2 or 3 22/45 5.5 inch barrel & cheap nc star 2.5 x 30 scope with fiocchi supermatch=( 5shots/ 1 inch/ 30 yards, nough said) accuracy defined = Ruger kp512 and anything else is just too much money spent for what your getting. looks like we found the next pound for pound champion. by the ways thats a beauty you got there Japle-( is that goverment issue?).
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Most well made guns of the likes if the Glocks, Beretta's, S&W's, can shoot better than most people can shoot them. So accuracy usually depends more on how the gun fits your hand, your familiarity with the weapon, eysight and so on. As far as accuracy it also depends on what your talking about.
Target shooting and competition require tight shooting pistols and shooters. As Mr. Awebuck pointed out at self defense ranges most of us will come upon it won't matter a bit if your gun shoots sub 1" groups at 25 yards or 4" groups. This is why the military considers 4" at 25 yards acceptable. Except for certain special use guns handguns are for bad breath distance.
Target shooting and competition require tight shooting pistols and shooters. As Mr. Awebuck pointed out at self defense ranges most of us will come upon it won't matter a bit if your gun shoots sub 1" groups at 25 yards or 4" groups. This is why the military considers 4" at 25 yards acceptable. Except for certain special use guns handguns are for bad breath distance.
A car is as good as the driver...
With modern technology, most handguns come out of the factory 99.99% accurate.They only vary in terms of durability, recoil, smoothness of the edges,grip comfort,magazine capacity,safety features, SA versus DA or both.
In terms of performance, a handgun is as good as the shooter, just like a car is good as the driver. A car well maintained will perform well and last long. So does a handgun.If the shooter observes all the requirements for an excellent shot he will consistently hit the bulls eye. That is my experience.
When I was a beginner, one day I went to the range and came back loving my Sig 9mm P226R DAK, I felt I had spent more money than needed to buy my HK45 since the Sig performed excellently. The next time I went to the range, my HK45 got all the praises and I felt the Sig needed some sight adjustment.The fault was always the gun not me the shooter!
Now having spent more time at the range and getting used to the nuiances of markmanship and also getting used to both guns, I have found that they both perform similarly and I have no preference on one over the other. Which do I carry depends on my mood.Should I need one at night at home for personal defense, I may go for the HK 45 because of its larger caliber and purportedly having more stopping power over the 9mm.This should not be a hard and fast rule because a +p hollow bullet in 9mm should stop any oversized adult with a well placed shot.So, I keep that ammo should I need to use my Sig for self defense.
With modern technology, most handguns come out of the factory 99.99% accurate.They only vary in terms of durability, recoil, smoothness of the edges,grip comfort,magazine capacity,safety features, SA versus DA or both.
In terms of performance, a handgun is as good as the shooter, just like a car is good as the driver. A car well maintained will perform well and last long. So does a handgun.If the shooter observes all the requirements for an excellent shot he will consistently hit the bulls eye. That is my experience.
When I was a beginner, one day I went to the range and came back loving my Sig 9mm P226R DAK, I felt I had spent more money than needed to buy my HK45 since the Sig performed excellently. The next time I went to the range, my HK45 got all the praises and I felt the Sig needed some sight adjustment.The fault was always the gun not me the shooter!
Now having spent more time at the range and getting used to the nuiances of markmanship and also getting used to both guns, I have found that they both perform similarly and I have no preference on one over the other. Which do I carry depends on my mood.Should I need one at night at home for personal defense, I may go for the HK 45 because of its larger caliber and purportedly having more stopping power over the 9mm.This should not be a hard and fast rule because a +p hollow bullet in 9mm should stop any oversized adult with a well placed shot.So, I keep that ammo should I need to use my Sig for self defense.
"Would shoot", or "did shoot"? That is, how can Clark guarantee the quality of your ammo, the stillness of the wind, etc.? For some extra bucks, Les Baer will "guarantee" 1.5" accuracy at 50 yards, but I doubt this guarantee would extend beyond the sample target included with the gun. I shot a five-round cloverleaf at fifteen yards, one time, and took the target down rather than shoot the remaining three rounds in the gun; why risk ruining it?
There's what a gun does, and what you can do with it
For generations, a 2-2.5" group at 25yds was considered an accurate handgun. Think about it, if you are shooting a big bore handgun, 5 shots touching each other will be 2-2.5"
4-6" was good enough for combat (any shot being 2-3 inches from point of aim) and many "combat" guns would do worse and got used anyway. That's one reason why they teach aim for Center of Mass!
If you shoot defensive, up close and fast is more important than tiny groups. Shoot far, speed is less important, and small groups mean your odds of hitting are better.
I've got a 1911A1, will put 5 rnds in one ragged rip at 25yds. Once in a while, I can do it also. And that's 2-2.5 inches. I've also managed the same thing offhand with a Ruger Blackhawk .45 Colt 7.5" barrel. Not often, but I've done it. Same gun and load nails the 200yd rifle gong on the range, every time I do my part right. That's good enough for me.
For generations, a 2-2.5" group at 25yds was considered an accurate handgun. Think about it, if you are shooting a big bore handgun, 5 shots touching each other will be 2-2.5"
4-6" was good enough for combat (any shot being 2-3 inches from point of aim) and many "combat" guns would do worse and got used anyway. That's one reason why they teach aim for Center of Mass!
If you shoot defensive, up close and fast is more important than tiny groups. Shoot far, speed is less important, and small groups mean your odds of hitting are better.
I've got a 1911A1, will put 5 rnds in one ragged rip at 25yds. Once in a while, I can do it also. And that's 2-2.5 inches. I've also managed the same thing offhand with a Ruger Blackhawk .45 Colt 7.5" barrel. Not often, but I've done it. Same gun and load nails the 200yd rifle gong on the range, every time I do my part right. That's good enough for me.
