Handgun accuracy?? How determined?

O

OneFreeTexan

New member
I’ve seen people make comments such as ‘my gun shoots 2 inches low and to the right at 7 yards” for example.. Is this offhand? They never say.
From a rest, most of my handguns are very accurate. Shooting offhand is another story,,,,
 
I went a couple of months without shooting at all. Too many doctors...lol!

In the last three or so months I have purchased 4 new handguns....actually 5 if you consider an AR pistol that is being made. Two revolvers and two smaller semis.

When I got the new guns I was shooting low and to the right. I am left handed.

Never had much problem shooting in the past, but this low and right had me a bit baffled.

I shot almost all of my older handguns. The same ones that were very accurate or me with them. They, too, were low and right.

I realized that I was gripping the gun too tightly and my trigger finger was not in the trigger housing enough. Probably trying to over compensate for the arthritis weakness.

I am 69 and have uncomfortable, at times, arthritis in my hands. And my arm and hand strength among other things is not what it was.

Anyway, I researched the problem and even got some left handed targets that show the likely causes of shooting mistakes in 360 degrees. Yep too tight a grip and shooting finger placement. Not shooting much for a while allowed me to forget some basics.

For the fliers that were within 3-4 inches all around I was flinching or anticipating recoil. Never had that problem before.

I felt like I mostly corrected the problem until today I went out back (I have a small handgun range) and shot 42 rounds through my S&W 629. I was within 3-4 inches all around point of aim at 15 yards and noticed that my arm weakness holding the gun caused problems. Point of aim was bouncing around. Set up a pistol rest and dead center.

This old age and old eyesight just lets me know that close to center mass will have to do...lol.
 
I find that shooting from a rest will give different results than when shooting handheld. I sight in my revolvers standing and using a two hand hold. My groups are not quite as good, but it puts me where I want to hit.

Bob Wright
 
Well it could be either depending on the particular platform.

Myself, I use the rested method with a new to me gun or new worked up handloads to dial in the initial zero and try my best to determine what the gun is capable of taking myself out of the equation as much as possible. Once that baseline is established I practice with my hunting rounds from positions I would use in the field. Obviously groups open up when the rest is taken out of the game. But using my shooting stick or my knees when sitting in my turkey chair does offer better than unsupported shooting groups. Any adjustments needed at that stage is usually minor.

All that said, ask someone about their shooting position when they bring up group sizes
 
When I gauge accuracy it is always freehanded for me.

Putting the gun on a rest doesn’t have the same dynamics for me. Maybe a Ransom rest would be more ideal.

However, when I Sight in adjustable sights on a large bore Magnum (44 Magnum or greater), I use a range bag. I set my elbows on the range bad for stability, and I try it in single action to fire off a shot a 25 yards. Same goes for she I Sight in a Glock with a reflex sight.

Gun rags shoot at 10 yards, I believe.


Instagram: MuzzleblastMD
 
Handgun accuracy?? How determined?

I lean towards -standing,, two hand unsupported hold - unless otherwise specified.
Distance - I'll usually list since it can vary.

I define accurate as 3 or more shots into a space within three times the diameter of the bullet away from where I want the shot to hit.
 
I don't get enough time at the range to spend any of it shooting handguns from a rest. I do almost all my accuracy testing with a standing two-hand hold.

Look at it this way--if your groups aren't tight enough to determine a consistent point of impact for a given point of aim, then what does it matter if the sights aren't set exactly correctly? :D
 
Look at it this way--if your groups aren't tight enough to determine a consistent point of impact for a given point of aim, then what does it matter if the sights aren't set exactly correctly?
Click to expand...
For me it's like an itch in the middle of my back - - that comes about while I'm swimming - -in the deep end of the pool ;).

Honestly though - I am so wrapped up with the whole "accuracy thing", it's an obsession.
 
There are any number of ways to determine accuracy: Ransom rest, solid rest, such as sandbags, and offhand.
Each has its place. Ransom for serious target shooting. Sandbags for everything less than serious target shooting. Finally, offhand generally used for informal target shooting, self-defense, drills and the like.

I believe that offhand accuracy is what most of us strive for. I also believe that Center of Mass, “salad plate” sized groups will be effective for 99% of 99% the time. So, that is what I try and achieve with my practice time.
 
Guess I'm another off hand, standing, two hands shooter with my handguns. Bad guys are not going to give you time to set up sandbags and I'm not hunting deer or bear with my 9mm.

Also that is how I judge accuracy of my hand loads. Don't really care how accurate they are out of a barrel locked in a vice because that is not the way I shoot them naturally.

With both my gun and my ammo I am looking for repeatability. If I cannot control the shot then I am defeating the purpose I believe.
 
Just to clarify, the reason I initially shoot a new to me gun or load from a rest is to determine the baseline capability of the gun and ammo I'm using. I think all of us have fired a gun that just would not group well, or tried a load recipe that just wasn't up to snuff in terms of accuracy. You can spend alot of time and ammo chasing elusive "acceptable" groups for nothing if the equipment is the culprit and you don't even know it because you never fired it from a good rest to see how the equipment itself performs. The way I look at it, if the firearm and ammo is proven to perform well with rested shooting, then we can be confident that sub-standard grouping off-hand is caused by the human element of the equation and can be addressed with more practice and/or correcting bad habits.

Not trying to say other methods and preferences are wrong, just explaining the reasoning behind my preferred method.
 
Is this offhand? They never say.
Click to expand...
Does it matter?

If that's where it hits with them shooting it, then that's where it hits with them shooting it.

My P95 shoots about four inches low and slightly left at 7-10 yards with my preferred handload, in my hands. Put it in my brother's hands, and it puts the same load a bit right and only slightly low.
Same sights. Same load. Same gun. Same shooting method (rested, standing, sitting, whatever...). Different results.

The difference is that I use a 6 o'clock hold with fixed-sight handguns, while my brother uses a bullseye hold. I was never taught or trained that way. I don't know why I do it (possibly since fixed sights are often wider?). Yet, I use a bullseye hold with adjustable sight handguns. It's just what I do; and, even though I recently identified the habit and recognize that it is less than ideal, I have no plans to put effort into breaking it.



Now, if you are referring to attempting to compare relative or potential accuracy across several models of handgun or several examples of the same handgun, then I do see some point in the discussion. It does matter, with the average shooter (including myself), whether or not the pistol was rested (and how).


For the record, I rarely rest a handgun in any way. Thinking back... I believe it's been at least five years since I tested a handgun with any kind of rest.
I shoot off-hand. I might as well test off-hand.
 
RIDE-RED you won't find me disputing your reasoning or anyone's for that matter as it's all about what you find acceptable and comfortable.

Now it may be that I already wrongly assume that most any quality weapon is going to be inherently more accurate than I will ever be. Which is why when I shoot I look for repeatability. Many times it's not the gun it's the interaction of the gun and the shooter.

I have shot many handguns that just were not a good fit for me. Absolutely nothing wrong with the gun. But because of the size, shape, weight, grip, whatever I just could not get comfortable with it or easily repeat shots.

A handgun is primarily for most used for self defense and in that vein I want to be able to pick it up and reliably and consistently but the gun on target w/o having to think about my grip or if I am going to be able to quickly get on target or is my bullet going to where I'm pointed.
 
^^^Yes Sir, absolutely.^^^

I believe you are right about quality firearms generally being plenty accurate.

Being that my handguns are primarily used for hunting purposes I think it changes what is considered good or acceptable in terms of the whole package involved in sending rounds downrange, including the flawed human behind the trigger ;) :)

I think what we might be touching on here and the real question posted in the thread is how one purpose for a handgun might be better suited to a different focus in training and practice. SD purposes require the skill to end and attack as quickly and effectively as one can to facilitate an escape for the attackee. Where hunting purposes the goal is one well placed shot that results in a quick and humane kill that the game animal deserves.
 
I can't shoot my handguns well off a rest. I've tried. It's unnatural feeling and the recoil has a more adverse affect than when I shoot unsupported. I like to start out at about 10 yards. Anything less seems too easy. As I move back to 15 yards, 20 yards, and 25 yards, my groups open up and I get an occasional flyer. My pistol is 9mm with a 3.8" barrel. It's not a target pistol and I don't use it for hunting. At 10 yards, I'm getting 2" groups. At 25 yards I can consistently hit center mass or make head shots 2 handed, unsupported. For me and what I'm shooting, I'm pretty happy with that. I'll forever be trying to tighten up my longer shots, though.
 
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