gun store ignorance
- Thread starter bacardisteve
- Start date
Last month when I was at a gunshop I've done business with for over 35 years, I was in buying a Ruger .22 Single-Six as a gift for a valued nephew.
Counter kid handed it to me, grabbed it back in a hurry when I removed the cylinder to get the plastic plug out to check the action. "Don't do that with OUR gun! You'll scratch it!"
Told him it was my gun if it checked out OK, he reluctantly handed it back. Came within a heartbeat of losing the sale. Had it not been for the fact that I intended to put the gun on the account I've had there since 1979 & didn't want to drive all over looking for another 4 5/8-incher, I would have left him standing there with a handful of pieces. Also would have had a word with either of the two owners I've known for years, one of whom has been to my home.
At the checkout stand I told him I'd opened up a Ruger before. "Yeah, I can tell, but you just did it so fast I didn't have a chance to stop you."
Did not tell him my first Ruger SA, also a Single-Six, was acquired in 1975, long before he was born. Why bother?
That shop, on the whole, has been a mostly pleasant experience over the years, with an occasional glitch behind the counter.
When I mentioned the incident to my Ruger rep later, he told me in way too many cases the biggest hindrance in selling their products in general tends to be the Gunshop Counter Idiot (my term, he was a little more polite). (No offense to counter people who are NOT idiots.
) Said Ruger can deal with manufacturing & distribution & customer service issues, but can't do a thing about the GCI.
Thought that was interesting.
Much of the time when I'm looking or buying at a gunshop, I apparently project such an aura of iggorance that I get "educated" on whatever it is I'm interested in or asking to see.
When I go gun shopping, I know exactly what I want & usually know more about it than the guy behind the glass. But, I'm not the "average" customer.
Denis
Counter kid handed it to me, grabbed it back in a hurry when I removed the cylinder to get the plastic plug out to check the action. "Don't do that with OUR gun! You'll scratch it!"
Told him it was my gun if it checked out OK, he reluctantly handed it back. Came within a heartbeat of losing the sale. Had it not been for the fact that I intended to put the gun on the account I've had there since 1979 & didn't want to drive all over looking for another 4 5/8-incher, I would have left him standing there with a handful of pieces. Also would have had a word with either of the two owners I've known for years, one of whom has been to my home.
At the checkout stand I told him I'd opened up a Ruger before. "Yeah, I can tell, but you just did it so fast I didn't have a chance to stop you."
Did not tell him my first Ruger SA, also a Single-Six, was acquired in 1975, long before he was born. Why bother?
That shop, on the whole, has been a mostly pleasant experience over the years, with an occasional glitch behind the counter.
When I mentioned the incident to my Ruger rep later, he told me in way too many cases the biggest hindrance in selling their products in general tends to be the Gunshop Counter Idiot (my term, he was a little more polite). (No offense to counter people who are NOT idiots.
) Said Ruger can deal with manufacturing & distribution & customer service issues, but can't do a thing about the GCI.Thought that was interesting.
Much of the time when I'm looking or buying at a gunshop, I apparently project such an aura of iggorance that I get "educated" on whatever it is I'm interested in or asking to see.
When I go gun shopping, I know exactly what I want & usually know more about it than the guy behind the glass. But, I'm not the "average" customer.
Denis
This raises a good question. Many guns, especially revolvers, are expensive, even for gun stores. And, they scratch easily. Yet, most folks want to handle and work the action on the gun they intend on buying. How many customers will work that action before you get a scratch, a ding or drag line on the cylinder?
I don't know, but I suspect Ruger won't accept a marred gun back from a gun store due to negligent handling by a customer. So, it's one thing for Ruger to call counter-jockeies "idiots" for being overly cautious about letting tire-kickers handle guns. But, it's not Ruger that loses any money when someone starts spinning the cylinder, flips cylinder to close it, dings or scratches the gun.
I don't know, but I suspect Ruger won't accept a marred gun back from a gun store due to negligent handling by a customer. So, it's one thing for Ruger to call counter-jockeies "idiots" for being overly cautious about letting tire-kickers handle guns. But, it's not Ruger that loses any money when someone starts spinning the cylinder, flips cylinder to close it, dings or scratches the gun.
I agree with you on wanting to take down a gun or (somewhat) field strip it as part of my decision making process. I'm not trying to be critical, however I do always ask before I start tearing one down because, in my opinion, until I pay for it, it is still the store's gun and not mine yet.
Stressfire
New member
Depends where you go, but the shop I frequent usually has a "display" model if they have multiples or if it is a popular make/model.
I do make a habit of not getting the display model though and ask if they have one that hasn't been handled or stripped by half the county
The same ones who'll slam the cylinder shut, dry-fire it a dozen times, then insist on getting one nobody's touched yet.
It's really not feasible to have "floor models" at the margins gun shops make. Asking a dealer to essentially double his inventory is asking for prices to go up correspondingly.
Then the guy who abuses the action goes and orders a new one off the internet because it's cheaper.
See, this is what bugs me - Ruger (referencing a previous post) complains about how the counter guy handles customers who want to check out a gun. I can understand the customer wanting to check out the gun. I can also understand the shop not wanting to have NIB guns molested by customers. There should be some program where the Manufacturer provides Demos to retailers specifically for the customer to handle. Maybe on some kind of exchange basis, nominal fee, or perhaps its a factory refurbished firearm. How much can it cost a manufacturer to provided dealer demos? What would this cost be compared to what they spend in other advertising?
The primary shop I buy from has always had new ones in the warehouse when it comes to current models from major manufacturers. It's been that way since I moved here in '72. They'll sell you the display model if you like. I've bought the display model once or twice because it looked better than the new one from the warehouse. Some people say they're all the same, but they aren't.
Another shop sold me an original Colt WWI Repro when they were new and hard to get. I just happened to get there before he had a chance to hang the price tag on it. He wouldn't let me rack the slide or drop the hammer until I indicated I was serious about it and he new my father and I so that helped. What a great shooter it turned out to be.
It's nice to trust the shop owner. A couple of times he's said he can knock the price down a little and we'll start the paper work, etc. When it comes time to pay, then he tells me how much it is and it's always worked out fairly.
I was raised to always ask to touch, dry fire or disassemble. It's just simple politeness when you handle someone else's stuff.
JT
Another shop sold me an original Colt WWI Repro when they were new and hard to get. I just happened to get there before he had a chance to hang the price tag on it. He wouldn't let me rack the slide or drop the hammer until I indicated I was serious about it and he new my father and I so that helped. What a great shooter it turned out to be.
It's nice to trust the shop owner. A couple of times he's said he can knock the price down a little and we'll start the paper work, etc. When it comes time to pay, then he tells me how much it is and it's always worked out fairly.
I was raised to always ask to touch, dry fire or disassemble. It's just simple politeness when you handle someone else's stuff.
JT
Business is business. A friendly, helpful gunstore is making a business decision on the idea that this behavior will help them make a profit and continue to do so. Unfortunately this seems to turn out to be a bad bet more often than not. Just look at all the gunstore related posts on TFL. Stores like that are a dying breed. If they're disappearing it's because the model doesn't work as well as you'd think.
WalMart sells guns and ammo at many of their locations. This tells me that it is POSSIBLE to sell guns and ammo profitably in a store. But it may not be possible for the average gunstore owner who doesn't have his overhead covered by the hoi polloi buying everything else under the sun.
I look at a gunstore (and any other kind of store for that matter) like I look at a car dealership; as an amicable enemy. They can't make me spend my money and I can't make them stop trying to rip me off. All I can do is know what I'm buying and refuse to pay more than I'm willing to part with. I'm not going with the local just because he's local. If he's got a deal I'll take it. But if WalMart or cheaperthandirt has a deal I'll take that too.
WalMart sells guns and ammo at many of their locations. This tells me that it is POSSIBLE to sell guns and ammo profitably in a store. But it may not be possible for the average gunstore owner who doesn't have his overhead covered by the hoi polloi buying everything else under the sun.
I look at a gunstore (and any other kind of store for that matter) like I look at a car dealership; as an amicable enemy. They can't make me spend my money and I can't make them stop trying to rip me off. All I can do is know what I'm buying and refuse to pay more than I'm willing to part with. I'm not going with the local just because he's local. If he's got a deal I'll take it. But if WalMart or cheaperthandirt has a deal I'll take that too.
The display model was stainless, I asked him to bring out a blued one from the back room.
Stood there looking it over, which I'd told him I was going to do, said "Looks like the cylinder has to come out to get the plug out", and didn't immediately remove the base pin, nor did the guy immediately offer to help.
When I did, I wasn't throwing parts around, dropping the gun, plopping the cylinder down on the glass counter, or anything wild at all, just deliberately sliding the pin forward till it dropped loose, and rolling the cylinder out the frame window, all calm & controlled. I didn't even consider it fast.
The reaction was over done. He knew I was there to buy, I'd told him so.
Denis
Stood there looking it over, which I'd told him I was going to do, said "Looks like the cylinder has to come out to get the plug out", and didn't immediately remove the base pin, nor did the guy immediately offer to help.
When I did, I wasn't throwing parts around, dropping the gun, plopping the cylinder down on the glass counter, or anything wild at all, just deliberately sliding the pin forward till it dropped loose, and rolling the cylinder out the frame window, all calm & controlled. I didn't even consider it fast.
The reaction was over done. He knew I was there to buy, I'd told him so.
Denis
Regarding the risk of damage by a customer to a expensive and presumably limited stock item, i wonder how car dealerships feel about that? I would guess they carry insurance to cover damage during a test drive when the customer can't. I would assume they consider that as much a "cost of doing business" as MickeyD's does the free ketchup packs & napkins on the counter.
WalMart and Bud's don't have to hire and pay knowledgeable employees. They don't have to show guns, explain features, sit patiently through inane political rants, or show the customer how to clean them. They just need a guy who's competent to do data entry.
What irks me is people who think they have the right to take free advantage of a brick & mortar shop's time, knowledge and services when they have every intention of buying their wares elsewhere.
If it is wrong to use the resources of a brick and mortar store to research a firearms purchase from an online seller, is it also wrong to slow down the servers or take up the time of operators of an online firearms seller while researching online a purchase that will be made at a local brick & mortar store?
Personally, right or wrong, i've done most of my research online for my firearms purchases in the past few years, though most of the purchases were made at brick and mortar stores.
Personally, right or wrong, i've done most of my research online for my firearms purchases in the past few years, though most of the purchases were made at brick and mortar stores.
checkmyswag
New member
I'm fortunate that I live in a city (you country folks may consider that an oxymoron!) that has multiple good gun shops, so I get to choose the best of the good ones.
My LGS is reasonably well stocked (not big though), very personable, reasonably priced and just a laid back experience devoid of being ran down because you like/prefer something more than the owner/employee.
I force myself to buy there instead of the decent gun show that comes to town (which has some dealers with GREAT prices). May pay slightly more, but its worth it to me.
If your local LGS has lousy service, don't feel bad about buying at gun shows, sporting goods stores. I prefer small retailers and mom and pop joints, but when they can't compete on price they HAVE to compete on service. If they don't/won't do that, then they deserve to lose your business and eventually close up shop.
My LGS is reasonably well stocked (not big though), very personable, reasonably priced and just a laid back experience devoid of being ran down because you like/prefer something more than the owner/employee.
I force myself to buy there instead of the decent gun show that comes to town (which has some dealers with GREAT prices). May pay slightly more, but its worth it to me.
If your local LGS has lousy service, don't feel bad about buying at gun shows, sporting goods stores. I prefer small retailers and mom and pop joints, but when they can't compete on price they HAVE to compete on service. If they don't/won't do that, then they deserve to lose your business and eventually close up shop.
Its one thing for them to make suggestions on purchases especially if the product they are suggesting is close in features and price. Basically all things considered equal. But its another thing to have them push things off. Just to sell for commission. And then lack the knowledge of such things to back up what they are saying.
The funny part is when we go to a gun shop or a table at a gun show and I show guys a pic of dad's Thompson and they try and tell me his gun is not a commercial. And dad is on the other side of the table and has to guide them in the right direction of thinking. It gets annoying when some of them display such stupidity. Makes you want to just leave.
The funny part is when we go to a gun shop or a table at a gun show and I show guys a pic of dad's Thompson and they try and tell me his gun is not a commercial. And dad is on the other side of the table and has to guide them in the right direction of thinking. It gets annoying when some of them display such stupidity. Makes you want to just leave.
+1 on this. But that first word is a big one "If".
I happen to think that it's not wrong. Not even an ethical grey area. I do it for many other products besides just guns.
No business has a right to exist. Not even the disappearing local gunstore.
Think about this thoroughly for a few minutes. Our entire concept of specialty retail stores didn't exist in most of America just a few generations ago. You bought what the local store stocked, or you special ordered thru the local store or a catalog. This is highly similar to what happens with online gun purchases today. Things are coming full circle. Web purchases delivered to your front porch are taking us back to the days of catalog stores.
Can you see Sears coming out with a "Plaxico Burress" line of firearms?
SWglockmagnum
Moderator
i used to have a x39 SKS.. it was great... the one i had wasn't accurate enough to hit a deer beyond maybe 200 yards, but it was still fun to take out plinking.
and that's not to say ALL sks's are like that, but the one i had certainly was. it had seen some war i think. lol
and that's not to say ALL sks's are like that, but the one i had certainly was. it had seen some war i think. lol