Gov/public school: another +1 for privatization? student suspended for
- Thread starter theinvisibleheart
- Start date
DonR101395
New member
No, they stand in as the educator. Nothing more, nothing less. That is one of the problems with this country, people want them to stand in as the parent. It makes it much easier on the parent. I used to repo them for trips to museums, the zoo, even to get an early start on an unplanned camping trip or to go to the range.
BoringAccountant
New member
That sentence blows this...
out of the water.
Kid is having a rough time for any number of reasons, needs to talk to dad or hear that he is ok and that he (son) will be fine, you know father reassurances, but since he is in Iraq he can't just sit around and wait for him to call, he has to go to school. Mom is able to email dad, tell him to call Johnny and he does. Maybe Johnny wasn't expecting the call, had the ringer on by accident, or any number of scenarios. Bottom line, school admins should intervene at some point and tell the teacher where to shove that suspension slip. Johnny broke the rules, but betcha he would do it again all over.
No I don't, what was it like, I am too young. All I have ever known is this legalistic society hell bent on punishing anything that doesn't jive with a rule book.
Not to bicker but,
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_stud.html
It's nice that you've been able to do that. In Ohio, parents have been jailed for failing to produce their children at school.
BoringAccountant
New member
Funny story sort of along the same lines...in my private school my friends dad used to be ALWAYS late dropping the kids off...he had four little ones to get ready while mom was already at work so it was a chore for a dad to that, especially since 3 were girls. Anyway, one of the little girls...2nd grade at the time I believe, was told by the teacher one day that if she was late to school one more time she would be getting detention. She went home, told dad, and the next day without fail they were late (late being 10-15 minutes, not too absurd) and sure enough she got detention. Dad stormed into admins office gave him a piece of you know what and the admin went to the teacher that gave it and did the same. Girl never served detention and dad worked to get them there on time after that.
Common sense needs to be followed in all that we do, following some rule book to the T won't solve anything.
Common sense needs to be followed in all that we do, following some rule book to the T won't solve anything.
Yet they cannot give medical care, hand out an aspirin or do many of the other things parents can... The loco parentis rights of the school are very limited. They are not "mom and dad are away so the principal can do as he pleases." There is no way in loco parentis would override that actual parent, on the phone, from Iraq...
DonR101395
New member
I understand you're not bickering, it's not my intention either.
But IMHO, some folks on both sides of the fence have given too much freedom of parenting to the schools. I agree with discipline in the school, however the one ultimately responsible for junior or junioret is the parent. I had my share of discussions with "school counselors" who thought they were my daughters parents. I always left their office on good terms with them, but they also understood who was in charge of my daughters(2) care and well being; and it wasn't them. That's not to say they shouldn't do their jobs, sometimes they just need to be reminded that the kids are on loan to them for the day and not theirs to do with as they please.
toybox99615
New member
so where is the connection in this for private schools
the OP was premised on some connection to private schools. So far in this thread that part of the issue has been missing.
I doubt there would be any less controversy if the kid in class was attending a private school with the same rules regarding cell phones. And I certainly doubt all private schools would have allowed the call from daddy as a special exception any more than the public school did. If anything my experience with the private schools is they tend to have more rules along these lines than do public schools.
What I'm seeing is simply an attempt to make a some connection to private schools where no connection exist.
the OP was premised on some connection to private schools. So far in this thread that part of the issue has been missing.
I doubt there would be any less controversy if the kid in class was attending a private school with the same rules regarding cell phones. And I certainly doubt all private schools would have allowed the call from daddy as a special exception any more than the public school did. If anything my experience with the private schools is they tend to have more rules along these lines than do public schools.
What I'm seeing is simply an attempt to make a some connection to private schools where no connection exist.
brokencowboy
Inactive
Interview this morning
According to a live interview on a morning news program, the student had his phone on vibrate. When it went off, he stepped out of class & the teacher followed him. He told the teacher the call was from his dad & after a couple of minutes, the teacher went back into the classroom. When the student finished the call, he went back into the class, only to be hand a discipline notice & tdd to go to the principle. According to the student & his mother, the administration had an agreement that the student could take calls from his father at any time.
During the interview, it came out that though it took some time, the administration finally apologized. The mother's concern was having the suspension removed from her son's record.
According to a live interview on a morning news program, the student had his phone on vibrate. When it went off, he stepped out of class & the teacher followed him. He told the teacher the call was from his dad & after a couple of minutes, the teacher went back into the classroom. When the student finished the call, he went back into the class, only to be hand a discipline notice & tdd to go to the principle. According to the student & his mother, the administration had an agreement that the student could take calls from his father at any time.
During the interview, it came out that though it took some time, the administration finally apologized. The mother's concern was having the suspension removed from her son's record.
I agree that my HS would not have allowed me to leave in the middle of a class for a cell phone call.
The suggested connection is that this is controversial because this was a government school. If it were a private school there could be no controversy because the customer, i.e. the parent, would have agreed to the rules, and the school would need to act reasonably or suffer the loss of a customer and student halfway through its program.
Public highschools don't lose money when a student leaves.
Ain't that just wonderful. Have an baby in while in middle or high school and get free baby sitting. Be a cronic juvinile offender, and no problem. Take a call from your dad who is fighting for his counrty and you get thrown out.
Sure, we have to enforce the rules, but maybe a little compassion and common sence could be allowed into the mix. Oop, I forgot - in education, common sense is a big no-no.
Sure, we have to enforce the rules, but maybe a little compassion and common sence could be allowed into the mix. Oop, I forgot - in education, common sense is a big no-no.
JuanCarlos
New member
"Thrown out?" He got suspended, not expelled. And it sounds like even the suspension got largely cleared up.
I'd also suggest that the student learned a healthy lesson; a lot of people simply won't care. My wife learned the same when I was deployed, on several occasions. Sometimes in life you have to decide what your priorities are, and I think this kid chose well. Not everybody is going to care that you, or your family member, are off "fighting for your country."
If we're talking about a school in which half the students have family members deployed, how exactly can they expect to follow the rules if they make an exception for this? You can't realistically enforce a rule that half the student body is exempt from.
The bolded is interesting. I can understand the teacher handing him off to the principal to deal with; that's probably the most appropriate response, though preferably he could have just been sent after class. But whatever. At that point the principal exercised what I'd consider to be poor judgment; even more so if there actually was some agreement before hand regarding the student being allowed to take calls during school in this situation.
What a Hoot!
One time I asked to go to the rest room. The instructor said no you can wait until break. I got up and did what I had to do!
The kid did what he had to do!
Schools are there to learn in.
They are not institution of control.
You should here some of the stuff my 7 year old tells me of what they ask about his home life.
If the father called the school and asked to talk to his kid would they have got the kid?
When I was over seas, it was a major endeavor to place a phone call to the states. Ok things as better now but you don't just pick up the phone and make the call!
One time I asked to go to the rest room. The instructor said no you can wait until break. I got up and did what I had to do!
The kid did what he had to do!
Schools are there to learn in.
They are not institution of control.
You should here some of the stuff my 7 year old tells me of what they ask about his home life.
If the father called the school and asked to talk to his kid would they have got the kid?
When I was over seas, it was a major endeavor to place a phone call to the states. Ok things as better now but you don't just pick up the phone and make the call!
JuanCarlos
New member
I'd say it's 50/50. They may have instead just taken a message. Even if they did get him, that's going to take quite a bit of time (depending on the size of the school)...time that dad doesn't necessarily have (see below, and previous post).
It's not great now, either. At our FOB it could get up to a 2 hour wait for phones, or longer. Generally you'd sign up, go away for an hour, then come back for the second hour and wait...because if you got skipped, it was back to the back of the line. And calls were limited to 15 minutes. It may have gotten better in the last couple years, but with more soldiers I'd actually not be surprised to find out that it's worse.
I'd say the consequences of denial are a little different in the two cases. I was in a situation where the teacher said I couldn't go to the bathroom too, and I just went. They actually tried to take it up the chain and cause some trouble, but the principal was pretty clear that you couldn't deny somebody that particular trip.
Some teachers are just on power trips. At the same time, keeping a class of 30 teenagers isn't exactly easy sometimes.
True. At the same time, this is the kind of thing that, if it was allowed to go on unchecked, could be pretty easily abused and lead to a disruptive environment that isn't conducive to learning. So yes, some semblance of control must be maintained.
Sending the kid to the principal was probably a good call. Put me in the principal's chair, and I'd probably do a few things: I'd get in touch with the mother to ascertain who the call was from and that it was okay with her, make it clear that this was not going to be an everyday thing, then tell the kid I hope his dad's doing alright. Sounds like this principal was a bit more of a douchebag. But to some extent, that's their prerogative.
And again, it's probably best that the kid learn now that military deployments aren't a free pass with everybody, and some places will still enforce their rules/policy regardless.
Let’s see now: obey the Kommandant thereby missing a call from my father, serving in a war zone half-a-world away or ignore the Kommandant and take the call from dad, possibly the last time I get to talk to him.
I would take the call, tell the Kommandant to shove the place up his a$$ and spend my time taking a vacation. Of course, I would have had to beat my mother to it!!!
To those that think that a phone call of this nature is so unimportant I question what kind of relationship you had with your parents. Mine was close, warm, and loving. Being separated in this manner would have been indescribable. I can’t imagine how anyone could blithely dismiss a phone call of this nature. To those that can I truly feel sorry for you.
I would take the call, tell the Kommandant to shove the place up his a$$ and spend my time taking a vacation. Of course, I would have had to beat my mother to it!!!
To those that think that a phone call of this nature is so unimportant I question what kind of relationship you had with your parents. Mine was close, warm, and loving. Being separated in this manner would have been indescribable. I can’t imagine how anyone could blithely dismiss a phone call of this nature. To those that can I truly feel sorry for you.
JuanCarlos
New member
Well, keep in mind that in this case a "vacation" might well mean lowered grades (many schools don't allow make-up work from suspensions) and not getting into the college of your choice (the suspension itself, combined with the lowered grades, aren't going to help there). For a kid taking school seriously, a suspension is actually a pretty severe punishment.