General Purpose Rifle Choices
- Thread starter Eyes of I
- Start date
"I don't think it means what you think it does....."
Would that be the Crow Huntish Dialect?
Nothing is optimum for all situations, Thus "Horsefeathers" (aka "Nonesuch, "Unicorn Blood", etc.) ..... the more specialized the the tool, the less usefull it will be outside it's specialty......
""The general-purpose rifle will do equally well for all but specialized hunting, as well as for fighting; thus it must be powerful enough to kill any living target of reasonable size. If you insist upon a definition of 'reasonable size,' let us introduce an arbitrary mass figure of about 1,000 lb." -Jeff Cooper
I would add that a GP rifle is also incapable of sustained suppressive fire, but that is not properly done with an individual rifle, in any case- that role would be done by a crew-served automatic weapon...... and suppressive fire is not really an option for an individual without the support of a Government level Supply Chain ........
Agreed.
Also Agreed.
The only problem is that reality is not like HALO or CoD: you can't just tap a button and have a more task-suitable weapon appear from a list: you can only carry so much, and packing a sniper rifle, a sub-gun, a battle rifle, a rocket launcher and fodder for all those is just not going to happen outside of a video game ...... you can have a whole collection of guns, but one is all you can use at a time. If one is all you have.... your "go to" rifle should be able to do everything you need to do..... thus the "GP" rifle.
Would that be the Crow Huntish Dialect?
Nothing is optimum for all situations, Thus "Horsefeathers" (aka "Nonesuch, "Unicorn Blood", etc.) ..... the more specialized the the tool, the less usefull it will be outside it's specialty......
""The general-purpose rifle will do equally well for all but specialized hunting, as well as for fighting; thus it must be powerful enough to kill any living target of reasonable size. If you insist upon a definition of 'reasonable size,' let us introduce an arbitrary mass figure of about 1,000 lb." -Jeff Cooper
I would add that a GP rifle is also incapable of sustained suppressive fire, but that is not properly done with an individual rifle, in any case- that role would be done by a crew-served automatic weapon...... and suppressive fire is not really an option for an individual without the support of a Government level Supply Chain ........
Agreed.
Also Agreed.
The only problem is that reality is not like HALO or CoD: you can't just tap a button and have a more task-suitable weapon appear from a list: you can only carry so much, and packing a sniper rifle, a sub-gun, a battle rifle, a rocket launcher and fodder for all those is just not going to happen outside of a video game ...... you can have a whole collection of guns, but one is all you can use at a time. If one is all you have.... your "go to" rifle should be able to do everything you need to do..... thus the "GP" rifle.
Crow Hunter
New member
I wasn't stating or trying to imply that it was. Sorry if you mistook me.
I was, however, trying to coax the primary usage for the rifle out of a very vague and open ended question by stating there isn't an answer. More details are needed to narrow down the focus.
A Cooper'esque Scout Rifle, while it has very broad applications just about anywhere in the world, will not be (IMHO) much fun for a new rifle shooter to punch paper with at the range and practice his personal defensive tactics that "might" be used for hunting some undefined game animal.
If his needs don't fit Cooper's needs for a GP rifle, he may have a different "general purpose". Hence my comment that there is no such thing as a "general purpose" tool.
While I am wrong about the direct definition of "GP", I am not wrong in the context. "General Purpose" has to fit within a range of needs. If he buys a rifle that kicks too hard, has expensive ammo, and is difficult for him to use, such that it lanquishes in the back of his gun safe forever, it becomes "Generally Useless."
BigMikey76
New member
I think this statement sums it up pretty well. "General purpose" can mean many different things. A 16 oz hammer is a GP tool that will work for many pounding related chores, but it is sorely lacking if you need to fix a computer. Likewise, a jewler's screwdriver or small soldering iron that might work well for the computer won't drive a nail very well.
Determining the task that will most commonly need to be accomplished is the key to finding which GP tool will provide the best service... Will it be a hunting rifle, or is it likely to see only range use? Self/home defense? Long range target competition or brush hunting quick shots?
I can't think of any "one gun" that will fill all of these niches equally, but identifying the main purpose and allowing for secondary or tertiary needs can be done as long as the needs are reasonably identified.
To get back to the question at hand, though, the OP stated:
Any rifle can punch paper, with the smaller ones allowing longer sessions with less pain, but the addition of deer as a secondary usage narrows the field a bit. I would recommend a .243 bolt action. Light recoil means paper punching will still be fun and not leave you sore the next day, and it has enough chutzpah to take a deer when you need it to.
Just remember, though: my advice is only worth what you paid for it
tahunua001
New member
um....when did a general purpose plinker/hunter/home defense rifle question turn into what can lay down enough suppression fire? last time I was in Virginia, the paper targets and feral pigs didn't have machine gun nests the the average punk breaking into your home doesn't pack an uzi and a AK47. you have to remember that a Nebraskan's definition of general purpose rifle is going to vary greatly from an Alaskan's definition. a 243, 257(roberts and weatherby), 6.5 grendel, 6.8 SPC, 7mm-08, 30-30, 308, 30-06, 7.62x54R, and 303(british and savage) are all going to fit the OP's definition of general purpose very well. he doesn't need a night vision holographic scope on his phased plasma rifle with 40 watt range. he needs a gun that can put a hole in paper at 25 yards just as well as it can drop a coyote at 200 yards and if he absolutely has to drop an intruder from across his living room.
I might be completely wrong but that is is about as general purpose as it gets and an AK47, 10/22, 357 lever action, Barrett 50 cal, and 12 gauge pump gun do not fit those criteria at all, a medium to lightweight bolt action rifle in any of the aforementioned calibers fits the bill exceedingly well.
I might be completely wrong but that is is about as general purpose as it gets and an AK47, 10/22, 357 lever action, Barrett 50 cal, and 12 gauge pump gun do not fit those criteria at all, a medium to lightweight bolt action rifle in any of the aforementioned calibers fits the bill exceedingly well.
^+1
I think he layed it out pretty well. The OP didn't say small game and he didn't say elephants and he didn't say suppressive fire. If you do intend to truely shoot much at 200-300 yards I'd take .30-30 and .357 off the list (7.62x39 as well), especially for a new rifle shooter. .243, .308 and .30-06 are ubiquitous, and usually you can find a cheap box of hunting bullets anywhere. Basically you're looking at bolt guns and (I think this could fit your bill quite nicely) Remington Pumps (760, 7600) in your price range. I think Savage has a couple of current guns with iron sights and the pump guns do have them. If you look at used guns your options will open up a bit as irons were included on many older models. Now that's IF you want irons, which is something I consider mandatory on a GP rifle and, as you said a "survival" rifle.
I think he layed it out pretty well. The OP didn't say small game and he didn't say elephants and he didn't say suppressive fire. If you do intend to truely shoot much at 200-300 yards I'd take .30-30 and .357 off the list (7.62x39 as well), especially for a new rifle shooter. .243, .308 and .30-06 are ubiquitous, and usually you can find a cheap box of hunting bullets anywhere. Basically you're looking at bolt guns and (I think this could fit your bill quite nicely) Remington Pumps (760, 7600) in your price range. I think Savage has a couple of current guns with iron sights and the pump guns do have them. If you look at used guns your options will open up a bit as irons were included on many older models. Now that's IF you want irons, which is something I consider mandatory on a GP rifle and, as you said a "survival" rifle.
I am really getting a kick out of the rabbit holes these threads inevitably seem to go through...supressive firing and hot hunting in the same thread. I mentioned .357 simply because up unto 150 yards the calculated kinetic energy out of a 18 inch barrel is the same as a .223 which to me is pretty crazy...and I already have a blackhawk on the list. I had thought maybe to lean towards a savage hog hunter...plenty of calibers, good price (buds has them for 350?) And has irons which I have as a must....any experience with savage rifles? Or any other ideas? I do appreciate all the feedback from everyone
tahunua001
New member
I have no experience with savages but walmart has savage rifles in 30-06 for about $350 most of the time, I've never looked at the model numbers simply because I have no need of another bolt action but one of those might work well. also another gun for a person on a budget is the ruger american rifle which should also come in 308 and 30-06 and is about the same price and so far gets very high marks in all of the reviews I've read here at TFL.
bamaranger
New member
GP
The reference to Coopers scout rifle is apt, but many folks find the "scout scope" not for them. Take the IER scope out of the equation and replace with a conventional compact 4x (I like fixed powers) and the rest of the concept is still viable. A short, light weight, bolt rifle with adaptable shooting sling and back up sights. Cooper liked .308 ( so do I) as a GP caliber but the OP makes reference to whitetails only so .243 would work for him.
A Savage scout or the new Hoghunter would be a good start.
The reference to Coopers scout rifle is apt, but many folks find the "scout scope" not for them. Take the IER scope out of the equation and replace with a conventional compact 4x (I like fixed powers) and the rest of the concept is still viable. A short, light weight, bolt rifle with adaptable shooting sling and back up sights. Cooper liked .308 ( so do I) as a GP caliber but the OP makes reference to whitetails only so .243 would work for him.
A Savage scout or the new Hoghunter would be a good start.
I would personally spend a little more time saving up. $650 won't go very far for a single "do-all" rifle.
IMO, if I were to pick a single rifle that would be able to cover almost anything I could need it for it would be something like the new Colt LE901. That gun would provide .308 power for hunting, semi-automatic function and compact size for self defense, and the ability to swap uppers for economical practice in a cheaper caliber, like a 5.45x39, 5.56mm, or .22lr. The full length monolith upper makes mounting any type of optic you want very easy, and the free floated barrel should provide plenty of accuracy.
But, as the other said, if you want to keep prices down and are mainly thinking about hunting and paper punching a bolt gun in an economical caliber would work just fine. You also have to take a minute to consider your state's hunting laws, as some have restrictions of the minimum caliber and the magazine capacity.
IMO, if I were to pick a single rifle that would be able to cover almost anything I could need it for it would be something like the new Colt LE901. That gun would provide .308 power for hunting, semi-automatic function and compact size for self defense, and the ability to swap uppers for economical practice in a cheaper caliber, like a 5.45x39, 5.56mm, or .22lr. The full length monolith upper makes mounting any type of optic you want very easy, and the free floated barrel should provide plenty of accuracy.
But, as the other said, if you want to keep prices down and are mainly thinking about hunting and paper punching a bolt gun in an economical caliber would work just fine. You also have to take a minute to consider your state's hunting laws, as some have restrictions of the minimum caliber and the magazine capacity.
Crow Hunter
New member
You have to admit, rabbit holes are a lot of fun. Just look at Alice in Wonderland.
Sorry for getting you off track.
I have owned 2 savage rifles and my brother owns one now. I liked them a lot. All of them were very accurate and I really liked where the safety was.
I have a friend who has a .243 110 Predator that he doesn't like now that he has taken it hunting a couple of times. He says it is too barrel heavy and he wants to sell it. I don't know how it compares to the Hog Hunter though.
As I have gotten older, I have gotten a lot less enthusiastic about getting smacked around by recoil. Especially considering the limited amount of big game hunting that I do now. I do mostly field target shooting (no benches, around the farm shooting) and predator hunting, and "tacticool" training, so I tend to use ARs in .223.
I would ask some friends about trying out their rifles or renting some if they are available if you can, particularly if you are a new shooter. You don't want to plunk down your money and find out that the rifle kicks too much/doesn't fit right/shoots ammo that you can't find or is too expensive/too heavy and then you have to try to get rid of it and no one wants to buy it or you take too much of a hit on a trade. (My buddy's experience with his Savage)
Sorry for getting you off track.
I have owned 2 savage rifles and my brother owns one now. I liked them a lot. All of them were very accurate and I really liked where the safety was.
I have a friend who has a .243 110 Predator that he doesn't like now that he has taken it hunting a couple of times. He says it is too barrel heavy and he wants to sell it. I don't know how it compares to the Hog Hunter though.
As I have gotten older, I have gotten a lot less enthusiastic about getting smacked around by recoil. Especially considering the limited amount of big game hunting that I do now. I do mostly field target shooting (no benches, around the farm shooting) and predator hunting, and "tacticool" training, so I tend to use ARs in .223.
I would ask some friends about trying out their rifles or renting some if they are available if you can, particularly if you are a new shooter. You don't want to plunk down your money and find out that the rifle kicks too much/doesn't fit right/shoots ammo that you can't find or is too expensive/too heavy and then you have to try to get rid of it and no one wants to buy it or you take too much of a hit on a trade. (My buddy's experience with his Savage)
tahunua001
New member
+1, it is always a good idea to test drive before you buy. another person's preferences may not necessarily match your own so all the gun forum advice in the world can only go so far before it hits a brick wall.
carprivershooter
New member
I have read many of the post here. Tools can have a range of things they can do. A pocket knife can do a lot of different things, it is not the best tool to use in field dressing a deer but it can be done. I own several adjustable wrenches because they serve a several purposes, I also own a set of wenches and sockets they can do the same things as my wenches and socket just do it better. One rifle to do a lot of things well is possible. 30-06 is a good gun has the range out 200 yards. you can plink with it, for me my shoulder would get sore. For me I think a 30-30 would be close to fitting the general purpose rifle, It was for a lot of men for a lot of years. for me it's my 44 mag lever action. this is just my opinion, no better no worse then other presented here.
chucknbach
New member
My GP rifle is a .243. For me it kills everything from deer on down. Inside of 200 yds I'd use it for......well everything.
Since you have a "hoard" of pistols and shotguns you have covered your close in SD needs. A shotgun with slugs is good to 100 yds or so.
Since you are looking to shoot mostly targets with maybe some hunting you should look at a medium weight bolt gun which with scope should weigh between 9 and ten pounds. You might want to look at the weight limits for Metallic silhouette competition. These are fun shoots. I like the 9 to 10 pounds as it is not to heavy to carry on a hunt but not to light to shoot repeatedly on the range.
As to cartridge, 308 and 30-06 are probably the most versatile and available rounds in the US. These cartridges are come in a variety of bullet weights which allow you to shoot light bullets for prairie dogs up to Elk using the heavier bullets designed for large game.
The 243/6mm would also be a good choice. These rounds would allow you to go with a lighter rifle as the recoil is not as heavy as the 30caliber rounds. You are limited on the upper end of the game spectrum. They are good for white tail deer.
The 223/5.56 are good for varmints but not adequate for heavier animals.
My personal favorite round is the 257 Roberts. As a re loader I have the option to tailor my loads for their intended purpose and the rifle. Granted I will NEVER use this round on Elk. I have found the Roberts to be pleasant to shoot and very accurate. It is more economical to shoot than the other 25s.
In making your choice I have all ways felt that a proper fit is the most important factor in choosing any weapon. I purchased a Win Mod 70 in 338 win Mag because it fit. At the time I had no use for the round, but it worked for me.
Despite modern manufacturing techniques there are variations in the fit of each rifle. Try everyone on the rack and select the rifle that fits you in the caliber you select.
Good luck and enjoy.
Since you are looking to shoot mostly targets with maybe some hunting you should look at a medium weight bolt gun which with scope should weigh between 9 and ten pounds. You might want to look at the weight limits for Metallic silhouette competition. These are fun shoots. I like the 9 to 10 pounds as it is not to heavy to carry on a hunt but not to light to shoot repeatedly on the range.
As to cartridge, 308 and 30-06 are probably the most versatile and available rounds in the US. These cartridges are come in a variety of bullet weights which allow you to shoot light bullets for prairie dogs up to Elk using the heavier bullets designed for large game.
The 243/6mm would also be a good choice. These rounds would allow you to go with a lighter rifle as the recoil is not as heavy as the 30caliber rounds. You are limited on the upper end of the game spectrum. They are good for white tail deer.
The 223/5.56 are good for varmints but not adequate for heavier animals.
My personal favorite round is the 257 Roberts. As a re loader I have the option to tailor my loads for their intended purpose and the rifle. Granted I will NEVER use this round on Elk. I have found the Roberts to be pleasant to shoot and very accurate. It is more economical to shoot than the other 25s.
In making your choice I have all ways felt that a proper fit is the most important factor in choosing any weapon. I purchased a Win Mod 70 in 338 win Mag because it fit. At the time I had no use for the round, but it worked for me.
Despite modern manufacturing techniques there are variations in the fit of each rifle. Try everyone on the rack and select the rifle that fits you in the caliber you select.
Good luck and enjoy.
I have a Ruger 77/44 and I think I could use it on any thing from Dogs to Bear. It would be too much for squirrel and rabbit and not enough for Africa but it fits pretty well in the middle.
The other down side is that it is not great at long distances. There is a lot of drop with those heavier bullets.
The other down side is that it is not great at long distances. There is a lot of drop with those heavier bullets.
603Country
New member
Eyes, the very first response to your question was the perfect answer. All I'd add to what jmr40 said would be that you might consider a compact rifle, like a Remington Model 7 or a Ruger 77 Compact (or Savage if they have one). And yes, in 308 and in stainless with a synthetic stock. That's about as GP as it gets. It'd be light, easy to handle, rust resistant, and will shoot from here to yonder and be good for game in the range of mouse to moose. And just about every Bubba Hardware store in 'normal' states will have ammo.
Rustle in the Bushes
New member
General purpose for you- .308. Not a specific hunting gun, .308 is what you want for the range and can be used for the real world also.
Youre thinking survival gun so I would go with a sako A7, tikka t3, browning x bolt(synthetic), or a weatherby vanguard all under 1,000$. All synthetic.
Youre primarily shooting at the range Id go for the tikka or the sako theyll prolly be the most accurate.
Youre thinking survival gun so I would go with a sako A7, tikka t3, browning x bolt(synthetic), or a weatherby vanguard all under 1,000$. All synthetic.
Youre primarily shooting at the range Id go for the tikka or the sako theyll prolly be the most accurate.