G19 vs. Pit Bull
- Thread starter smith_6288
- Start date
Just remember. Your firearm is your last option. Every other option must be excercised first. Get used to thinking about it not as your gun, nor your expensive toy, nor a tool, nor your baby, but as your last option.
In any situation you have multiple possible branches of action/opportunity available.
In any situation you have multiple possible branches of action/opportunity available.
Sam Norton
New member
Hi Guys
A simple question. Isn't staying in the car when forced to stop a tactical disadvantage.
Best Regards
Sam
A simple question. Isn't staying in the car when forced to stop a tactical disadvantage.
Best Regards
Sam
A disadvantage in what sense?
You aren't in a scenario where you need to go offensive!
You are defensive (root of defending yourself). Period. You have some fortification in the car. You are not antagonizing by confronting. Your duty isn't to immediately find ground where you can manuever to eliminate offensive threats. Your duty is to protect yourself and not exacerbate the situation.
Any other mindset is at odds with the legal system.
You aren't in a scenario where you need to go offensive!
You are defensive (root of defending yourself). Period. You have some fortification in the car. You are not antagonizing by confronting. Your duty isn't to immediately find ground where you can manuever to eliminate offensive threats. Your duty is to protect yourself and not exacerbate the situation.
Any other mindset is at odds with the legal system.
tackdriver
New member
Any fool who thinks having thumbs is an advantage over a pit bull is an idiot. I know that a lot of the stuff you hear about pit bulls is pure hype. They aren't naturally aggressive dogs, but they are naturally persistent in a fight and are easily trained as attack dogs. One of my good friends has a 6 month old pit bull that can leap about 10 feet horizontally and 5 feet vertically from a crouch. He did this when we were playing one time and knocked me over. I about had to go home and change.
To make this short, a pit bull trained to attack, commanded to attack, probably would have ripped your throat out while you were still pulling your glock. Even if you HAD got a lucky shot and, say, managed to knock off a leg, the dog would have maimed you and if he got you down, you would have been dead meat. Pits trained to kill will not back down until they're dead, and that's a fact.
To make this short, a pit bull trained to attack, commanded to attack, probably would have ripped your throat out while you were still pulling your glock. Even if you HAD got a lucky shot and, say, managed to knock off a leg, the dog would have maimed you and if he got you down, you would have been dead meat. Pits trained to kill will not back down until they're dead, and that's a fact.
Glenn E. Meyer
New member
This is the second debate over whacky car interactions.
I would strongly advise folks to find a course dealing with car and such situations like
Insights Street and Vehicle Tactics.
I'm starting to wonder about my strong committment to concealed carry with folks so prone to get out and start a fight when they can just get out of there.
As far as you can win the fight - whenever someone says this, it demonstrates they are not thinking.
Take a serious look at gun shots and knife wounds. That's what you face, not some pumped up wrestling match. Grow the hell up.
I would strongly advise folks to find a course dealing with car and such situations like
Insights Street and Vehicle Tactics.
I'm starting to wonder about my strong committment to concealed carry with folks so prone to get out and start a fight when they can just get out of there.
As far as you can win the fight - whenever someone says this, it demonstrates they are not thinking.
Take a serious look at gun shots and knife wounds. That's what you face, not some pumped up wrestling match. Grow the hell up.
Smith_288 Amigo..
I disagree with the tone of some of our fellow's. First while you have no proof persay he did endanger your life with his "demolition derby driving". His dog is of the few breeds that would win you sympathy from any resonable court.
Most likely this man has a record/ pattern of crimminal offenses...personalities like his don't grow up on trees...
In short yes I would perfer to stay in the car, use my cell phone and keep my gun handy in case he attacked the car (providing me w/ proof of his intent)... I have no illusions about being a boxer, yet with no cops around I don't see any problem with you defending your honor and life with your fists!
As for the dog...that depends on how afraid you are of them in general... I have some experiance in that matter...if you fight one, even with a gun EXPECT TO GET MAULED a bit! Keep your cool and protect your vulnerable areas ( use jaw to cover neck, attack sideways, use jacket to bait the dog and SHOOT or stab)...
Otherwise given the bloodraising crap that happened you did o.k. And if this happens again you will know better...
Peace
IZZY
I disagree with the tone of some of our fellow's. First while you have no proof persay he did endanger your life with his "demolition derby driving". His dog is of the few breeds that would win you sympathy from any resonable court.
Most likely this man has a record/ pattern of crimminal offenses...personalities like his don't grow up on trees...
In short yes I would perfer to stay in the car, use my cell phone and keep my gun handy in case he attacked the car (providing me w/ proof of his intent)... I have no illusions about being a boxer, yet with no cops around I don't see any problem with you defending your honor and life with your fists!
As for the dog...that depends on how afraid you are of them in general... I have some experiance in that matter...if you fight one, even with a gun EXPECT TO GET MAULED a bit! Keep your cool and protect your vulnerable areas ( use jaw to cover neck, attack sideways, use jacket to bait the dog and SHOOT or stab)...
Otherwise given the bloodraising crap that happened you did o.k. And if this happens again you will know better...
Peace
IZZY
Heh. just had time to swing back through this topic for a second helping.
Yeah, something I omitted to mention in the first post:
Your best bet was, as many have said, to have stayed in the car...not even stopped if possible, and contacted the cops right away.
Someone mentioned being at a tactical disadvantage being in the car. Hmmm...depends on the scenario. In general, I'd have to say 'no.' A few reasons:
1. cars have this neat ability to move forwards and backwards in a comparatively rapid manner. Its called driving.
If someone is standing outside your car running his suck at you, you turn the key, shift gears, depress the accelerator and he goes away. This is also useful if he has a large dog, a baseball bat or a gun.
2. if your car is stuck, its a more level playing field...but its a place of shelter, he has to work to get in, and even if he does break a window, pop a lock and start to reach in, you can exit the other side and practice your wind-sprints. you're in no worse a position than you were if you popped out right away.
3. if he has a gun and your car won't go, you're in a real bad place....yes. Admittedly. a sitting target. I'm not sure, though, that it's significantly worse than having gotten out right away as he walked up and confronted him. If he has a gun and you don't, its all a matter of really really bad or really really really bad.
Once again, you best bet was not to have putn yourself in that position by stopping. But hey, live and learn. A stumble prevents a fall.
Mike
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"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein
Yeah, something I omitted to mention in the first post:
Your best bet was, as many have said, to have stayed in the car...not even stopped if possible, and contacted the cops right away.
Someone mentioned being at a tactical disadvantage being in the car. Hmmm...depends on the scenario. In general, I'd have to say 'no.' A few reasons:
1. cars have this neat ability to move forwards and backwards in a comparatively rapid manner. Its called driving.
If someone is standing outside your car running his suck at you, you turn the key, shift gears, depress the accelerator and he goes away. This is also useful if he has a large dog, a baseball bat or a gun. 2. if your car is stuck, its a more level playing field...but its a place of shelter, he has to work to get in, and even if he does break a window, pop a lock and start to reach in, you can exit the other side and practice your wind-sprints. you're in no worse a position than you were if you popped out right away.
3. if he has a gun and your car won't go, you're in a real bad place....yes. Admittedly. a sitting target. I'm not sure, though, that it's significantly worse than having gotten out right away as he walked up and confronted him. If he has a gun and you don't, its all a matter of really really bad or really really really bad.
Once again, you best bet was not to have putn yourself in that position by stopping. But hey, live and learn. A stumble prevents a fall.
Mike
------------------
"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." -Robert Heinlein
Smith, it is natural to get upset at bad drivers, but when he started swerving, it is time to take another road. Real men walk (drive) away. I hope that until you get a handle on your temper, you do not carry your Glock. Lastly, about fighting, my dad taught me it was better to be a lover than a fighter. If you don't learn to walk away, one of these days all your "modestly" esteemed fighting skills will go down with one blow, from a .45! Life is for living, be a Man, walk away, especially if you are packing. --plinker2--
Sam Norton
New member
When someone forces you off the road wouldn't that be considered intent to do bodily harm, assuming you could prove it? 2nd if the guy is not physically tough looking there is a good chance he is armed (He plans on winning somehow usually a weapon or maybe somekind of training) and knowing you would be a sitting duck if he starts shooting. I realize your first option is drive away from the guy if posible but if that fails for what ever reason then would you still stay in the car or would you take a defensive postion behind your car asap! and order him to stop and get back in his car. For me I am not sure, I guess it would depend on how aggressively he was trying to run me off the road.
Best Regards
Sam
Best Regards
Sam
Difficult to understand as to why you could not reverse and move away. If there were other cars around you, then you have witnesses and others agitated at this guy. The phone is definitely the way to go when you can not retreat. Once he attacks you in your car, we are talking a new ball game. As far as the dog goes, the mere presence of the dog changes the whole tone of the encounter, as the breed is considered to be dangerous. Shooting the dog standing by his master is one thing, but if the either were to advance toward you in a threatening manner, especially if you had expressed your concern about the dog, then you are at the majic threshold of assault and force to protect yourself is justified. In the state of Texas, if you posses a ccl, you are required to retreat if able. Nothing says you have to stand there and be mauled nor beaten half to death. 1. Do not get out of the car. 2. Get out of the area if possible. 3. Inform the police. This guy obviously isn't the sharpest knife in the box, and probably already has a record. 4. If you can not retreat, make him make the first move consistant with the need for self defense. If you must fight, use the means necessary to stop the assault on your person.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>A simple question. Isn't staying in the car when forced to stop a tactical disadvantage.[/quote]
It's hard to say. As a general rule, sitting in a parked car puts you in a very vulnerable position for a number of reasons:
1) Your visibility is limited (even with the mirrors). Rain, snow, or darkness can make things even worse.
2) If the windows are rolled up, it's hard to hear what's happening outside.
3) Your mobility is greatly impaired, even if you aren't wearing a seatbelt. Obviously, if the car is running and in gear, you can drive away very quickly, but if it's not, it takes time to start the car and get it moving.
So my personal preference is to avoid being stopped in the first place. If I have to stop, then it's time to think about getting out of the car and retreating on foot.
It's hard to say. As a general rule, sitting in a parked car puts you in a very vulnerable position for a number of reasons:
1) Your visibility is limited (even with the mirrors). Rain, snow, or darkness can make things even worse.
2) If the windows are rolled up, it's hard to hear what's happening outside.
3) Your mobility is greatly impaired, even if you aren't wearing a seatbelt. Obviously, if the car is running and in gear, you can drive away very quickly, but if it's not, it takes time to start the car and get it moving.
So my personal preference is to avoid being stopped in the first place. If I have to stop, then it's time to think about getting out of the car and retreating on foot.