FTE Stovepipes after the first 100 rds. with my P99

I will be sarcastic when I want
Click to expand...

:rolleyes:

Anything can be modified so that its performance is much better than stock.

As was pondered in a previous post, I wonder what was done to that Glock?

Does anyone have any idea as to what the malfunction rate for a stock Glock is?
 
Does anyone have any idea as to what the malfunction rate for a stock Glock is?

END

Very low the FBI has been through thousands of rounds without a problem when they tested stock 23 and 22. Chuck's gun was stock. The only thing he does different is he down loads glock mags by 2 rounds. Some do this others don't. I change the mag springs on my carry pistols once a year even before I was a glock fan so its not a big deal to me. I can tell you from personal experience that glocks are one of the most reliable designs currently made. They are one of the only pistols to work at -40 below and work in hot sandy weather as well. Heck I had a P99 that would not even work though one magazine without a malfunction.
PAT
 
Hey 355Sigfan: Don't you ever get tired of bashing anything non-Glock and non-357sig? I noticed that you came out looking pretty bad over on GT: http://glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=66587 It seems you "sarcastic math" didn't work very well for you over there, now here we are again, listening to your "junk science". In the space of 3 posts you say
YOu sound like a gun writter. The gun did great and functioned 100% except for the 50% of the time when it did not work.
Click to expand...
Then you immediately go into praise mode for a GUN WRITER, when it suits your purpose.
Chuck Taylors glock went 140000 rounds with only 2 malfunctions that were corrected with new magazine springs
Click to expand...
Gee it was 100% reliable, when we factor out those malfunctions related to magazine springs, and those malfunctions that I don't count because it would make my article pointless. A few threads ago, you started spreading more BS about the Glock vs. P99 trigger reset, ie:the Glock having a shorter reset, not that you could actually compare the 2 side by side, since you don't have a P99. You must have been going off of your "Bethel, mall ninja photographic memory". But since my memory isn't as good as yours, I actually put my P99 side by side with my Glock 19 and G17, guess what, you were FOS as usual, the P99 has a considerably shorter reset than the Glocks. Your one man crusade against Walther is pretty sad. I think maybe the stress of being a big time Bethel Ak. police officer is starting to get to you. My Glock 17 has gone many thousands of rounds, with <1% failure rate, my P99 has so far gone 2000+ rounds with NO malfunctions. OK in the interest of full disclosure, my P99 would not eat one particular lot# of Federal NyClad, which also choked my P228 and my G19, my G17 did fire the rounds successfully, this lot# also choked another posters Glock as well. So I consider this an ammo related problem.
They are one of the only pistols to work at -40 below and work in hot sandy weather as well. Heck I had a P99 that would not even work though one magazine without a malfunction
Click to expand...
Sorry again Pat, but the P99, the H&K USP, the Sig P228, and the Glock, have all passed the sub zero tests. As far as hot sandy weather, I think I got you beat on knowledge there, I live in the middle of the desert southwest. Fine powdery sand, 20mph wind and 110 degree weather, my P99 and my G17 get so hot they will "brand" you if you touch the slide, zero malfunctions for either one of them. Since you brought up sand, during an OPS tactical pistol course, sand locked down my wifes Glock 19, meanwhile my P99 happily digested its ammo without a single problem.
I keep hearing you SAY that you had a P99, but when it actually comes to your knowledge of P99's, I often wonder if you really owned one, or just have an "internet opinion" of them.
 
355sigfan,

Whether you believe me or not is of no concern. I am often called to be an S.O. at the IDPA matches and everyone who has a Glock has had one problem or another. This is not saying that at every match they have problems, but I have seen every single one of them have some sort of problem in the last 4 years on their own, not purposely induced. Even the 1911's, BHP, Beretta's, and a revolver. And yes my P99 had a slide lock prematurely 3 years ago.

As far as I am concerned, the Glock is a great gun. I think the 1911 is a great gun, I think the S&W revolver is a great gun. I really like the SIG lineup also. I personally love the P99. It has served me well. Shoots everything I put through it and besides the one slide lock I had with one of the first P99 .40's to hit this country, and any purposelly set peoblems that the IDPA Range master puts on my P99, it has shot flawlessly.

As far as Walther going the way of the Sigma. Dream on!!! The P99 is selling like hot cakes and its not because its a POS. The only problem I see right now with the P99 is that S&W has there hands on it. I've been seeing more and more .40 caliber P99's show up with S&W made slides and barrels. If S&W continues to make these, than yes, I might agree with you. Because as far as I'm concerned S&W doesn't know how to make a good Semi. Revolvers yes. Semi's NO. And the S&W made slides and barrels are inferior to the German made Walther ones.

P99
 
It is funny that someone will call another person "ignorant" and then use the term "stopping power" in the same post.


It is better to be silent and thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.
 
NMGlocker


If you read the post of Glock talk you will find nothing wrong with my math. A 357 sig at 1430 does have 50% more energy than a 9mm of the same weight at 1180. Go back and read or is that difficult for you.

The two malfunctions that happened with Chuck's 17 happened at around the 70000 mark and were back to back.

(Sorry again Pat, but the P99, the H&K USP, the Sig P228, and the Glock, have all passed the sub zero tests.)

The USP has from personal experience done well in the cold the sigs do not do so good past about -20 below. I never tested the P99 in the cold but I doubt the cold would have made the slide stop locking open. So it was unreliable at any temperature. I live in a climate were I have seen -50 below ambient and -100 with wind chill.

(Since you brought up sand, during an OPS tactical pistol course, sand locked down my wifes Glock 19,)

Bla Bla Bla. You have told that story a lot that’s fine. My Walther was not reliable in Ideal conditions much less poor ones.

(I actually put my P99 side by side with my Glock 19 and G17, guess what, you were FOS as usual, the P99 has a considerably shorter reset) I would believe someone else if they posted this but your version of the facts and reality seldom coincide.

P99 Said
(As far as Walther going the way of the Sigma. Dream on!!! The P99 is selling like hot cakes and its not because its a POS.)

I hope it does not go the way of the sigma. The one I had left a bad taste in my mouth. I noticed similar trends happening with the marketing of both pistols. I hope they work the bugs out of the P99 design and I hope it does well. More competition is a good thing. To be honest I have not seen that many people using P99 and no Leo’s at all. I am sure in some part of the country some cops are using it.

PAT
 
LOL :D
Pat I read your posts over on GT, but your contention that the .357sig had 50% more energy than the BEST 9mm was thoroughly trashed. I noticed that you tucked tail and stopped arguing that point over in GT, so are we going to have to start another thread here on TFL, so you can look ignorant on 2 bulletin boards?
And we all know Chuck Taylor wouldn't fudge his round count to help sell an article, or suck up to Glock.............
As to trigger reset, if you remember (I do) there were numerous others who verified that the P99 indeed does have a shorter reset than the Glock, don't make me have to use the search feature to once again make you into a liar.
As far as LEO's using P99's.......who gives a rat hole? Everyone in the free world knows that the vast majority of PD's purchase weapons based almost entirely on cost, as long as the weapon meets a few token requirements. And we all know that the majority of LEO's wouldn't know a locking block from an engine block.
The harder you try, the deeper your credibility sinks.
<edit>
NMGlocker said: I actually put my P99 side by side with my Glock 19 and G17, guess what, you were FOS as usual, the P99 has a considerably shorter reset
Click to expand...
to which our buddy PAT said.
PAT said: I would believe someone else if they posted this but your version of the facts and reality seldom coincide.
Click to expand...
I couldn't resist, here is the thread regarding trigger reset, the final 6-7 posts are the ones to look at. One other TFL'er who actually OWNS BOTH a Glock and a P99, Brasso, concurs that the P99 has a shorter reset. Unlike our friend here who supposedly USED to own a P99.
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...ighlight=p99 trigger reset glock&pagenumber=4
You might also check out this thread, the Walther P99 seems to have quite the short reset following in this thread as well.
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums...page=25&highlight=shortest reset&pagenumber=1
So, PAT, how does crow taste?
So fellow TFL'ers who is FOS me or PAT?
LOL :D
 
Last edited:
355sigfan,

I find it interesting that you've had one bad P99 and you jump on your soapbox to tell the world that it is a piece of crap. Earlier you said you had a Glock 27 that had a problem. How come you don't jump on your soapbox and tell the world that the Glock is a piece of crap. You even said yourself that all manufactures put out a lemon or two. So is Glock exempt from this. Apparently not with your 27. Nor the model 19 that I saw this weekend have a failure to feed. My father's Glock model 23 has had failure to ejects and my friend's issued Glock 22 has had a failure to fire, and failure to eject. (He's a deputy Sheriff by the way). So tell me why your so against everything but Glock, especially when you've had a problem with a Glock yourself.

By the way, have you gone by the name HARDEN on another talk board?

P99
 
By the way, have you gone by the name HARDEN on another talk board?

P99 That’s low Harden was an admitted convicted felon. Email me and I will give you my work number so I can assure you that I am a Leo and not Hardin.

NMglocker you have no credibility so you calling me a liar and ignorant means nothing. You even accuse Chuck Taylor of lying that’s a pure stupidity in its purest form. Also agencies pick sidearms based on multiple factors and cost is only one of them. Most agencies have a set number of specifications that must be made and then and only then is cost considered. GLocks arm 70% of US Leo's because they the best pistol going right now. Not because they are a little cheaper than some other designs. If cost were the only factor we would be armed with Sigma's or Ruger autos. As to the energy of the 9mm vs. the 357 sig only one load was not bested by the 357 sig by 50% and that’s Winchester Ranger 127 grain +p+ load at 1240. From actual chrono data on another form the velocity actually looks more like 1180 in a Glock 19. I based my 50% number based on actual loads I had available to test such as Remington’s +p 124 grain Saber load and Federals +p+ 124 grain hydra shock load and Corbons 125 grain +p 9mm load.

NMGlocker its time for you to crawl back into that hole you came from.
PAT
 
I keep hearing you SAY that you had a P99, but when it actually comes to your knowledge of P99's, I often wonder if you really owned one, or just have an "internet opinion" of them.
END

I can give you the serial number if you want proof of ownership. I still have one LEO mag for the pistol as a non leo bought the gun from me.
PAT
 
When discussing trigger reset and my personal experiences, Pat said:
PAT said: I would believe someone else if they posted this but your version of the facts and reality seldom coincide.
Click to expand...
then later
PAT said:NMglocker you have no credibility so you calling me a liar and ignorant means nothing.
Click to expand...
Yet I made a post with references TOTALLY debunking Pats version of the whole shorter reset argument. And anyone who wants can check out the GT thread to see PAT completely trashed over there.
c'mon PAT, at least put up a good fight. When I call YOU a liar, I post references contrary to your statements. When you call me a liar.........well you just can't back it up with verifiable references.
I can give you the serial number if you want proof of ownership. I still have one LEO mag for the pistol as a non leo bought the gun from me.
Click to expand...
And I too can make up a serial #, what does that prove?
As far as magazines for pistols I no longer own, or never even owned, I got a box full of them.
NMGlocker its time for you to crawl back into that hole you came from.
Click to expand...
You'd like that wouldn't you, if no one is here to point out your ignorance, then you'd look pretty darn credible.
 
I keep my P99, 9mm, German made,serial # 8 ***, just so I can complain about it. Mine came with a test target ,that looks wonderful, 2 recoil springs,one silver and one rust color, 3 extra front sights,of different heights,and a lousy 3 stage trigger that will get you killed if you use this" POC "as a carry gun..When I called S&W for warrantee they had just taken on the WALTHER, and didn't know what to tell me to do about the trigger that would not fire in it's rear most position,etc, etc, etc...Every time I read about how wonderful the P99 is it gives me an opportunity to complain,and that makes me feel a little better about the 600 bucks I paid for this POS..Keep up the thread, and make me happy..I'll stick with 355 SIG on this one..:)
 
On another note.
I guess i've just been lucky, i've never owned a pistol I considered a true POS.
Glock, Ruger, S&W, Walther, Sig, Beretta, Taurus, Kimber, H&K...... All of them went bang 99% of the time, and none have ever been back for repair or warranty for any reason. I guess I just don't understand how bitter someone can be over getting a "lemon".
 
It appears that our friend NMGlocker has no problems with breaking the law.
SNIP
Nope not LEO........
On occasion i'm willing to risk the "petty midemeanor"(Misdemeanor) that comes with concealed carry in NM.

SNIP

Conflicting statements for NMGlocker in the past.
(My wife did the same course with my G19, the only problem she had was the Glocks trigger got some crap in it and caused a horrendous trigger pull, but a little Rem-Oil and a good shake and it was good as new.)

Now he says this (The ONLY pistol i've EVER had mechanically malfunction on me (actually my wife) was a Glock 19 during an OPS tactical pistol class, the trigger grew steadily stiffer until it finally locked down tight, this was on day one of a two day class, in windy dusty conditions)

Which is it was it a simple fix or was it locked down tight lets hear the truth?


Here are various negative comments about the P99 I have snipped from the posts on TFL. To be fair the positive comments on the Walther outnumbered the negative.

SNIPs

Tried a Walther P99 the thing felt great in my hand but why would you put the decocker there?
Maybe I'll go back to that when the aftermarket companies come out with an aftermarket decocking lever that follows the contour of the slide down t where your thumb can actually reach it.

For me it is the Walther P99 I purchased on an impulse one day. I don't care for the trigger in DA or SA - I guess I'll just try to trade it for something else
One of the best looking pistols ever made. There are two things I dislike:

1. Sights. Front sight is too wide. Rear sight also too wide to accomodate front sight. Tought to be very accurate with these factory sights.

2. Trigger. Lots of "creep" before let-off...tought be be real accurate with it. Also feels very plasticky and cheap.
After 1000 plus rounds and three trips to Walther USA customer service, I have given up on my P99 .40s&w. The slide still locks back mid magazine depending upon which ammo I used. I own a couple of Sigs and have never had any problems of any kind with either one. The P99 was accurate but the slide lock malfunction just drove me crazy.

My P99 Military had six stovepipe jams in the first 400 rounds fired through the gun. It only happened with 115 grain ball,

I keep my P99 ,9mm to remind me how much better,and more reliable my other handguns are. I'm one that has a GERMAN LEMON in my WALTHER

I have the 40 cal version and have had some problems with the slide locking back prematurly. My brother in law has the 9mm version and has had no problems at all. I called S&W (who currently does the service on Walthers) and they said it was a common problem and they would fix it for me if I sent them the pistol

Well, it doesn't sound like the P99 is as reliable as a Glock, so I'll probably go with a G22 .40 cal.
Thank you all for the info on the P99 9mm. Mine is an early one with a serial # 89**. I guess I can look forward to problems down the road. I don't shoot it much because of the 3 stage trigger hanging up on stage 2. I wondered what all the fuss was when the Walther P99 first came out,and now I know. It looked and felt good. What a shame it's just another piece of junk. Guess I will wait for the right time to get rid of it. I don't think I will tell my local gun shop of the problems as he still has one in stock.If he knew about the problems he wouldn't sell it . A honest and moral guy.
I bought a P99 40 last month, and I love it. However, during the first 20 rounds, I experienced the problem of the slide not fully going back to battery.

END

There are many people happy with the P99 as well. The person I sold it too has put a new spring in for the slide stop we will see if that fixes the problem. Overall the p99 excluding the slide lock problem is a respectable gun. If this problem is fixed it should do well now that they lowered the price. Compared to a Glock however it has some lacking areas in my oppinion. In 40 sw it has more muzzle flip than a glock 23. It has a terrible first shot DA pull. The light rails don't accept the M3 or simular quality light thats not priced too high. The preban mags for it are expensive as heck in 9mm and the 40 mags are not supposed to exist yet they do. If I buy one again once I am satisified the bugs are gone it would be a 9mm. It seems the 9mm people have less complaints overall.
PAT
 
As far as reliablility goes These guns have been the best for me.

1. Sig 239 in 357 sig never had a malfunction in over 6000 rounds. Sig 239 in 9mm did well for 500 rounds before I sold it for the 357 sig version of the gun.

2. Sig 220 same but with only 3000 rounds through it before I sold it.

3. Sig 226 never malfunctioned in about 2000 rounds before I sold it.

4. Sig 229 never a malfunction in 357 sig only one with the 40 barrel. 2 with the drop in 9mm barrel.

5. Glock 17 had 2 malfunctions with generic ball ammo Worked with all other jhp's and ball I tried in it.

6. GLock 31 One malfunction when I was firing with my left hand. I limp wristed the gun. But it still happened.

7. GLock 33 no problems except for one ftf with a glock 23 mag when firing left handed. No problems with stock mags and Leo 11 round mags.

8. Glock 21 so far so good. Only about 500 rounds through it however.

9. Beretta 92 I have owned 3 of them and none has failed me.
PAT
 
My MAN!!!! Now your fighting the good fight!
:D
It appears that our friend NMGlocker has no problems with breaking the law. On occasion i'm willing to risk the "petty midemeanor"(Misdemeanor) that comes with concealed carry in NM.
Click to expand...
Exactly correct........i've never hidden behind the fact that i'm willing to suffer the consequences of a petty misdemeanor, in order to ensure the safety of myself and my family.
I suppose a speeding ticket, which is in the same class of crime, is enough to discredit all my posts. In the spirit of full disclosure, I had a ticket for failure to stop at a stop sign, 4 years ago. And I was speeding on the highway last night. Fire up "Ol' Sparky" we got a real bad career criminal here.
Conflicting statements for NMGlocker in the past.
(My wife did the same course with my G19, the only problem she had was the Glocks trigger got some crap in it and caused a horrendous trigger pull, but a little Rem-Oil and a good shake and it was good as new.)
Now he says this (The ONLY pistol i've EVER had mechanically malfunction on me (actually my wife) was a Glock 19 during an OPS tactical pistol class, the trigger grew steadily stiffer until it finally locked down tight, this was on day one of a two day class, in windy dusty conditions)
Which is it was it a simple fix or was it locked down tight lets hear the truth?
Click to expand...
Ummm OK, they conflict how?
My wife is shooting the pistol in both quotes.
Its a Glock 19, in both quotes.
Ohhh I see, the trigger was horrendous vs. locked down tight, guilty as charged, a trigger pull so hard that my wife couldn't pull it, is not locked down.
The simple fix, required that the pistol be field stripped, and the trigger assembly lubricated, a few good shakes, re-lubed, and the Glock was off and running again. So I guess it was both, locked down tight, and a simple fix.
 
There are many people happy with the P99 as well. The person I sold it too has put a new spring in for the slide stop we will see if that fixes the problem. Overall the p99 excluding the slide lock problem is a respectable gun. If this problem is fixed it should do well now that they lowered the price. Compared to a Glock however it has some lacking areas in my oppinion. In 40 sw it has more muzzle flip than a glock 23. It has a terrible first shot DA pull. The light rails don't accept the M3 or simular quality light thats not priced too high. The preban mags for it are expensive as heck in 9mm and the 40 mags are not supposed to exist yet they do. If I buy one again once I am satisified the bugs are gone it would be a 9mm. It seems the 9mm people have less complaints overall.
Click to expand...
That is EXACTLY the kind of constructive criticism, that this thread needs. I agree with you on most of your points, I have no experience with any pistol in .40s&w, so I can't compare them.
I usually carry my P99 in the "click" trigger mode, so the DA is not of any concern to me. In my experience the P99 DA is not as nice as my P228, but better than my P225. Walther had a major screwup when they made the accessory rail a proprietary thing, instead of the standard Glock style rail. Pre-ban mags are tough to find, but I have purchased a few for under $100, Glock 17 mags are still out there for $75 or so. The bugs are GONE from the 9mm's, since Walther standardized the recoil spring, and got rid of the funky hinged trigger, the P99 9mm's have been excellent.
I'll call a flaming truce, if you will. :D
 
I am in awe that sigfan forgot to mention how much more "knock down power" (a term he likes so well) a 9mm Glock or Sig has over a 9mm Walther. He must be slipping
 
I'll call a flaming truce, if you will.

Very well to be honest you’re a bit better at the flame war than I am anyway. Heck I might even buy a P99 in 9mm when money permits to add to the collection.

P99er
am in awe that sigfan forgot to mention how much more "knock down power"

I have never used the term knockdown power, as it does not exist in small arms. Stopping power is the term I used and while handguns are poor stoppers I do believe that if you do your part with marksmanship and good load selection you should be able to stop a determined attacker. It may require a headshot but never give up. For a pistol to have knock down power it would have to knock the shooter down as well because every action has an equal and opposite reaction.

PAT
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top