Forced entry into a residence and intruder shot
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kilimanjaro
New member
Even if, by chance, they're not stoned at the time they broke in and confronted you, they're still a sociopath with mental issues who self-medicates, probably for years, and you are a threat to his lifestyle and freedom. If they put their hands up and docilely wait for the cops, fine and dandy, but it's unlikely.
You will not reason with them. Anything they say or do is an attempt to put you off or at ease and give them an advantage or opportunity to ruin your day and escape.
You will not reason with them. Anything they say or do is an attempt to put you off or at ease and give them an advantage or opportunity to ruin your day and escape.
Ok, I think we are talking two different parts of "defending" ourselves.
If you are talking about awareness of a drug's symptoms and effects, in order to identify a possible threat, while you are out and about, then yes.
I'm talking about someone busting through your door "like the incredible Hulk" at zero dark thirty. At that point, I consider the threat self identified, and I don't care what drug he is on, or not on, or if his mommy abused him, or any other reason why he is busting through my door.
After the attack is ended, then is the time to consider their motive. Assuming, of course, you have the luxury of life to do so.
Andy Blozinski
New member
You're just not likely to get the chance to psycho-analyze a person breaking into your home. Everything happens in moments. You point your gun at them. Maybe even yell. If they don't run for their life or at least freeze in fear, you're probably going to have to pull the trigger.
We had a team of robbers come into our kitchen. Fortunately they ran for their lives from my buddy that was maybe 10 feet away from them with an AK. Problem solved. The armchair macho thing to say might be to shoot them for a variety of reasons, but you don't want your mind and legal life complicated unnecessarily. If they keep coming, you'll have to make that hard choice and just do it, though.
I told my bud that I hope those guys told all their friends there are crazy people with machineguns living here.
We had a team of robbers come into our kitchen. Fortunately they ran for their lives from my buddy that was maybe 10 feet away from them with an AK. Problem solved. The armchair macho thing to say might be to shoot them for a variety of reasons, but you don't want your mind and legal life complicated unnecessarily. If they keep coming, you'll have to make that hard choice and just do it, though.
I told my bud that I hope those guys told all their friends there are crazy people with machineguns living here.
44AMP. I had a friend drunkenly break into someone elses home thinking jt was his. Luckily, he only got beaten up. If he had been shot and killed, sure he wouldve been breaking the law by breaking and entering, but it wouldnt have been on purpose.
So i ask that yes you give a chance to any intruder.. obviously every situation is different and the homeowner may have had more time to assess. But i saw a story a while back about a boy who wasnt on drugs or alcohol broke into the exact same looking home down the home thinking it was his.
He was shot and died. Tragic as he was a little kid. Dont hesitate to defend your life, but please make sure to positively identify the target. It could be your uncle stupidly breaking down the door.
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kilimanjaro
New member
Trouble is, they weren't breaking into their own house, it was someone else's home.
Who says they were just lost or confused in the first place? Who knows what they will do once they are inside? If they're so convinced it's their house, isn't anyone inside at risk once seen? "This is my place, man!"
How do we know they aren't looking for the hot babe who lives there, at 2 AM? Or is it next door? Maybe they need some drugs or think this place has a liquor cabinet. We don't know any of those things.
All we know is our house is being broken into by an apparently violent intruder.
Who says they were just lost or confused in the first place? Who knows what they will do once they are inside? If they're so convinced it's their house, isn't anyone inside at risk once seen? "This is my place, man!"
How do we know they aren't looking for the hot babe who lives there, at 2 AM? Or is it next door? Maybe they need some drugs or think this place has a liquor cabinet. We don't know any of those things.
All we know is our house is being broken into by an apparently violent intruder.
A deputy in Northern Virginia was awoken by the noise of someone breaking in. Retrieved his pistol and went to his teenage daughters room (locus of the noise) and shot the person as they were coming in his daughter's window.
It was his daughter who had sneaked out earlier. Fortunately for all, she survived but tragic enough as is.
It was his daughter who had sneaked out earlier. Fortunately for all, she survived but tragic enough as is.
Don't interpret my remarks as a "touch my door and die" attitude, its not. It's a "don't waste time worrying about why the ax wielder is there, when he is swinging the ax at you" attitude.
No, I don't think so. Since "any" includes "every", and could range from the mistaken drunk to a weapon firing jihadist, I will not agree to that blanket statement.
Breaking down my door in the middle of the night (or in daylight) is NOT a friendly act. It demonstrates the intruders capacity and capability for violence.
Now, because things like the drunk in the "wrong" house do happen, forced entry ALONE is not justification to use deadly force. What the intruder does after breaking through the door is critical in determining the level of threat and response.
That is the "chance" I would give them.
Every situation is different, many different factors need to be considered in each case. If you live miles from your nearest neighbor, the odds of a drunk coming home to the wrong house are much different than if you live in tract/row housing in suburbia or in a city. That might be a consideration.
Your uncle might actually BE an axe murder...that would be another consideration.
This is one of those cases where, clearly, proper threat identification, before shooting, was not done. Making matters worse, is that it was a deputy, someone we assume has been trained in this kind of thing.
If you shoot at a sound, or a vague shape, odds are very high you will be wrong to do so.
Despite what the press tries hard to make us believe, Castle Doctine / stand you ground laws are do not give you the right to shoot someone. Other laws cover that, and have for some time. Castle doctrine, etc, laws are legal protection from spurious prosecution if you are otherwise justified.
No, I don't think so. Since "any" includes "every", and could range from the mistaken drunk to a weapon firing jihadist, I will not agree to that blanket statement.
Breaking down my door in the middle of the night (or in daylight) is NOT a friendly act. It demonstrates the intruders capacity and capability for violence.
Now, because things like the drunk in the "wrong" house do happen, forced entry ALONE is not justification to use deadly force. What the intruder does after breaking through the door is critical in determining the level of threat and response.
That is the "chance" I would give them.
Every situation is different, many different factors need to be considered in each case. If you live miles from your nearest neighbor, the odds of a drunk coming home to the wrong house are much different than if you live in tract/row housing in suburbia or in a city. That might be a consideration.
Your uncle might actually BE an axe murder...that would be another consideration.
This is one of those cases where, clearly, proper threat identification, before shooting, was not done. Making matters worse, is that it was a deputy, someone we assume has been trained in this kind of thing.
If you shoot at a sound, or a vague shape, odds are very high you will be wrong to do so.
Despite what the press tries hard to make us believe, Castle Doctine / stand you ground laws are do not give you the right to shoot someone. Other laws cover that, and have for some time. Castle doctrine, etc, laws are legal protection from spurious prosecution if you are otherwise justified.
Andy Blozinski
New member
Moomooboo. It's not a bad neighborhood. Around the time this happened there was some gang activity pick up. Somebody got shot a half or maybe a quarter mile away a few years ago. I could hear the shots. Fortunately the gang stuff got tamped down. So far the only thing of note to happen lately was some suspicious characters seemed to be staking out 100 yards from our house. A nearby neighbor asked them what they were doing. Guns started coming out and the neighbor was faster and had his son backing him up, who was also fast on the draw. Nobody got shot and the cops were called in to take care of the rest. All's well that ends well.
Actually if the rate of bad neighborhoods is 8 and the rate of good neighborhoods is one, it is not flawed thinking. You have less of a chance of getting broken into. Its like saying youre at just aa much risk getting broken into in the ghetto vs a neighboring neighborhood. That is simply not true and truely flawed.
You havent been [very] drunk have you? Twice i tried to get into an apartment full of girls thinking it was mine. Luckily they didnt shoot me, i was only repeatedly trying to open the door and not get in through a window.
Kicking down the door late at night is most likely an intruder, getting in through a side window is a better chance its someone nicer but not always.
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Aguila Blanca
Staff
What you are saying is, "Don't hesitate, but hesitate." That's a recipe to get yourself and your family beaten or killed.Moomooboo said:
Sorry, but anyone breaking through my door is presumed hostile. There have been too many home invasions in this corner of the world that didn't turn out well for the homeowners to hesitate. "Identify the target" doesn't mean asking the nice home invader if he's a drunk or a robber, it means ensuring it's not your wife or kid before pulling the trigger.
Im telling you to think. By not thinking, youre creating a recipe for a lifetime of regret if you kill an innocent person.
You shouldnt just blindly kill anyone coming through your window. If situation allows, try to identify them. If you think theyre an imminent threat, then deal with it. Tell me and name the cases where the homeowner was prepared but hesitated and turned out bad for them?
Alot more money for guns then! And i was trying to just say really drunk. You dont need to be on drugs or a combination to be knocking on the wrong door.
In my neck of the woods, there has been a large uptick in break ins in the "better" neighborhoods (the Beach Cities). They recently released a lot of cons from the pen to reduce overcrowding (thanks Judge). One captured crook was asked why by a reporter. His answer "that's where the money is".
Mr. Career Con went on to say in the bad hoods, people have mean dogs, bars on their windows, and know who doesn't belong. In the good hoods, people tend to leave windows open, have little yappy dogs if any, and are oblivious to the help.
Now as far as someone being drunk...there is no mistaking my house for any other one for 10 blocks in any direction. To get to windows, you already jumped a fence. Even soused, this should be a clue you are in the wrong place. Break glass and you had better sober up real quick because I will not be in the mood to argue.
Drunk, drugged, crazy, felon...I DON'T GIVE A (CENSORED). Break in at O'Dark30 you might get 1 chance to comply depending on the tactical situation at that particular moment. Failure will result in me having ringing in my ears for a few days. If the intruder does not survive refer to CPC 198.5 that I cited earlier. Compliance means you will be prepackaged wearing S&W cuffs, face down on the floor when the Deputies come to pick you up. That is for a single intruder. Multiple intruders means all bets are off......you definitely are not here to collect for the Salvation Army.
Mr. Career Con went on to say in the bad hoods, people have mean dogs, bars on their windows, and know who doesn't belong. In the good hoods, people tend to leave windows open, have little yappy dogs if any, and are oblivious to the help.
Now as far as someone being drunk...there is no mistaking my house for any other one for 10 blocks in any direction. To get to windows, you already jumped a fence. Even soused, this should be a clue you are in the wrong place. Break glass and you had better sober up real quick because I will not be in the mood to argue.
Drunk, drugged, crazy, felon...I DON'T GIVE A (CENSORED). Break in at O'Dark30 you might get 1 chance to comply depending on the tactical situation at that particular moment. Failure will result in me having ringing in my ears for a few days. If the intruder does not survive refer to CPC 198.5 that I cited earlier. Compliance means you will be prepackaged wearing S&W cuffs, face down on the floor when the Deputies come to pick you up. That is for a single intruder. Multiple intruders means all bets are off......you definitely are not here to collect for the Salvation Army.
Aguila Blanca
Staff
A person who is breaking into my house is, by definition, not an innocent person.Moomooboo said:
You can live your life by your rules. Your rules do not apply to anyone other than you. I don't tell you how to think; don't tell me how to think.