First Timer Needs Help! M4 Enough for Hog?

Rich don't freak out on me :D I past up many of shots because I did not think I could make a clean kill. But I still wonder if a clean kill matters. In resepect to how animals kill each other. Some may think it's ugly! But in truth that is the way it is. Some times I wonder who are we to judge what is wright or wrong.

After all we are the only species that is human and can do no other than judge.
 
I have never shot hunted before as I have stated.....

The little tribe I tend to see here is not even big enough for the BBQ grill ......Maybe a George Forman Grill master... :confused: :D . Seriously the largest hog I saw was shot by a friend a few years back and it was no more than 150 lbs. I have decided to limit myself to under 110yds or so and am going to try the m4gery. I also have a WASR that would work if I could hit anything with it....Maybe after I find a scope mount for it,hmmmm. As for now I see that it can be done. I simply need to watch the way I do it....Close up and good placement.....and a little piggy not a "porker". Friom what I have read I would be better with the Ak but am more confident in my ability to hit what I am at with the .223. How big in m.o.a is the vital zone going to appear at 110 yds? Like I have said before, I have a red dot and a bsa magnifying scope on my ar so 70yds and under=red dot....over 70=4xmagnification on the scope :D I can confidently hit a 3moa target at 100yds with my red dot from a knee. Should that be sufficient?

Thanx for all the great imfo I will let you know when I get one, man I'm excited!
 
TMC....your hunt, your choice.

But if you're convinced that you can place a round correctly enough to take down a "little" 150LB hog with a poodle shooter, you should only need to load one bullet into the chamber. Empty mag in the gun is optional.

Please report back with pics.

Rich
 
TMC, if you are determined to go with a .223, you need bullets which won't fragment in the first few inches of penetration. I killed a deer several years ago which had a crater in it's right ham about half the size of a large cantalope. I had heard the shot which made the wound but the deer didn't appear to be limping or anything when I shot it. (30-06) The hunter contacted me as I was loading the deer in my truck and told me he had took a shot at it but had missed, he guessed. He was using a .223. When I processed the meat, there was no wound channel at all, just that crater with little bits of jacket and lead pieces scattered around in it. Granted, I have no idea if the bullet struck anything before it hit the deer and I'm not commenting about the wisdom of shooting at the south end of a northbound very large (best I've taken) buck with a .223. If he had lucked that shot into the back of the neck or head, he'd be looking at the horns now instead of me. If his bullet would have held together for deeper penetration it might have been different also.


I've not kept up on factory offerings for bullets in .223 but some time back, all factory bullets were too lightly constructed for hunting anything much more robust than a coyote. That may have changed by now but if not, get some Trophy Bonded bullets or some other maker's offering which will hold together and handload.
 
steve499 I have sean those same flesh wounds on deer as well. I thought thay may have come from some sort of infection? I thought maybe gun shot wound! but I got to thinking how many deer I killed with my 222 with remington green and yellow box ammo. I never shot a deer with a varmint bullet because a deer is not a varmint :D But yah any kinda core lock type bullet and a good neck shot will bring down a pig fast.

Most pigs in the wild go at the 100 to 150lb mark (in texas anyway) and only saw one that may have been close to 200lbs any pig up to 100lbs is a good shooter. Over 125lbs they are not as good to eat as the smaller pigs. piglets on the pit are the best ;)
 
i knew it!!!! Little pigs do make good sausage!!!:)!!!

:) Rich Thanx for the concern.....But when I said a "little piggy" not a "porker" I meant limit is pig about the size of the one my firend shot with the 30-06 ballistic tip.....It was only about 50-60 lbs....If I see a 150 lbs hog I wihile in the brush then, you will quickly see my Carl Lewis impersonation as I am not stupid and know that a wild animal has a large will to fight/survive :eek: !I will not be far from home probably less than 200yds and I will have many places to take advantage of if cornered or treed by a big bore.....I agree a Rich, .223 and a 150lbs hog is a no no except for the suicidal ;) ....If I see one that big I will go get my freind and his ballistic tips in the 30-06.....150lbs should catch the bullet better than that littler piggy(60lbs)did.....It had a quater sized hole through the ham(back right ham exit and entry wound was through the ribs below the spine with entrails out the exit :eek: ! I think a will try to find a .223 ballistic tip, aim for neck/head shots and see what it do...lol

Is there a mag limit if hunting hogs in Texas....I would like a second opinion....Don't wanna run foul of the law! I keep hearing a five round mag limit? I would fell better with a 30 rounder full of Ballistic tips just in case !
Rich come on, if I want a real challeng I will try the knife or spear tmethod. :cool:
 
TMC-
Wasn't really you I was worried about. It's the hog. Unlike Cape Buff, they tend not to "hunt back". They are a danger if you happen to be at the point of the compass they intend to travel.....but that's about it.

Again, as I stated earlier, there are definitely situations in which the .223 will do the job....if you're hunting from a blind over a feeder at known distance, for instance.
I'd have no problem with that.

My point was borne of the fact that I try to introduce lots of first time hunters, including kids, to the sport. In those situations, it's real important (at least to me) to communicate our responsibility to respect the animal we're about to kill. That means knowing (as much as is possible) that your shot will bring a quick death.

When you state, "I would feel better with a 30 rounder full of Ballistic tips just in case", it demonstrates to me that you are not at all convinced that the .223 can do the job, which brings us full circle. I personally feel more than safe with as little as 5 rounds of .308 and a good handgun.

Enjoy your hunt. Pics still requested.
Rich
 
There is no magazine capacity restriction for a rifle when hunting in Texas, but Rich Lucibella makes an excellent point. Your comment about feeling better with thirty rounds does sound like you lack confidence in your ability to use the rifle effectively. If that is the case, you will be much happier and shoot better with something more powerful. :)
 
Nope, never hunted pig. However, I find this interesting is that this is the same caliber our government in it's infinite wisdom consideres the end all for a combat round.

Assuming that the average man on the face of the earth is between 150-200 lbs. and we are concerned with "being" able to kill a 150 lb. pig, taken from ambush, I think this says a lot about this caliber for military use...Never liked the caliber when I was in the service, not enamored of it now...suggest for pig, you purchase a nice lever action rifle in 30 caliber...
 
As a full time hog hunter, which is what I have become since moving to Florida, I would not use a .223 on hogs. Yes it will kill them. I have killed 3 hogs with a .22 mag. Then I pulled a shot and hit the hog in the jaw and it ran so far it left out property and was not recovered. All I had was the hogs teeth.

The .223 will work for head shots, but you really need to be close to the pigs. Pigs move around more than anyother animal I have ever hunted and a 100 yard head shot is very hard to come by. Espcially if there are 15 pigs in the herd.

Please understand the anatomy of the pig. It is VERY different than that of other 4 legged animals.

Go to http://www.texasboars.com and read the forums for anatomy pics and lots of good advice.
 
I was half joking about the 30 rounder full of ballistic tips....

At under a 100 yds I feel more than confident in my little m4.....I just don't know what to expect since this is my first time....That is what brought out the comment......If one .223 can be good enough then 30 should be just right :) !
I saw the little tribe again and was going to have my friend drive me up to theim in the back of the truck, but the punk left before i could get my guns togerther :( ....I see the pigs go to get the m4 and my glock just in case and when I come back outside, this $%^&^%^%$ is down there doing doughnuts around the pigs :( .....Scares them all to hell and I get NO SHOTS OFF.....He got to with in atleast 60 yds or closer before they bailed on him! I was sooooooo pissed!! I could have even used the ak clone at that distance :eek: ......Needless to say I am not very happy with my friend right now :mad:
I am not giving up though. The fact that I saw them has revitalized me....PICS hopefully will be coming this month if at all possible ......

PS Nobody better laugh at my little piggy either :) ...I am going to go with the 55 grain winchester fmj load.....If I can keep it under 120 yds I should gey fairly good frag/tumble or atleast enough for a hogs head neck shot at distance(my gun likes winchester fmj 55gr the most.....I saw another hog and at 100 yds the head was about 8"-10" long easy moa at 100yds for the ar my conficence is building.....
 
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I was talking to a friend of mine today. His wife works for a city close to me. She was given a new job. killing pigs in the city limits. The only gun the city would let her use is a 22lr. So far every pig she shot she dropped dead it it's tracks. all head and neck shots.

Don't tell her a 223 is to small for pigs. I might add she is from louisiana and hunted all her life.
 
Claude 783

No offense intended, but I don't find the anatomical similarities between hogs and people to be that close outside of both being mammals and possessing the same vital organs, which are in different locations and covered with varying amounts/types of tissue :confused: ?
 
My Experience

I usually hunt them in thick brush and swamps where they are usually encountered at close range and they may be moving. I want a bullet that blows a large hole through them and leaves a nice blood trail if they run. I have killed hogs with 8mmx57JS (using Euro spec loads of about 2650 fps and a 180g bullet), 7.62x54R, .30-06, and .444 Marlin. I have also seen them killed with a .45-70 Government. All clobbered the hogs. I have also killed a wounded hog with one shot of a .357 Magnum using 158g XTP, but that is hardly the same thing as shooting one that is not already hurt.

As others have said - sure it WILL kill one with proper shot placement but there are so many better choices out there. If money is a concern pick up a cheap Yugo M48 Mauser or Mosin Nagant at the next gun show for under $100.
 
I have an ak clone......

I already know that 7.62x39 is hog friendly, as many say it's balistics are comparable to 30/30.....So if I can find a good scope mount for the side mount rail, then that is what I will use(with my red dot) since the motto of this thread appears to be "Bigger is Better!" However, if in the immediate future I come across one of those, "M4/.223 size hogs", believe me I will take the shot and post pics :cool: I still say the little piggies around here(50-60lbs) wouldn't take much to put down "clean"......
 
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