Fell in love with an AR today, need some help

M

monk d

New member
I have not posted in many moons but I love coming here and reading the cool stuff. I have owned a couple of ARs in the past but sold one and gave one to my son a few years ago thinking I was done with them until today...

I saw an AR config today that I loved from the first second I saw it ans I really need help. It is an ATI Alpha Maxx 223/556, 16in barrel. it is listed on Grab a Gun for $399. The price was not critical but the looks were perfect for me. All the other stuff is fairly boring but I really liked the shorter hand guard, the pencil barrel and the over all symmetry.

My issue is it is mostly polymer, even the internals and the few of reviews I read were mixed, but the negatives were pretty compelling in that certain parts just didn't seem like they should be plastic and indicated early failures. It is light weight, like 5.5lbs and has features I like, but weight is not super critical either, ARs generally are on the light side especially against my 10lb+ M1A.

So my question is this: Do you all know of anyone who makes an AR with the same LOOK but better quality parts? Could I replace certain parts easily and be good to go? There is still the polymer lower to deal with but is that a critical failure point? I want to be able to not spend more than 5-600 for that look if possible. Any help you could provide would be appreciated.

I want to be able to shoot as much as I want, not be limited to 100 rounds per year. Accuracy in the 2MOA range with 55gr or 62gr stuff.

I will try and post a picture, apologies if it does not workimage-full-13554-f4915c85fb752e46a8d3d0939eca643e.jpg
 
I would like to add that I don't care for the F marked front sight base gas system on the PSA M4 B5 systems rifle, but other than that it is pretty cool too
 
I would literally buy any offering from PSA before buying a piece of junk like this. I do agree with the looks of the rifle, I like it as well, just don’t think the construction will stand up. Just my $.002. I have three from PSA and had a minor issue with the chamber scratching the brass on my 6.5CM. PSA sent me a shipping label, fixed it, and had it back to me in under two weeks at no cost. I was a little dissapointed that all they did was polish the chamber instead of replacing the barrel, but it fixed he problem and I have a nice rifle that hold MOA as far as I’ve shot it to 450 yds. The amazing thing about this rifle is that the POI shifts only 1/4” at 100yds without waiting for any cool down in between rounds.
 
Monk D said:
There is still the polymer lower to deal with but is that a critical failure point?
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A lot of people hate polymer lowers. I'm not one of them. The lower doesn't normally bear a lot of stress and polymer doesn't transmit heat and cold as much as aluminium. I've had a couple on very light weight rifles for about a decade, and I still like them.

However, the rifle in your picture also has a polymer upper. That can't be a good idea. The upper sees a lot of stress and it is what orients your optic and rear sight.

JIG said:
I would literally buy any offering from PSA before buying a piece of junk like this.
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I agree. If I were looking for an assembled upper and lower, PSA would be hard to resist.
 
It is hybrid polymer receivers with metal inserts / skeleton. To me it is kosher. I have been looking for stripped receivers to buy. Currently they are out-of-stock everywhere, except at elevated prices on GunBroker. PSA carries the rifle too. Just out-of-stock. So is it still junk?

The stress on the upper has to go to the butt stock via the lower, right? Most polymer receiver failures happens in the lower, where the recoil force is transferred to the buffer tube.

-TL

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 
I've never bought one of these, so my views are informed only by my experience with some New Frontier lowers I bought a decade ago. Those had no metal inserts.

TL said:
It is hybrid polymer receivers with metal inserts / skeleton.
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I understand those inserts to be in the threaded parts of the receivers. They wouldn't help the propensity to fail by a crack through the safety selector area of the lower - a failure point on aluminum lowers as well.

I've never had a failure of the threads in a polymer lower, but I'm not very rough on rifles and this is clearly something that can happen.

TL said:
The stress on the upper has to go to the butt stock via the lower, right? Most polymer receiver failures happens in the lower, where the recoil force is transferred to the buffer tube.
Click to expand...

The problem I would foresee in a polymer upper isn't that it would split or crack, but that as pressure is applied to a sling it would flex a lot. I've read the guess that a polymer upper is what limits accuracy on a S&W 15-22. I believe that was one of the problems on early Carbon15s too. You would want something rigid that coordinates the barrel and sights.

I have been looking for stripped receivers to buy.
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Polymer or aluminium?

I am constantly taunted by prices on Anderson lowers. Seeing great prices on things I don't need is hard on a cheap fellow.
 
I have been looking for this exact make and model of polymer hybrid receivers, upper and lower. They were really affordable when they were available. <$80 for the set.

Yeah I'm not quite sure about the upper either. I just want to get a set to try. <$100 for a set is ok.

-TL

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 
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There are some complete rifles still around, but when Optics Planet estimates availability at January 2025, I read that as "never".
 
A complete rifle shipped to my state requires some doing. I'm not in hurry, just a silly experiment to try. Perhaps I will get lucky on secondary market.

BCA has good stuff. With some tinkering, it can be as good as products that cost several times more.

-TL

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk
 
Any AR made by ATI is objectively one of the worst AR style rifles made, especially the poly receiver models. No matter what anyone says, a polymer lower modeled after the standard AR lower will not handle the stress as well as aluminum. I've personally seen an ATI Omni lower crack at the rear takedown pin within the first two mags, but then again I've also seen one last 500+ rounds without issue. The lower, contrary to what some say, does take a decent amount of force at the rear takedown pin area due to the buffer slamming into the rear of the buffer tube.

The downsides of the poly receivers added to the cheap construction and typical out of spec parts throughout the rest of the gun makes the ATI a terrible choice.

If you're basing your purchase on looks alone, for whatever reason, here's something similar. It's not a great rifle, but much better than ATI.
https://palmettostatearmory.com/del-ton-echo-316-16-5-56x45mm-ar-15-rifle-black-orfth16-m.html

Or if you feel like slapping this on a PSA lower, you can have an excellent rifle. Just get one of the pin and weld muzzle device options, or plan on getting it done later before assembling it, unless you'd want to SBR it. The free BCG with the upper makes it a great deal.
https://bravocompanyusa.com/bcm-sta...ght-upper-receiver-group-w-mcmr-10-handguard/
 
DubC-Hicks said:
No matter what anyone says, a polymer lower modeled after the standard AR lower will not handle the stress as well as aluminum.
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That's likely true depending on the aluminium and polymers involved in the comparison, but how much stress does it need to handle?

DubC-Hicks said:
The lower, contrary to what some say, does take a decent amount of force at the rear takedown pin area due to the buffer slamming into the rear of the buffer tube.
Click to expand...

That force causes the end to flex upward rather than downward, as the force applied in push tests does, and its more tension than flex. There are issues where the friction weld can be weak, and that seems to manifest around the receiver extension threading. No doubt this inspired the threaded metal insert, but a poor friction weld there also won't contain the ring under a lot of stress.

If a rifle cycles so hard that it causes tension so great that a reasonably made polymer lower snaps at the take down pin, it's cycling too hard. If course where these are made to a very low price, you can reasonably doubt that everything was done correctly in making it.

A polymer lower can absolutely be used and tested so it fails. It's also true that if Karl Kasada decided to use one of my aluminium lowered rifles as a push up bar, I'd be unhappy about that.
 
Thanks so much everybody, exactly what I was hoping for by way of data. I just checked out Bear Creek, Palmetto, and Bravo, and they have some interesting things too. I have been out of the AR game for a while

I guess I had reverse sticker shock a little too, I figured something sub-$400 needed to be checked out thoroughly, and the replies kind of bore that out (no pun intended). For me it is less about price but of of course I want the best I can get for cheaper if possible and the price of ARs in general seem to have dropped significantly. I won't hunt with it (can't in my state) but I do have a home range and I want to shoot a fair amount but not just to throw lead, I want reasonable accuracy too.

I love my M1A but these days it is getting heavy, and even if I go back to the original config., it still comes in at or over 9lbs. It will shoot 1 5/8 to 2 inch groups at 100yds depending on ammo, I just like to see what the gun can do. No current plan to shoot comp either, the look of it got me, so many platforms today are pretty boring looking. I actually like the A-2 traditional fixed stock look with the 20" barrel too, had one of those from Olympic Arms 20 or so years back and sold it or traded it at some point like a dummy. This time I am looking for reliability, lower weight, defensive capability, and something my wife can shoot as well, she shoots with me sometimes, and, well, you just never know these days what you might need. I gave my M&P to my son a few years back, it was decent. I was thinking about another one but again on a mid length I want to not have the fixed F front sight, I could conceivably add glass or some other optic option.

Again, I totally appreciate what you guys brought, I do not see myself getting at ATI, so the search continues...
 
Not trying to be a pain, I almost started a new thread with my next question. In looking for a decent off the shelf rifle I searched this forum and found references to 223 Wylde, which someone posted will work with both 556 and 223. If this is the case that would be a really good option because I like to have options without the thought of getting another upper. If I were to get another upper it would be in an entirely different caliber like 6.8 SPC or 6.5 Grendel, etc., but right now I am on the cusp of pulling the trigger so to speak. Question is, If I were to go with 223/556 Wylde, would my cartridge options be significantly enhanced?
 
223 Rem, 223 match, 5.56x45, 223 Wylde are all the same case shape externally. Where they differ is in the throat.

223 Rem was developed as a fast 22 cal shooting 40-55gr bullets from 22” barrels with a 12 twist. This means that the throat is very short, causing high pressure with heavy loads and longer bullets.

5.56 fixed the pressure side and twist for all military spec ammo, but it had a reputation for worse accuracy.

223 Wylde is a long throat 223 made originally for loading 77gr match ammo for 7-8 twist match. Since all 5.56 ammo is mag length and lighter bullets, this chamber can handle the 5.56 ammo well. It also allows max performance from mag length ammo as well as some slightly longer single feed loads.
 
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