Feinstein uses Navy Yard shooting to call for more gun control.

Here's Carney's statement from yesterday, in which he reiterates Obama's support for "improving our background check system" (presumably by regulating private gun sales, instead of by doing things that are already possible, like prosecuting those who lie on 4473s).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZZUbdznxFs#t=1m05s

I don't know if I can see the relationship between any decorations the shooter had and what he did, or how gun control would affect it. No decorations and an involuntary separation would mean he had problems; decorations and an honorable discharge might mean, as already mentioned, that the Pentagon didn't want to go through the paperwork, or it could mean that he was a good soldier and had PTSD that developed into homicidal mania only after he left the service.
 
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tyme, having been a Navy officer in aviation squadrons, I can assure you the Pentagon had nothing to do with it. Decisions would have been made at the Squadron and Wing levels, if that high.

Most of the documentation required would be handled by a shop leading petty officer (E-6), branch chief if one were assigned (E-7), division chief (E-7 or E-8), a branch officer (O-1 or O-2), division officer (O-3), and department head (O-4). The Admin Officer (O-4) and Command Master Chief (E-9) would have inputs, and a packet would go to the XO and CO (O-5s).

If the member wished to challenge their decision, it would go to the Wing Commodore (O-6). Only rarely would it go higher.

Where this ties in:

1). The system did not work, because it was not fully used (8 disciplinary infractions; two shooting incidents; yet he still kept a clearance);

2). Napolitano started the disgruntled veteran as terrorist threat meme a while back;

3). Painting Alexis as a decorated veteran reinforces the meme, while serving to justify his retention of security clearance - "hey, he was generally a great guy, you would have treated him like we did;"
 
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Multiple sources now claim Alexis only had a shotgun, and the other weapons were taken from Navy Yard security.
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How long until some genius uses this to make the case that security personel should not be armed either?
 
MLeake,

He wasn't punished enough? Would punitive measures like removing his clearance or giving him an other than honorable discharge have helped, or would it have hastened his descent into madness? I don't believe a psychotic ex-soldier would have had difficulty acquiring a firearm for a rampage.

Tim,

I don't know if Feinstein is arguing that, or if instead she wants to heavily regulate or ban Joe Biden's favorite weapon. Her statement is looking more detached from reality by the hour.
 
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tyme,

If the point of the system is to protect the repeat screw-up, then it might not have helped. If the point of the system is to maintain national security, then allowing a repeat screw-up to maintain a security clearance is absurd.

The point is, we have yet another case of multiple decisions by the system to not act on information they had (the guy shot out somebody's tires in a state of angry blackout, and was able to obtain a clearance in the first place?); we have yet another case of a guy who would have run afoul of existing firearms laws, had the system responded to his past actions.

If the system we have is not utilized, what good does adding to the system do?

That is a question Feinstein chooses to ignore.

All of her ilk ignore that yet again, we have a mass shooting in a gun free, "secure" area.
 
If the system we have is not utilized, what good does adding to the system do?
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Yes, our political leaders are quick to make laws, but for some reason slow to actually enforce them. I realize it isn’t always the exact same person making the enforcement decisions, but as Mike said it is a systemic failure. A better idea would be far fewer gun laws with better enforcement.
 
Multiple sources now claim Alexis only had a shotgun, and the other weapons were taken from Navy Yard security.
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In 2005, a man named Brian Nichols was on trial in Atlanta. While being led to the courtroom, he overpowered a guard, took her gun, and went on a shooting rampage. There were calls for gun control over that.

Alexis had two prior incidents in which he fired guns in anger. In one, he shot through the roof of his apartment after complaining that his upstairs neighbor was too loud. No charges were filed.

In the second, he claims to have "blacked out" with rage at his neighbor's method of parking, and he shot the tires out of the neighbor's car (incident report at the link). No charges were filed in that case.

In neither case was a review of Alexis' mental health called for. This wasn't the fault of the NRA or the "gun culture." It was the fault of a criminal justice system that refuses to do its job.

If Feinstein wants to talk about that, I'm willing to listen. If she wants to talk about the fact that the men convicted of straw-purchasing dozens of weapons in the Fast & Furious operation were sentenced to an average of four years for their parts in Brian Terry's murder, I'll listen.

She might have had the political support to get more restrictions passed in March. She doesn't have it now.
 
Yep, Feinstein is at it again.


Alexis had eight (8) article 15s in one four year enlistment. He should have been canned with a bad conduct discharge. At the very least his clearance should have been pulled. i revoked the security clearances of several dopers, drunks and discipline cases.

IMO: It's time to look at the officers in Alexis' chain of command.
 
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...ard-shooting-aaron-alexis-washington/2824793/

Note the "law-enforcement style shotgun" reference. I threw up a little. Is Feinstein going to go after semi-auto "assault shotguns" now?

As in many of these mass shootings, the shooter came to the attention of mental health professionals and they apparently didn't help him. A federal official is cited as stating that Alexis sought help for mental problems about a month ago.

But no, let's not talk about the failure of the mental health establishment.
 
Feinstein is now claiming that universal background checks would have prevented this.

Even though charges were dropped in the civilian incidents, and even though Alexis was allowed to leave active duty with an honorable discharge and an intact secret clearance; even though the only way background checks MIGHT have worked would have been if the VA had authority and time to report mental issues to NICS...

The woman lies. The press - with few exceptions - does not call her out.

Jay Carney and Chuck Schumer are already singing chorus line for the diva, though.

(Edit: As Feinstein made her claims to the press, she lamented that she was sure opponents of her initiative would try to buttonhole her at the hair salon. You can't make this stuff up...)

In case you think I am making it up: http://o.dailycaller.com/thedailycaller/#!/entry/feinstein-background-check-law-could-have-prevented-navy-yard-shooting,52389654da27f5d9d0217be3/2[
 
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Jay Carney and Chuck Schumer are already singing chorus line for the diva, though.
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That sparked a visual image in my head which I did not need. Thanks for that :eek:

The question is, can they get anything done. Sandy Hook was the brass ring, and they had the wind at their backs. They couldn't get anything done then. The chances of it happening in the wake of last week's Colorado recalls are pretty much nil.

Bloomberg's money isn't the shield he promised to politicians. It doesn't make Feinstein and Schumer's statements any less odious, but it doesn't worry me too much either.
 
What it comes down to is essentially this - the grabbers want to disarm law-abiding folks because we are unable to disarm criminals and violently mentally disturbed folks.
 
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There's a dailymail (UK) article on the shotgun (allegedly a Remington 870) and the gun shop:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...otgun-held-shells-purchased-419-Virginia.html

He went through a background check, since he purchased from a FFL. Sorry, Senator, try again?

That article quotes officials as stating that Alexis sought treatment from the VA for paranoia, insomnia, and possibly schizophrenia.

It also quotes Dan Gross of the Brady Campaign stating that even though it's too early to know what policies might have prevented this tragedy, congress should pass comprehensive gun control measures. Mr. Gross also takes a dig at the NRA.

More gun control discussion at Politico:
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/navy-yard-shooting-gun-control-96900.html?hp=f2
 
Tom Servo, the government types worry me less than their media allies do. Reporters and editorial boards rarely get "recalled."
 
Let's see, he was a veteran which places him at the top of the Watch List.
Regarding his disciplinary record, I recall something Jeff Cooper said of his Marine Corps days:
"We didn't have Article 15s or courts-martial, we had NCOs."
Sounds like a serious leadership failure.
 
maestro pistolero said:
As per usual, not a word about the ongoing slaughter in our inner cities. Every four days the same number of deaths from the Newtown tragedy occurs in our inner cities in gang and drug related violence. . . .
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Mostly true. I did, however, find one interesting article on CNN.com that strays from this norm.

Gun control is not the answer By LZ Granderson

From the article:
. . . . Gun shops are illegal in Chicago.

The city has bans on both assault weapons and high-capacity magazines. And yet each week people continue to die in the streets from gunshot wounds.

This conundrum is just one example why making note that more Americans have died from gun violence here at home since Newtown than in the nine years fighting a war in Iraq is the kind of factoid that grabs our attention but undermines the true goal: curtailing the violence. . . . .
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"Double Barrel" Biden said himself that a double barrel shotgun was much more controllable than an AR-15. Can someone hold him liable? I actually made it through 20 minutes of piers Morgan, I never heard the gun switch a roo though though.
 
Alexis had two prior incidents in which he fired guns in anger. In one, he shot through the roof of his apartment after complaining that his upstairs neighbor was too loud. No charges were filed.
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She, his upstairs neighbor, said it was because her music was too loud. He said it was an AD while cleaning his gun. The police and prosecutor believed him. That's why no charges were filed.
 
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