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Eyes open or closed??
- Thread starter 3rdDragoon
- Start date
This. If I'm actively aiming/shooting at something, I'm going to target/front sight fixate anyway. At that point I don't have peripheral vision anyway.I suspect that, whether we keep both eyes open or one eye closed, most of us wind up "seeing" only out of the eye that we're using to aim with. The brain shuts out everything else as irrelevant background noise.
I generally shoot pistols with both eyes open. I ensure my aiming eye is dominant by closing my non aiming eye a small amount and by putting my aiming eye into a better position. This ensures that my eyes don't fight for dominance. I often find that my dominant eye changes a lot, especially as the prescription for my glasses ages.
I can't use scopes with both eyes open. Not if there is any significant amount of magnification involved at least and I don't have a scope under 4x. Not sure about aperture sights, I haven't been paying attention. With longarms I find the gun itself restricts so much of my vision that it probably doesn't matter whether my left eye is open or closed anyway. Shotgunning is both eyes open, then mount and shoot once I have a target.
I tried the both eyes open method last week and was amazed at my accuracy. It was much better. With my PM9 my pattern was the size of a dollar bill folded in half. With the CW45 I frequently came close to simply enlarging the hole made by the first shot. This was at about 23 ft. It was a BIG difference. I can tell that it's gonna take a little time to get my dominant RT eye to get used to it because when I'd take a look at the target and then refocus on the front site it would take a second for my eye to be able to see the front site clearly.
I'm right eye dominant and wear trifocals for far-sightedness. When I aim I squint my left eye. This brings everything into focus for me and I shoot much better. And all this hurrah about shooting with both eyes open -- has anyone ever tried it with both eyes closed? Let's hear it from the concrete thinkers out there.
I shot my friend's new Ruger 10/22 yesterday, and with the scope, or with the open sights he originally had on it, shooting with both eyes open drove me nuts. It was very uncomfortable, and I finally went back to left eye only. I seemed to shoot about as well as he did, and he was using both eyes. I was doing some repairs on a scanner later on yesterday, and I closed my right eye up most of the time also. I had a lot of trouble focusing with both eyes open.
FreakGasolineFight
New member
Right eye open, other eye mostly closed.
I have a friend that has to shoot both eyes open because the vision in his strong eye is blurry (he had nasal surgery and they messed something up.) Apparently if he does this he's ok. I'm not sure why you'd do it otherwise.
I have a friend that has to shoot both eyes open because the vision in his strong eye is blurry (he had nasal surgery and they messed something up.) Apparently if he does this he's ok. I'm not sure why you'd do it otherwise.
RG Stewart
New member
Both eyes open
I'm a surveyor, and have proven to myself that both eyes need to be open when sighting. The muscles required to close the off-eye apparently put lateral pressure on the sighting eye, and must (?) change it's shape enough to bend your vision. Repetitive measurements have proven this out to me, in practice and experimentation. Consequently, I trained myself to leave both eyes open, but to ignore what I'm not focusing on.
I'm not sure how much effect this has on handgun iron sights, but it carries over in practice with all of my shooting. Now, if I could just get the same levels of precision...
BTW- Swiss optics rule
I'm a surveyor, and have proven to myself that both eyes need to be open when sighting. The muscles required to close the off-eye apparently put lateral pressure on the sighting eye, and must (?) change it's shape enough to bend your vision. Repetitive measurements have proven this out to me, in practice and experimentation. Consequently, I trained myself to leave both eyes open, but to ignore what I'm not focusing on.
I'm not sure how much effect this has on handgun iron sights, but it carries over in practice with all of my shooting. Now, if I could just get the same levels of precision...
BTW- Swiss optics rule
Its an advantage for peripheral vision and depth perception if you can shoot with both eyes open.
I shoot handguns and shotguns with both eyes open all the time.
My vision isn't very good / but I'm quicker and more consistent with both eyes open. But for me - handguns - are for tactical practice not bulls eye shooting. So I practice tactical shooting / at closer ranges - double taps, reload stages, etc most of the time on silhouette targets or IPSC targets.
On Shotguns / I'm a clay target ( skeet, sporting and trap ) and an upland bird hunter ... so it makes sense to shoot with both eyes open.
I shoot handguns and shotguns with both eyes open all the time.
My vision isn't very good / but I'm quicker and more consistent with both eyes open. But for me - handguns - are for tactical practice not bulls eye shooting. So I practice tactical shooting / at closer ranges - double taps, reload stages, etc most of the time on silhouette targets or IPSC targets.
On Shotguns / I'm a clay target ( skeet, sporting and trap ) and an upland bird hunter ... so it makes sense to shoot with both eyes open.
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L_Killkenny
New member
For many it's difficult to shoot "accurately" using irons sights with both eyes open. But we have to define accurately. For me accuracy means precision and precision has nothing to do with SD/HD shooting. Let's face it, COM at 7-10 yards? A half blind monkey could do that with both eyes open and practice.
Now if you're talking a 2" target at 25 yards it's a whole different ball game. That, for many, is where keeping both eye's open becomes problematic. IME, not many shooters can do that with an iron sighted handgun with both eyes open due to vision issues. If I had to guess I'd say that most of the shooters that say they always shoot a handgun with both eyes open never shoot at a target smaller than a paper plate at close to moderate distances. Some do, but not most. For most it's not possible.
One thing to remember is that HD/SD shooting is not the only use OR the most popular use for handguns. Target shooting, plinkin and hunting are far more popular and everyday uses for handguns. SD/HD types tend to forget this. You want to know the last time I was at a range and saw someone shooting a human silhouette target? Never. So just becasue a SD instructor teachs both eyes open doesn't mean it applies to all shooters. As a matter of fact it doesn't apply to most shooters.
LK
Now if you're talking a 2" target at 25 yards it's a whole different ball game. That, for many, is where keeping both eye's open becomes problematic. IME, not many shooters can do that with an iron sighted handgun with both eyes open due to vision issues. If I had to guess I'd say that most of the shooters that say they always shoot a handgun with both eyes open never shoot at a target smaller than a paper plate at close to moderate distances. Some do, but not most. For most it's not possible.
One thing to remember is that HD/SD shooting is not the only use OR the most popular use for handguns. Target shooting, plinkin and hunting are far more popular and everyday uses for handguns. SD/HD types tend to forget this. You want to know the last time I was at a range and saw someone shooting a human silhouette target? Never. So just becasue a SD instructor teachs both eyes open doesn't mean it applies to all shooters. As a matter of fact it doesn't apply to most shooters.
LK
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I've been shooting with both eyes open but I found out during my last range outing that using the dominant eye only shooting a 2" stubbie yields better results. I'm bifocal but replace progressive lenses for single vision when shooting. I must say that COSteve's trick with the lens mounted peep aperture sounds interesting.
Both
Absolutely. Quite a few studies have been done related to this and to target shooting. It is as noted above.
In addition, there is a sympathetic connection between the two eyes and if one is closed, the vision in the other is negatively affected.
See chapters 8 and 16 in A.A. Yur'yev's classic "Competitive Shooting", pages 119-122 in Ragnar Skanakar"s "Pistol Shooting", Chapter 1 "Vision in Shooting Sports" in Pullum and Hanenkrat's "New Position Rifle Shooting" - just to name a few.
Pete
The muscles required to close the off-eye apparently put lateral pressure on the sighting eye, and must (?) change it's shape enough to bend your vision. Repetitive measurements have proven this out to me, in practice and experimentation.
Absolutely. Quite a few studies have been done related to this and to target shooting. It is as noted above.
In addition, there is a sympathetic connection between the two eyes and if one is closed, the vision in the other is negatively affected.
See chapters 8 and 16 in A.A. Yur'yev's classic "Competitive Shooting", pages 119-122 in Ragnar Skanakar"s "Pistol Shooting", Chapter 1 "Vision in Shooting Sports" in Pullum and Hanenkrat's "New Position Rifle Shooting" - just to name a few.
Pete
If you have learned to shoot by closing one eye it will be harder to break bad habits than for someone who has learned from the start to use both eyes.
It will be hard at first, and you probably will not shoot as well at first, but I would encourage those who close one eye to put the effort into training your eyes how to shoot with both open. This is one of those times where lots of dry fire practice will pay off. Once you master it you will wonder why anyone would choose to do otherwise.
It will be hard at first, and you probably will not shoot as well at first, but I would encourage those who close one eye to put the effort into training your eyes how to shoot with both open. This is one of those times where lots of dry fire practice will pay off. Once you master it you will wonder why anyone would choose to do otherwise.
Keeping both eyes open with a pistol simply gives me two sight pictures and as soon as I try to pay attention to one or the other, it's hard to tell which front sight is the 'correct' one on a pistol. On my M1 rifle, the rear peep sight makes both eyes open inferior to one eye closed in my opinion, as with both eyes open, the rear sight is much too indistinct. With one eye closed, the ring is more well defined allowing me to center the front sight
Is it possible to be neither eye dominant?
I have the same issue and the same question. I haven't yet mastered keeping both eyes open. I see two front sights and two rear sites, all equally bright/distinct, and can't tell which front sight to align with which rear sight.
Maybe I just haven't tried hard enough?
DD
inSight-NEO
New member
I mainly stick to the habit of shooting [handguns] with both eyes open, even though I am unfortunate enough to have a cross dominance issue. Reason being, by closing one eye, you lose half of your peripheral vision, as well as your depth perception...this could prove disastrous when it counts the most, IMHO. To me, making things a bit "easier" on myself [by closing one eye] is not worth the potential cost. Of course, generally speaking, when I shoot I have personal protection in mind. Others may not be in the same boat.
Now, in terms of shotguns, due to having a cross dominance issue, I tend to squint my non-dominant eye, roughly 40-50%, just prior to shooting as, given the long gun platform, keeping both eyes open is just too damn unrealistic in my case (unless I bother trying to shoot left handed). This seems to work for me as it forces my non dominant eye in to dominance..all while maintaining a decent periphery. But, again, I really only use this for doing the shotgun thing. For handguns, again, its both eyes open..all the time.
I would mention rifles, but I have yet to glean much experience with these as of yet. For me, in this case, I guess it would depend on whether or not we are talking about using iron sights or a scope. But, I would imagine going with the "half squint" when using iron sights and keeping both eyes open when using a scope.
In terms of handguns, have you tried simply turning your head towards your strong side
Now, in terms of shotguns, due to having a cross dominance issue, I tend to squint my non-dominant eye, roughly 40-50%, just prior to shooting as, given the long gun platform, keeping both eyes open is just too damn unrealistic in my case (unless I bother trying to shoot left handed). This seems to work for me as it forces my non dominant eye in to dominance..all while maintaining a decent periphery. But, again, I really only use this for doing the shotgun thing. For handguns, again, its both eyes open..all the time.
I would mention rifles, but I have yet to glean much experience with these as of yet. For me, in this case, I guess it would depend on whether or not we are talking about using iron sights or a scope. But, I would imagine going with the "half squint" when using iron sights and keeping both eyes open when using a scope.
In any event, I, like several other posters, am cross-dominant (right handed with a dominant left eye). I find it impossible to shoot with both eyes open, I close my right eye and aim with my left. Works well for me.
In terms of handguns, have you tried simply turning your head towards your strong side
shoulder, thus aligning your dominant left eye with the sights? I use this technique and yes, it took a while to get used to. Now, it is more or less habit.
Some claim this technique works best with an Isosceles stance, but I generally prefer using the "modified" Weaver in most cases. Either way, it seems to work quite well. Of course, you could combine this with a slight tilt of the gun...as long as it is not too extreme.
While I have tried mixing the two, I still generally prefer simply turning my head for proper sight alignment and leaving it at that. The only downside is that your peripheral vision "shifts" to the center/right, given the location of your head at this point. But, you are still able to extend your periphery by quickly looking to the left, if necessary, thus keeping you from having to open/close one eye all of the time.
In any case, there is just something about losing half of my peripheral vision [if closing one eye] that unnerves me.
Some claim this technique works best with an Isosceles stance, but I generally prefer using the "modified" Weaver in most cases. Either way, it seems to work quite well. Of course, you could combine this with a slight tilt of the gun...as long as it is not too extreme.
While I have tried mixing the two, I still generally prefer simply turning my head for proper sight alignment and leaving it at that. The only downside is that your peripheral vision "shifts" to the center/right, given the location of your head at this point. But, you are still able to extend your periphery by quickly looking to the left, if necessary, thus keeping you from having to open/close one eye all of the time.
In any case, there is just something about losing half of my peripheral vision [if closing one eye] that unnerves me.
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I learned to shoot longuns with both hands and don't have a very dominate eye so I close one and I use my right eye shooting right handed and my left eye shooting left handed (handguns also)Quote:
Keeping both eyes open with a pistol simply gives me two sight pictures and as soon as I try to pay attention to one or the other, it's hard to tell which front sight is the 'correct' one on a pistol. On my M1 rifle, the rear peep sight makes both eyes open inferior to one eye closed in my opinion, as with both eyes open, the rear sight is much too indistinct. With one eye closed, the ring is more well defined allowing me to center the front sight
Is it possible to be neither eye dominant?
I have the same issue and the same question. I haven't yet mastered keeping both eyes open. I see two front sights and two rear sites, all equally bright/distinct, and can't tell which front sight to align with which rear sight.
Maybe I just haven't tried hard enough?
DD
On my M1 rifle, the rear peep sight makes both eyes open inferior to one eye closed in my opinion, as with both eyes open, the rear sight is much too indistinct. With one eye closed, the ring is more well defined allowing me to center the front sight
Understandable that you do that. Still, both eyes open will work better. What shooters do when using a rifle like the M1/M14/AR15 is wear an occluder - something which blocks the line of sight and yet allows the shooter to keep both eyes open. Usually the occluding panel is a translucent white which allows the eye being blocked to react to light in the same way as the aiming eye. This limits the sympathetic reaction of the aiming eye which otherwise would dilate closed a bit and compromise the sight picture.
The occluder can be very simple; a friend of mine uses a piece of white paper taped to his shooting glasses. Others use translucent tape over the part of the lens on their shooting glasses that their "off eye" looks through while the aiming eye does its work.
Pete