Escalating a situation too fast?

I saw a segment on TV where an out of State cop was being hassled in Florida. The out of State LEO demanded that the Trooper's supervisor come to the scene. When the supv came to the scene he corrected the problem on the spot.

After that I decided that if I did not like the way I was being treated that I would try that. It makes better sense than getting into a spitting match with the one guy guaranteed not to see your point of view. Might make things worse, but it might settle things real fast too. As long as I feel that I am being hassled without merit then I am not going to be the quiet one that takes the ticket and says thank you officer. I am going to be the noisy one that asks why am I being hassled for no reason.
 
As long as I feel that I am being hassled without merit then I am not going to be the quiet one that takes the ticket and says thank you officer. I am going to be the noisy one that asks why am I being hassled for no reason.
No problem with that, Butch, but there's a time and a place to argue your point, and the side of the road during a traffic stop isn't it. The worth of the ticket should be argued in court, and if you feel the officer's conduct or actions are improper, take it to Internal Affairs, or if it's a small dept., the mayor or village administrator. As was stated below, the cruiser's video system will tell it all.
 
John,

Thanks, I let emotion take over last night. I've edited my previous post. Thanks again for calling me out on my doing wrong.

Wayne
 
Shall we start over?

Post edited.

I forgot what the question was. :)

I'm not a cop. I didn't write that piece I quoted, it was forwarded to me.

It was forwarded to a dear friend of mine, from an officer on duty here in Washington.

It may not be right, but I believe it's honest.

My point in posting it wasn't to condemn poor people to unwarranted traffic stops, I don't have that authority.

My point was that obeying traffic laws and driving a decent vehicle has all but eliminated traffic stops for me, and I used to get stopped all the time.

If we ignore the pointy end of the curve, where you're the wrong guy in the wrong vehicle at the wrong place at the wrong time, and look like the twin separated at birth from the guy who just shot two cops leaving the scene of a multiple rape/murder, obeying the law, all the laws, and looking and acting the part of a law abiding citizen goes a long, long ways towards eliminating the hassles of traffic stops.

Not only that, if you're not breaking laws, the traffic stop is going to be reasonably short, and as soon as they're sure it was your twin, not you, you'll be on your way.

That's what I believe.

I believe it because I've made the transition from constant traffic stops to no traffic stops.

I don't think it was the law or the cops that changed. :cool:
 
No problem with that, Butch, but there's a time and a place to argue your point, and the side of the road during a traffic stop isn't it.

So far so good. The few times that I have been pulled over have been relatively painless, except for the $'s for the ticekt. Truth is I don't expect to get hassled for no reason, and Capt, I am not 100% sure that every cop car in my area has a dashcam. I suppose the State Troopers do, but those guys are polite to a fault anyway, the local PDs may not have the daschams, and often park well behind the person they pull over so it wouldn't pick up sound.
 
Originally posted by: butch50
I saw a segment on TV where an out of State cop was being hassled in Florida. The out of State LEO demanded that the Trooper's supervisor come to the scene. When the supv came to the scene he corrected the problem on the spot.

After that I decided that if I did not like the way I was being treated that I would try that. It makes better sense than getting into a spitting match with the one guy guaranteed not to see your point of view. Might make things worse, but it might settle things real fast too. As long as I feel that I am being hassled without merit then I am not going to be the quiet one that takes the ticket and says thank you officer. I am going to be the noisy one that asks why am I being hassled for no reason.
Um, he went to jail, and was convicted in court (although acquitted of the most serious charge)

Originally posted by: butch50
the local PDs may not have the daschams, and often park well behind the person they pull over so it wouldn't pick up sound.
Um, I know you have no experience with Police work, training, or tactics, but what you described is standard operating procedure (Officer safety, leaving distance gives you more time to react, because as you should know by now, action beats reaction, so you need more of a buffer).
 
1. Pick a good place to stop and pull as far off the road as you can safely.
I got pulled over in Concord and the cop was fussy because I went 50 yards down the road and pulled into a hotel parking lot.
 
When I get pulled over...
I turn up my radio.
Crack my window.
When I am told to turn off the radio I turn it down.
When I am asked for my stuff I dig through my glove box for about 5 minutes.
When the cop walks to his car I turn up my radio.
When I am told to drop my keys out of my window I throw my keys out of my window.
When I am told to get out of my car I pretend that my seatbelt is jammed for a couple of minutes. After that I pretend that my car door lock is jammed for a couple more minutes.
When I am told to put my hands on my car I say, "There is nothing in the trunk."
When the cop opens the trunk I say, "I said there was nothing in the trunk."
Then I play dead and sing.
:D
 
Although new to TFL... it seems there are many that do not understand what LEO's do for a living. Might I suggest that anyone that "has a beef" with LEO's simply do a ride along on a Friday or Saturday night. It will most likely be an EYE-OPENING experience. Remember, Law Enforcement does not pay well, and these people put their lives on the line every single day for strangers. Are there bad apples..of course. Such is life.
 
...the local PDs may not have the dashcams, and often park well behind the person they pull over so it wouldn't pick up sound.
That's a common misconception Butch. I know that sometimes officers from very small depts. will buy their own camcorders to dash mount, but the commercial systems use a wireless mike, that, depending on conditions, works well up to several hundred feet. We're in the process of switching over to a new digital system that uses cell phone technology for the audio and eliminates distance from the car as a problem almost altogether. It's funny; when we first installed VICS (Video Incident Capture Systems) in all of our marked cars roughly ten years ago, all of the patrolmen hated them and were absolutely paranoid that we would be putting them under a microscope every minute. Today, there's not a patrolman on the dept. that would sign out a car without one. Prior to VICS, all sorts of allegations were made against our officers and lawsuits were common. Without evidence and the city's trend to settle out of court (much cheaper, even if the officer was innocent :mad: ), they made our dept. look VERY bad. Today, the VICS tapes are reviewed by Internal Affairs when a complaint is filed, and roughly only one in twenty allegations are found to be sustained, and of those sustained, a large percentage are rudeness complaints. In the last five years, there has not been one sustained complaint of serious misconduct or racial bias, and the lawsuits filed against us have dropped to virtually zero. (Actually, several have been filed, but all were dropped when the plaintiff's atty. viewed the VICS tapes.) Now the argument may present itself that the officer's behavior changes knowing that he's under surveillance, but I say again that not one officer would willingly sign out a car without a VICS. That says something in itself.

DocFox

You bring up a great point on ride-alongs. We have a ride-along program in place, and it has done tons towards better community relations. We also encourage spouses to ride along, and it has also helped with our officers' family lives. I strongly encourage all of you to check and see if your local dept. has such a program, and do a few ride alongs. It will definitely be an eye-opener.
 
My podunk department of 10 has a dashcam in every car, and I cannot see functioning without one. If you do stuff right, then they are your best friend.
 
jammer six said:
obeying the law, all the laws, and looking and acting the part of a law abiding citizen goes a long, long ways towards eliminating the hassles of traffic stops.


Okay, so you go on and drive 55 mph down I-95 through Palm Beach County, Florida. :rolleyes:


You won't get pulled over for speeding. Instead, you'll just get slammed from behind and probably killed.


Great trade-off. :rolleyes:


I suppose it's not worth trying to convince you that your view on this is utterly too simplistic.


-blackmind
 
DocFox said:
Remember, Law Enforcement does not pay well...



Forgive me, Doc, but maybe you haven't heard of Suffolk County, NY.


Spend about 5-8 years on the force there, and you're quite close to making SIX FIGURES.

And Suffolk County ain't exactly Compton...


-blackmind
 
So...... there's one place here/there that makes good money. Look at them all top to bottom and get an average......... and you're back at: "Remember, Law Enforcement does not pay well...
'
 
So...... there's one place here/there that makes good money. Look at them all top to bottom and get an average......... and you're back at: "Remember, Law Enforcement does not pay well...
Ain't it the truth, TBO. I'm a captain and watch commander, have almost 24 years on the job, get an educational bonus and longevity, and with overtime and holidays, gross right about $55,000. a year. (can be confirmed on Lexis-Nexis :mad: )
 
Anyone when the who why? ;)

Hey, I did my worthwhile contribution back on the first page, which we know is the only one that ever really stays on topic.


-blackmind
 
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