Embarrassing day at the range

"I'm going down to Florida later this week for a meeting/interview for a gunsmithing position after school and I'm bringing the rifle to show."

Really??????
 
Really??????
Click to expand...

Yes, hence the reason shooting it was so distressing to me. I've arranged to bring the rifle down this week since September and they have seen it in pictures and are waiting to see it/examine it in person as part of my meeting with the company. Building the gun for the school is touted as a 'resume' piece by the school, and now the fact that we don't mount optics on them or test the accuracy at school as part of the 'resume' rifle seems like a rather large oversight to me.
 
The bore sight tools are a complete waste of time and money. I start at 50 yards and can be zeroed at 100 yards in 3 shots without one.

A lead sled CAN be a useful tool for load development where you are shooting a lot of rounds and want to eliminate all human error to determine exactly which load is more accurate. But I'd never use one to shoot groups. Since there is no "give" when firing a rifle in one they are known to break stocks when used, especially in heavier recoiling rifles.

Parallax is one of those issues that people worry about too much. If you are a bench rest shooter and a 500 yard group that is .1" larger may mean the difference in 1st place and 2nd place then it is something to be concerned about. On a hunting rifle, at 100 yards, the biggest error you'll see is less than the diameter of a bullet hole in the target. Less than 1/2" at 500 yards. As long as you are looking through the center of the scope it is not an issue at all.
 
Reading through, without any technical advice to give... but this:
No matter what technical difficulties you had, sounds like frustration got you in the end.
 
Rick, I'd venture to say you are right. I'm a pretty cool and level headed person, not given to anger or anything like that. But stubbornness and pride to keep trying something long after I should have stopped - well, sometimes that can be me. Luckily the only downside here was wasting some ammo and time at a fruitless exercise.

Dale, thanks very much. I have greatly enjoyed the open and welcoming community since I became a member here. Internet gun boards get a bad rap, but if you take the time to filter out extraneous information, there are a lot of great and dedicated members with good information
 
I know this is a few days old but I use a tiedown ratchet strap when I can with my leadsled instead of weights if I take it with or else I use my Caldwell BR Compatition front rest with a bag in back.
 
Well, I don't have any record breaking groups to share, but I do have some positive results. I took the rifle to visit with my family and Florida and shot at a range there which had a 25 yard target. I was a significant amount off. At 25 yards, I was about 8 inches low and right. Considering the rifle adjusts in 1/4 MOA, this translated to somewhere in the neighborhood of 80 clicks to get on target. Once on paper, it held a good group. Rested off of bags, I was getting a little over 2" regularly at 100 yards. A large amount of the "group" opening seems to be barrel heating, as the barrel heats up quickly. I would usually get one shot an inch or so outside point of aim, followed by three shots that were very close to each other, and another flyer in the 5th shot. My dad shot my rifle and had the same situation, a flyer on the first and 5th round with the middle three shots all edge to edge falling within the 1" box on the target. This was all done with Winchester Power Points and Federal blue box (Game Shok?)

I will get some better ammo and next time bring a timer to the range, leaving a couple minutes between shots to see if not allowing the barrel to heat will help. I also want to test the free float next time it is on the bags (Caldwell Dead Shot bags I was given for an early Christmas present) and make sure that the barrel channel is still floating when I rest the rifle on the forend of the stock.
 
Sounds like you need another gun. Yours to shoot and another to shoot while it's cooling.

But it sounds like things are coming together.
 
I cannot think of a time I have a great range session with a brand new or new to me rifle. Pistols sure but not rifles. I feel like part of the " break in" period is the shooter getting to know and working the kinks out of the rig. Good luck and have fun, it seems like you are on the right path.
 
To eliminate parallax induced sighting errors when sighting-in, try cutting a disk that fits inside the front sunshade of your scope. Make a round hole in the center that's about 1/3 the diameter of the objective lens. Tape the disk in, so it doesn't fly off with recoil. By using the center part of the lens, there is less light-bending and parallax is greatly diminished.

The image will be somewhat darker, but that shouldn't bother when shooting during brighter daylight conditions. (Remove the disk for hunting.)
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I boresight rifles to get close by picking an object like a window at 100 yards or so, while the rifle is clamped in a Sight-Align rifle vise sitting on the kitchen table. That usually puts me on paper at 100 yards.

We have benchrest front rests and rear bags and use a strap-on PAST recoil shield for sighting-in hunting rifles.

JP
 
Dakota, if that rifle is opening up or moving poi with heating you have an issue with the rifle.
Either:
1. Bedding
2. Not free floated
3. Barrel not properly stress relieved
4. Action threaded not true to center line
5. Barrel threads not cut perfectly square to center line
6. Chamber not cut perfectly on center axis

My guess is a slight combination of 4 and 5.

Despite all the wives tales, you can build a rifle with a pencil thin barrel that will not shift POI with heating or open groups up.
 
My thoughts are more along 1-4 than 5 or 6. I cut the tennon, threads and chamber myself and while I'm not a master machinist, the barrel was put through the headstock of a lathe with the muzzle end in a precision spider fixture and the breech end in a 4 jaw chuck, both ends indicated simultaneously with range rods to less than .0002" runout. All those operations should then be square and concentric to the bore line.

There is the possibility that the receiver threads are not cut to center line or that the action face is not bearing evenly due to not being squared. We did not true the face of the receiver, so I hope that that is not the major issue.

We also only did a minor free float (.010"). I think the bedding has been done evenly and properly, but what I haven't checked yet is whether the stock is capable of putting pressure on the barrel when rested on bags. If that is the case, I may need to go back and open the barrel channel more or adjust how I'm resting the rifle.

It could also be the idiot behind the trigger needing more trigger time. Wish I knew anybody local to me who was a stellar shooter I could put behind it and see how they shoot.
 
I start at 50 and a poster board with one "1 inch" spot in the middle. pull it in to center and then move to 100yrds with a normal sight in target. Usually 6 rounds or less.

As for the lead sled, I ratchet strap mine to the bench. Even with a couple of bags of lead shot a 30-06 will kick it right off the back of the bench if you don't support it well with your shoulder.
 
As you mentioned, the barrel channel may not have enough clearance. I like 1/16" as a minimum. Gunsmith review boards like to see about zero clearance, but that's not about accuracy, it's about judging bedding skill.

Did you put a couple of layers of masking tape on the muzzle side, bottom and sides of the recoil plate before applying the bedding compound? If not, the well needs to be relieved.

Did you relieve the action screws, so they don't touch anything except at the bottom plate and into the receiver? Also, did you make sure the bedding compound was removed from the screw holes in the receiver?

The fact that the front screw fell out on firing makes one suspect that the screw may not be long enough to engage the receiver adequately. It should take several turns before snugging up.

Hope everything went well at the college.

JP
 
Thanks JP. To address a couple of your questions:

The recoil lug (integral to the receiver) was buffered with 10mil pipe wrap tape on the muzzle end and sides, but not the bottom. Thinking about it more, the bedding may need to be addressed some. The stock was cut flush to the metal features in several places, but after finishing with a number of oil coats, the metal now sticks proud of the wood in these places. I was waiting to see if the swelling dissipates, but I may need to go back and scrape away some bedding in light areas to relieve this pressure so everything sits back where it was. This could be causing uneven pressure.

We made aluminum pillars on a lathe which were bored oversize for the action screws and used epoxy to secure these into place. We did have problems throughout the class (15 rifles with all screws from the supplier) with action screws being too short to engage. Mine engages but only gets maybe 4 or 5 turns before it is nice and snug. I believe it's due to this that I made a personal mistake and didn't tighten the screw completely prior to the first firing and it backed out, having only a thread or two of engagement.
 
dakota.potts

You definitely need to create clearance under the recoil plate. Just use a Moto Tool bit to get a few thousandths everywhere under the plate.

When you say that the metal sits high due to having several coats of finish, I hope there's no finish on the epoxy bedding. That would defeat the purpose of having the epoxy make a perfect fit for the receiver.
 
Dakota,

I'm with you, having had my share of issues with my daughters Weatherby Vangard. It would shoot first group of 3 inside of 1.5". Second group would be 3-4", third group 10-12"...

Sounds like a free floating job to me, for your particular rifle.

You did not say what action it was built on, at least on this thread. I know with my Savage's you can "tune" the action with the torque on the action screws.

Tighten rear to spec (I think on the Savage it's like 25 in lbs.). Front left at 5 in lb. Shoot 3. Tighten front screw by 5 in lb. Shoot 3, etc till you get to I think 30 in lb. Record where the tightest group was, loosen front screw, and re-torque to your tightest group.

You can watch the groups close, and open up, much like the seating depth of a bullet.

And Loctite is your friend!! lol

Best of luck.

Std7mag
 
I would just like to add that I find Loctite 290 to be a lifesaver for many applictions. It's a medium grade thread locker that is applied AFTER final assembly. Torque the clean threads to spec, and introduce a drop or two to the fastener. It will wick in and set up. I use it at home and at work. Great stuff, but it tastes terrible. :rolleyes:
 
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