Election Night: FOX News to CNN and Back Again

R

Rich Lucibella

Staff
It's 8:13 Eastern on Election Night. No one knows how this is gonna go; but I'm seeing a trend in the reporting:

"This is a referendum on the Iraq War".
"This is a rejection of the Culture of Corruption in Washington".
"This is a vote on George Bush's Foreign Policy"

Such statements grossly insult the American Voting Public; as though we're single issue apes, tripping to what Media claims are our issues. These commentaries fail to account for what Heartland Americans wish to protect most: As one example, how 'bout Our Personal Freedoms?

Provide us the following info, Brit & Wolf, Carl and Lou:
How many votes are the Third Party Candidates getting? Seriously. Are they up from 2% to 5%? 3% to 7%?

If so, perhaps this is a Democratic victory by Proxy, Ross Perot style. Perhaps, just maybe, Americans are voting on other issues that you don't even believe we take into account. Things like-
- PATRIOT
- PATRIOT II
- FISA TAPS
- SCOTUS Appointees
- TSA
- The Failure to Protect Our Borders

Perhaps Americans are voting against the growing culture of, "Please, Sir, May I...." before going into (or driving to) their place of work; maybe we're sick and tired of being presumed "guilty of something" while we can't even stem the hemorrhage of potential terrorists across our own borders. If that hypothesis is correct, it would certainly explain a leftward shift of ALL voting groups; from Repub to Third Party; from Independent to Democrat.

So, when the dust settles, I'm gonna be REAL interested in what the third party tallies are.
Rich
 
Substitute "This will be..." for "This is..." and that's what has been said for weeks now.
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I'd do that, Tripp, except the words "This will be" do not appear in my post.

By the way, as opposed to much of the personal venting I see on this Forum of late, mine was not posted as a rant, but as an issue to discuss and examine. If we move that to something other than what it is, I'll happily withdraw from the discussion; just after I close it.

Tensions are high today. Let's all prove our mettle by keeping it in check.
Rich
 
The comments you're hearing tonight, have been made for the past few weeks - difference being the comments were made in the tone of anticipation, rather than a declaration regarding an occurring event.

Pointing that out rubbed you the wrong way? I thought it added to your point. Shame on me.

Don't worry I'm outta here.
 
I hope you are right Rich. Unfortunately, I am a little more cynical about the American voting public. The major media has steered this election from the beginning, and the public seem to be marching in lock-step.
 
I am a little more cynical about the American voting public
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Greg-
You hit the nub of the question, Spot On. When we each lose faith in the ability of American voters (except "me", of course) to make good decisions, we grant that Constitutional Republics cannot work; that Benign Despotism is the highest form of government.

I'm just not that jaded. The Conservatives were wrong when they claimed after a hair thin victory, "I've gained capital; now I'm gonna spend it." Actually they were granted a loan of faith and they squandered it. They didn't do everything wrong; but they goat screwed enough to move conservative Independents off their ticket.

In fairness, they had it all: The House, The Senate, The Presidency and the SCOTUS. What did they do with it? Not much. America is responding, including their own swing-voter base. It's not the end of the world, though. 2 or 6 years of GridLock would be, for me, a welcome break from the current knee jerk, "Of course, we just need to limit a few more freedoms". You see the glass as half empty (people are voting based on the media); I see it as half full (people are voting on basis of the fact they they simply feel a bit uneasy about their relationship to .Gov).
Rich
 
Rich, as sick as it sounds... I think that a vote to a third party is a vote thrown away.

Unless of course we have someone that can sway the American people in such a way that we vote not based on red or blue but on truth....but then again what color would the truth party be?

Voting for the lesser evil is the reality we live with today...to die from heart attack or cancer... la stessa cosa
 
Rich,

Nobody would be happier than me if people were seriously moving towards Libertarian positions (since it looks like the Green party has dissolved back into a well-deserved obscurity). I just feel that America is structurally a two-party system, and Libertarian energy would be better spent on influencing the major parties. OTOH, these parties are damn hard to influence unless you have big bucks and big votes, which independents, so far, don't have.
 
Rich,

I couldn't agree with you more. There is so much wrong with this govt that i cannot begin to start expressing it. The media would like to paint it as the public being against the war and the war alone. That way it sweeps the other mistakes under the rug and allows these morons to continue their lives as career politicians.

At least some real news is making it into the media now that CNN is doing stories like "Broken Government".
 
Rich, as sick as it sounds... I think that a vote to a third party is a vote thrown away.
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Ummm, this was not a Third Party Campaign Statement. It was a simple observation to attempt to explain what is happening and about to happen. Voters are disgusted with the way things are going in this nation; the REAL question is "Why?". I submit that it's not because of the War in Iraq; Many Voters recognize that the Dems have no plan there. It's certainly not about the Economy; let's face it, it's roaring. So what's it really about? I submit Freedom.

"A third party is a vote thrown away" is as much sloganism as "Stay the Course". Each voter in this nation owns their vote. Nowhere is it written that they must vote for the "winning" party; if such were so, we'd be telling Conservatives in Connecticut to simply vote Democrat; after all, a Republican vote is futile.

Rich
 
We need statesmen instead of politicians more than ever in this country.

I hope that Kinky Friedman wins the Texas Governor race, his outlook is refreshing and he about as far from being a politico as one could be.

Common sense, middle of the road values, guardian of our Constitution rights, all seem to be lacking from the current crop of so called peoples choices.

The blood and sacrifices of the many men & women who have given everything so that we enjoy our "freedom" must never be squandered or cheapened.

12-34hom.
 
Crud

Perry took Texas. Here come tolls and the Trans Texas corridor. I really wanted Grandma to win, she would of shut it down. Here come those trucks without brakes so they roll faster. Your coins and jobs please.:(
 
I was hoping Texas would stop the highway but I guess it didn't happen. Maybe the rest of the country will wake up when they see what's happening to your state. My condolences.

badbob
 
So, when the dust settles, I'm gonna be REAL interested in what the third party tallies are.
Rich
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It will be interesting Rich. Although I do not think it will matter much at all. There, IMO, will never be a strong, organized 3rd party to vote for. If we know that the Democrats and Republicans will come together and hold hands singing while voting themselves a pay raise, then you can pretty much bet they will (and have) come together to prevent the formation of any 3rd party to oppose them.
 
It was a simple observation to attempt to explain what is happening and about to happen. Voters are disgusted with the way things are going in this nation; the REAL question is "Why?".
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Why: Because our elected representatives betrayed their own ideology and principles in favor of messages that sell. Because they put their own interests ahead of ours. Because they refused to acknowledge that *we* are in charge of *them*.

This is just a repeat of what happened to the Dems back in '94. It will happen to them again someday once they lose touch with why the American people put them there.

More on this in a couple days once everybody has had a chance to digest this new reality.
 
I too believe that the Republicans lost some of the Independents and moderate voters in this election. I also believe that a lot of the Democrats who were elected to the House are centrists. So there may be some balance in the house against the Democratic leadership getting too wild on some issues.

I believe that the perceived mismanagement of the Iraqi war by Bush cost the GOP some votes. Also the Bush administration's decision making process was a my way or the highway type of process. The scandals in the GOP Congress wasn't a knockout punch but it hurt them. Also I believe that the folks want a Congress that isn't a rubber stamp for Bush and want more oversight over the actions of the White House.

I was shocked by the loss of Chaffee's seat in the Senate. He voted against the war in Iraq. However. he had the big R next to his name. So maybe the main issue wasn't the Iraq war but simply folks felt the Bush administration had a swelled head and needed to be balanced out. That they want Congress to watch out for Joe Citizen and his rights and not be a rubber stamp for the Bush Administration.

No vote is wasted. Maybe where that independent vote is the losing margin for a Democrat and Republican they might have to start taking a look at what those voters want. The independent candidates on the Texas Governors race chalked up around 29% of the vote. which meant that around 60% of the vote was against Perry if you include the Democratic candidate's vote total. Perry won with 40% of the vote. There might be a message in that for Mr. Perry.
 
:(

Sad night...

... all the leftists won last night...even Daniel Ortega won... a complete leftist liberal coup... a bad night for America...

The only good thing in yesterday's results that I can see is that hopefully, by letting the leftist liberals win now, America will see their true colors by the 2008 election to return to normalcy then...

...hunker down and prepare for bad weather ahead....

:(
 
It's not the end of the world, though. 2 or 6 years of GridLock would be, for me, a welcome break from the current knee jerk, "Of course, we just need to limit a few more freedoms".
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I am afraid, very afraid of the risks to our freedoms. If the dems pick up the senate, there is not much in the way of gridlock; Bush has never pretended to be a president that veto's bills, especially if he spends the last two years in office trying to "detoxify" Washington, which I've heard a few spokesmen say he is planning to do. The senate is liberal enough as it is, add in an almost even party split, a democrat controlled house, Bush's attitude towards passing bills that come across his desk, and this is a recipe for massive encroachment on our liberties.

The democrat's don't want to protect our freedoms, all they opposed was Bush. Look at the wiretap/echelon stink they made. That program was going on under Clinton, did they care? No. They only cared because it was Bush.
 
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