Do you really need more than 5?

Posted by Nanuk: It should be a well prepared risk assessment where you analyze all of the available data. This will allow you to see trends and patterns and to make an intelligent choice based on fact vs emotion.
Yes, and that's not easy, and it's only step one. Step two is to accept the results.

My first concealed carry firearm was a five shot J-frame. What could be wrong with that choice?

Later, it became intuitively obvious that "in a pinch," something with a little more capacity would be desirable.

But I considered that "pinch" to be unlikely, and I continued to carry the J-frame much of the time.

Then it started to dawn on me. I had already concluded that if a violent criminal attack were to occur, facing more than one attacker was likely, and that it would not be prudent to hope that only one would have to be dealt with with force. I already realized that such an event would unfold quickly, with fast moving targets. And I already knew that it would most probably take more than one shot, and perhaps several, to stop an attacker.

But I hadn't really thought it through. John did the math, and it took a lot of work. One can criticize the analysis, but one can choose the assumptions. The results are eye-opening.

The last thing that occurred to me was that carrying the J-frame where I had little reason to expect trouble was really not logical. If trouble were to occur, the situation would differ not at all from that which would have unfolded in a more "dangerous" place.

I changed from carrying a five shot firearm to carrying one with ten. Is that the most intelligent choice based on facts? Maybe not. I sill had not really done what Glenn E. Meyer suggested:

One can look at the types of incidents and decide a risk cutoff.

He opined,

I think that for most situations, one reload of a standard semi will probably be a good cut off point.

I'm still thinking.
 
You shouldn't be carrying a handgun if you expect trouble, anyway. That's what rifles and shotguns are for. I firmly believe that if all that was available were full-sized service handguns, fewer people would carry. Being proficient with that handgun is more important than how many rounds it holds. I like to shoot revolvers, so they're what I have with me. I used to own autos as well, but no longer do. I had to pick a single caliber so I could save money, so .38 it is with some .357s thrown in there now and again for the Blackhawk.

Risk assessment is another thing, though, and if I moved back to the city, I'd probably switch back to a Glock rather than my little 637.
 
Yes, and that's not easy, and it's only step one. Step two is to accept the results.

Absolutely.

You shouldn't be carrying a handgun if you expect trouble, anyway. That's what rifles and shotguns are for.

Very true!

I posted my EDC already, and that is what I am comfortable with living in a low threat environment.
 
One Other Aspect

Posted by chewie146: You shouldn't be carrying a handgun if you expect trouble, anyway. That's what rifles and shotguns are for.
That is very true, and it would be quite meaningful advice for law enforcement or for someone looking for the animal that has been leaving big tracks around the yard, but most private citizens should not be out and about when expecting trouble. I am not permitted to carry a rifle or shotgun in town.

I firmly believe that if all that was available were full-sized service handguns, fewer people would carry.
That's pretty clear, I think.

Being proficient with that handgun is more important than how many rounds it holds.
Yes, but what is necessary may not always be sufficient.

I like to shoot revolvers, so they're what I have with me.
So do I, but I have made some changes.

Risk assessment is another thing, though, and if I moved back to the city, I'd probably switch back to a Glock rather than my little 637.
That leads into another aspect of the discussion.

Anyone as old as I has probably spent at least some time looking at pictures in old Gun Digest and Shooters' Bible annuals from the day when there were very few semi-autos except some fine rimfires like my old Woodsman Match Target, and when Smith and Wesson and Colt revolvers ruled the day. What we now call the J-frame just has to be good. Right?

Now we know more. One of our members here (Head Hunter) is highly regarded in the training field. He recently opined on another board that statements to to the effect that Airweight snub revolvers are a good choice for inexperienced shooters are ill advised. Here's the link.

Now, I am not suggesting that anyone here is inexperienced, and I know that this a little off the original topic, but (1) many others have encountered some of the same issues with Airweight DA snubs, and (2) the OP was clearly referring to them.

I can shoot a compact (not subcompact) semi auto a lot better than my 642. I personally don't see the need for a service-sized handgun with 17+1 capacity (though I could be naive), but there is a middle ground.
 
I think revolvers are evolving alot, its just not in the same direction as a semiautomatic. Semiautomitics are evolving to higher capacities and more "tactical".

revolvers are evolving in the direction they excels at. They are getting to be more and more powerful and better hunting tools. In the good old days the 357 magnum was the big boy for revolvers, then came the famous 44 magnum touted by dirty harry are the most powerful hand gun. After that came the 454 casull and more recently the 460 and the 500 magnum.

any one that says that revolvers are not evolving and/or going extinct are only fooling them selves. They are just evolving differently than autos.

wow I never thought of it like that. I agree revolvers are evolving.
 
The shoot-ability of the new little revolvers is what impresses me. Like the BG38 and the Ruger polymer revolver actually work like snubs are supposed to, and let you roll off DA hits with +P easier than a Cobra does with Nyclads.
 
That's a good point, actually. With improving triggers and larger, more powerful calibers, revolvers are diverging at each end of the spectrum more than autos probably are. Autos seem to have a better continuum but a lower high end. I have only shot the Ruger poly LCR. They're definitely interesting.

By the way, when I said you should be carrying a rifle or shotgun if you expect trouble was partially tongue in cheek. There are some extremely limited circumstances where I'd go somewhere where I'd be expecting trouble. But, if I had to, I'd definitely go with something more than a J-frame.
 
While capacity is certainly an attribute that should be carefully considered, it is not necessarily the most important attribute when selecting a defensive handgun. For example, my own circumstances dictate that I'm much more likely to be facing one or two very large individuals at very close range than I am a smaller group of average sized individuals at a more extended range. Because of this, the handgun that best fits my needs is one that can fire a powerful cartridge, be very reliable at short distances (including contact distance), be difficult to take away from me should I wind up grappling for the gun, and offer a size-efficient package. The handgun that best accomplishes all of these goals is a revolver chambered for a cartridge no smaller than .357 Magnum with a barrel no more than 4".

Now, I realize that a high-capacity semi-automatic would better prepare me for a situation in which I was faced with 3 or more individuals, but it would, in my mind, be the inferior choice for 1-2 very large individuals because it does not meet the above-mentioned goals as well as a revolver does. While a larger group of assailants is always a possibility, I find it more prudent to be optimally prepared for one or two very large individuals as that is the far more likely scenario for me to find myself in. That being said, when circumstances change such as when I have to travel to a sketchy part of a large city, I often carry a high-capacity semi-auto either as a replacement for or in addition to a revolver.

While it's not optimum, I do not feel that I'm completely unprepared for a multiple-attacker situation if armed only with a revolver. As I mentioned in a previous post, I always carry at least one reload regardless of the type of gun or capacity. Even if I should find myself in the "worst case" multiple-attacker situation in which I'm faced with multiple people who are armed and willing to brave gunfire in order to achive their goal, I'm certainly not going to stand still blazing away like Wild Bill in the streets of Deadwood or some other such nonsense. At first opportunity, I will seek cover and/or retreat thus giving me more time to reload and/or seek a better weapon if necessary. Likewise, even if faced with a determined adversary, it is an extremely rare person who will not at least duck or seek cover when someone starts shooting at him, particularly if gunfire is an unexpected reaction. Such a reaction will serve to increase the time and distance that I have to take the necessary action.

As to revolvers "evolving," they certainly are evolving into bigger and more powerful guns geared towards hunting, but they're also evolving into small and easily carried guns aimed at concealed carry as well. Some of the most popular revolvers on the market right now are small light, and eaisly carried such as the S&W 642, S&W BG38, and Ruger LCR. While many first-time gun buyers tend to gravitate towards the high-capacity "tactical" semi-auto, many of them soon learn that a dozen or more rounds is heavy and that the gun required to hold them is fairly large. Once that realization is made, smaller more easily carried guns including snub revolvers become very appealing very quickly.

In the arena of a pocket gun, I've found no type that works better than a small revolver. In order to get a semi-auto as small or smaller and as easily or more easily carried as a J-Frame or similarly sized revolver, you have to go one of two routes. The first route is the more tradtional approach of selecting a semi-auto in a small caliber such as .25 Auto, .32 Auto, or .380 Auto. While a good quality gun of this type can certainly work fine, the cartridge leaves something to be desired when compared to those avialable in a small revolver such as .38 Special or .357 Magnum.

The other (and increasing popular) option is with a "subcompact" 9mm or .40 S&W like the Ruger LC9, Walther PPS, or Glock 26. While these guns certainly fire a more potent cartridge, they also have smaller and lighter slides and grips which makes them more prone to malfunction than their full-sized counterparts. Now, I'm aware that many people own and carry subcompacts that have been very reliable, and that's great, but my own experience with subcompact semi's has not been nearly so glowing. It has been my experience that subcompact semi's are much more finicky about things like grip and ammunition. Revolvers, on the other hand, seem to be much more tolerant of miniaturization. The only reliability issue I'm aware of that is endemic to small revolvers and not large ones is bullets jumping crimp in extremely lightweight guns chambered for very powerful cartridges (exotic metal guns chambered for magnum cartridges seem to be the worst offenders).

Now, all of this being said, a tiny handgun is almost never the best choice for a novice and revolvers are no exception to this. Small handguns are inherently more difficult to shoot well because they have shorter sight radii, more pronounced recoil, and often heavier triggers. While a medium or large frame handgun is usually the best choice for a new shooter, I do think that a small revolver is a better choice for a novice than a subcompact semi-auto due to reliability and simplicity of use.
 
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"Overall, I'm disappointed that revolvers don't seem to be evolving as much. Then again, the design has been around so long it may be tough to do more than incremental improvements, and we are seeing polymer designs so maybe progress does march on. "

How about the Chiappa Rhino? That is some definite evolution!!

Joe
 
My titanium and alloy S&W snubbie holds 8 rounds of 357

SW627Pref.jpg
 
When I carry my Smith 637, I take a full speed strip (6 or 7 rds) and carry it in my weakside pocket ... I don't ever anticipate using my gun, let alone needing a reload, but I always follow the golden rule -- hope for the best, plan for the worst ...
 
I use a MTM ammo walet that I used many years ago for handgun hunting back in the late 1970 's . I wonder if the still make them ?
 
When I owned a J-frame (I actually owned six at one time) I carried a speedloader or a Speed Strip.

These days I don't own a J-frame, but may again at some point.

When I carry one of my six-round S&Ws, I carry a speedloader or a Speed Strip.

When I carry an autoloader (always a single-stack) I carry one extra mag.
 
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