DisAPPOINTED! Charge-Master hesitation.

Normal volumetric powder measure and a scale to check is all you need.
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I've made the following point before but I'll say it again.

With VihtaVuori powder (extruded stick) the volumetric measures like the PPM get you most of the way, but cannot be trusted to just load straight into the case, at least not the way I like to load.

I used to get huge variations in the auto-disk, and the PPM will still throw under my chosen weight regularly, requiring the trickler to be on hand.

So while, yes, I have managed to load with just a scale and dipper on occasion and now with the PPM too, it takes me a very, very long time to reload. I mean hours for a single OCW test string of .308 etc.

This means that so far, I have just abandoned any idea of reloading .223. I would revisit that idea once I have a thrower.

This isn't about what is possible, but what is convenient and makes reloading something I can one evening instead of pencilling a whole afternoon a fortnight before hand.
 
I like my a Hornady. It looks cheap, but throws accurate charges every time.

I think you should buy the hornady and forget it.
 
I do not allow this stuff to drive me to the curb. I have dippers from the eighteen hundreds, I have adjustable dippers from the same period. I have dial-O-matic, cam-o-matics and Herters, Redding, and almost all things RCBS like Uniflow and Little Dandy. And tricklers, I have tricklers and all things Lee in black, red and yellow.

I have the non-docking, docking RCBS combo. If it does not run fast enough it can be 'speeded' up, it can be sent to PACT FOR A FEE to be speeded up, so it can run faster. I also have the VISUAL by B&M.

Just an opinion:), I believe the trickle-r is the equalizer. remember, I do not get into mortal combat with reloading.

F. Guffey

Jim243, I did not notice the dust.
 
Personally.... I'm a Harrells fan < :D goad, goad :D >

My ChargeMaster1500 lays largely unused over the past
3-4 years except to occasionally do a checkweight on a
thrown charge from either the Schutzen or the Culver . ;)
 
Well, my question about the merits of the pictured RCBS, the Hornady and the Lyman seems to have fallen by the side as the great Powder Master vs Charge Master debate rages on....

Those who warned me against the older RCBS, thanks for the heads up.
It matches my reading elsewhere on the net. The Powder Master may be perfectly adequate but would have been a hugely over-priced purchase.


...so I took a leap of faith and ordered the Lyman Gen 6 and some .223 bullets.

We'll just have to wait and see...
 
Late to the party

I apologize for coming so late to the discussion. My information is too late to do you much good UNLESS you find your purchase unsatisfactory.

I have a friend with a Chargemaster (I am not sure how old it is). He likes his much better than throwing from a measure and weighing. I often help him load (I fill cases with the meted powder while he handles the metalworking.) However, I am not tempted one bit to get any brand of electronic powder measure of my own. I can drop a dipper of powder into my beam scale and trickle up to weight just as quickly as the Chargemaster, and for a lot less money.

However, I do freely admit the Chargemaster is a lot more convenient. It stops by itself and never (or rarely) overshoots.

I would have suggested you evaluate this motorized 2-speed (rotating tube) trickler which can be made at home:

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl...FVbadBNLHogSQhoH4AQ&tbm=isch&ved=0CCEQMygAMAA

or this commercial (vibratory tube) product

http://www.accurateshooter.com/gear-reviews/dual-speed-omega-powder-trickler/

both of which I found by doing a web search on the phrase, "Homemade automatic powder trickler" and poking around the sites it revealed.

Good luck.

Lost Sheep

p.s. I found a two-speed completely home-made unit a few years ago and was hoping to find it again. It would feed powder quickly until the powder scale beam just began to move (and broke a light beam), then switched to slow speed trickling until the scale's beam broke a second light beam and stopped. I have not found that home-built device yet, but this one, commercially built in the United Kingdom comes close

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2GTwj_2qu_s


This video is quite revealing and is less than two minutes in length, with no advertisements
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dujvwUtmrFA&feature=player_detailpage


At 2 minutes 10 seconds into this video, the video shows variable speed on the trickler (as opposed to 2-speed)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=QtLUyDU9HEY#t=126
 
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Obsession with charge weight

The IMR stick powders like 4895 do not meter well, but, that does NOT matter, as small differences do not have a material effect on accuracy. Sticks within 2% are just as consistent as ball powders within 0.2%
I see two logical options:
1. Stop worrying about small differences that do not matter to competive shooters and ammunition makers. You could even use a dipper and trickle for same speed. Save $500.
2. Switch to either a ball powder or a finer/smaller grain extruded like H322 or A2015 or H-Benchmark.
 
I can drop a dipper of powder into my beam scale and trickle up to weight just as quickly as the Chargemaster, and for a lot less money.
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The difference is that I am not that fast at measuring out a charge, and also that while the thrower is doing its thing, I can be doing other bits of reloading prep.

Ultimately we'll see how it works, but I think I've made the right choice for me.

The links are interesting, but yes, a little late to the game as I ordered about 8 hours ago!!

In truth, I probably would never have got around to building my own.

The auto trickler you linked looks good, but would mean buying a new beams scale too as the Lee is not compatible. So between the beam and the trickler it is about the same as the Lyman I've just ordered.

Just to put things in perspective, though. For the price of the out-dated Powder Master I almost bought, I've ordered the Gen 6, 500 bullets, Lee dies, shell-holders and case trimmer kit for .223 Remington.

I'd never have bought the last 4 if I hadn't bought the first one!!

I see two logical options:
1. Stop worrying about small differences that do not matter to competive shooters and ammunition makers. You could even use a dipper and trickle for same speed. Save $500.
2. Switch to either a ball powder or a finer/smaller grain extruded like H322 or A2015 or H-Benchmark.
Click to expand...

For option 1, see my remark above: it is not the same speed for me. It takes me ages. For option 2: I may try H322 and Benchmark in the future (they are two Hodgdson powders sold here, although only one shop stocks them), but as I will have the Gen 6 by then, it won't be for metering qualities.
 
Sorry to mention that Jim. Warm water on a rag will fix that. I use air purifiers with a carbon pre-filter to combat dust.
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Actually that is one months dust on the machine, I live with a very dusty air-conditioning/ heating system. The discoloring on the powder tube is from extensive use. It is primarily used for rifle loads and is perfect in giving just the right amount of powder, it will show if some powder has stuck together and brought the charge even .10 of a grain over and then that drop is dumped back into the powder reserve to be re-use. This will happen occasionally depending on the humidity at the time of re-loading. (keep your powder dry, lol)

Pond, you made the right choice. It sounds like a great deal with all the additional stuff you were able to get. PAC, Lyman and RCBS are all good machines and will give you years of use. As to 223 re-loading, after I have weighed and confirmed the charge, I use my Auto Disk system on my Lee Classic Turret press along with a Powder Check die instead of weighting each charge on the ChargeMaster. Since each case will get extensive prep time it is just faster for me to do so.

Station one is the Universal Rifle powder through die and Auto Disk, station two is the powder check die, Station three is the bullet seating die and station four is the FCD. All case prep is done on a RCBS Rock Chucker prior to the reloading secession.



Have fun, stay safe and enjoy your new toy.
Jim
 
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I use my Auto Disk system on my Lee Classic Turret press along with a Powder Check die instead of weighting each charge on the ChargeMaster.
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The Auto-disk... I have a love/hate relationship with that measure. It was my first but we never reached an agreement. Extruded stick and that measure don't play well. The PPM does better, but not well enough that I trust it entirely. Hence the Gen 6.

I don't know what a pwoder check die is. Sounds interesting. Can you tell me more?

Although I have a Lee turret in the garage, I tend to use the hand press more because I can do all my reloading at home, rather than in that dark garage.

I will eventually move the turret to the summer cottage and use it for zen reloading with added birdsong and buzzing insects!! :D

Anyway, that means that I tend to batch load and in that respect, the Gen 6 will work nicely for me (I hope).

It was a lot of money, but I agree that I have just acquired a lot of essential stuff for less than the cost of a single, albeit more refined, RCBS thrower.
 
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Again, my apologies. Too late to do you any good for your current quest. But maybe your next one.
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Not at all.

I firmly believe that I could sell the Gen 6 on for only a small loss if it turns out to be an expensive lesson.

If that happens I could well see myself turning to the Target Master trickler you linked to, with a spruced up beam scale like the RBCS. Let's see how things pan out.
 
Can you tell me more?
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The powder check die is the black die in the photo with the white tip on it. It has a piston that goes up and down when inserted into the case with powder to show the level of powder, it is referenced against the black rod that has a white o'ring on it to show the amount of powder that should be in the case.

It works best on rifle loads than on small pistol loads, but can be used for either. This allows me to KNOW that a proper drop of powder has been placed in the case and not double charged or no powder at all. If a check shows me something other than the proper level of powder that drop goes back into the powder measure and a new drop of powder is made.

Hope that helps.
Jim

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/234716/rcbs-powder-checker-die?cm_vc=ProductFinding
 
Sounds like a nice accessory to have on a turret rig. Once I settle down again and go back to the turret, I may well look at getting one. Until then though it is easier to check each case visually when batch loading.
 
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