My one crunchenticker is a P226 so of the choices polled, I would likely opt for one of the SIGs depending on personal fit and deals. That said, were I to stray from the 1911 faith, I would not go farther than the ParaOrdinance LDA. I have only dry fired one in a store, but that action is scarcely to be believed.
DA/SA 45's
- Thread starter 11mm
- Start date
There Is a lot of love for the P220 that seems to come from peoples experience with them. Is there any reason that the P227 wouldn't have the same quality reliability and accuracy as the 220? I ask because even though the 220 is running away in the poll, I find myself gravitating toward the 227.
Grip circumference changes the entire feel of the pistol. I tired to like the P227 but it just felt off. They have a decent reliability record and accuracy should be on par with the P220.
Lots of traditional Sig guns just don't like it but it is more about their time on the P220 vs issues with the P227. IMHO
Hammerhead
New member
Shouldn't be, but one of the big draws to the P220 is the great ergonomics. The only other .45 pistols that are in the same class IMO are the 1911 and the HK45.
Double stack .45s just aren't going to fit your hand the same and may not perform as well because of it.
Hammerhead
New member
No need to shout Nathan c, we can hear you just fine.
I'll toss in another all metal hi-cap .45, the Sarsilmaz K2-45. CZ based with 14+1 capacity and feels like a much smaller, albeit, heavier gun.
I've owned a USP 40, and although not same caliber, the USP wasn't a better a gun, save weight. Carried both on duty, traded the USP for an M&P (and some swag), haven't looked back.
The Sar's trigger is better then the USP's, actually holds one more round of .45 vs the USP 40, and is eons more ergonomic. I found the grip on the USP to be a tad short for my glove size large hands, but the Sar fit my hand like a glove.
Just something to stir the pot, as IMHO, the Sar, is every bit as good as H&K, and had it been lighter, would still be in my duty rig.
I've owned a USP 40, and although not same caliber, the USP wasn't a better a gun, save weight. Carried both on duty, traded the USP for an M&P (and some swag), haven't looked back.
The Sar's trigger is better then the USP's, actually holds one more round of .45 vs the USP 40, and is eons more ergonomic. I found the grip on the USP to be a tad short for my glove size large hands, but the Sar fit my hand like a glove.
Just something to stir the pot, as IMHO, the Sar, is every bit as good as H&K, and had it been lighter, would still be in my duty rig.
I'd go with the P220 off of your list, but I think a clean, lightly used S&W 4506 or 4566 is a better gun in the DA/SA .45 category. All stainless as opposed to aluminum/stainless or aluminum and bent sheet metal, and a better trigger, and better recoil control. Have variants of both, and the Sig doesn't live up to its hype, while the smith exceeds its reputation.
The 227 hasn't proven itself yet IMO. I've seen problems with mags, and it's grip. The CZ-97 is a huge brick, needs trigger work, and is near impossible to find. If it doesn't have the glossy blue finish, you are stuck wih cheap oven paint finish.
I'm having a hard time seeing folks recommend unproven Turkish guns. Interesting guns, but not something to depend on for carry IMO, especially if for uniformed duty. Stick wih a company with a proven commitment to the local market, and a gun with a viable Ecosystem of parts and accessories.
The 227 hasn't proven itself yet IMO. I've seen problems with mags, and it's grip. The CZ-97 is a huge brick, needs trigger work, and is near impossible to find. If it doesn't have the glossy blue finish, you are stuck wih cheap oven paint finish.
I'm having a hard time seeing folks recommend unproven Turkish guns. Interesting guns, but not something to depend on for carry IMO, especially if for uniformed duty. Stick wih a company with a proven commitment to the local market, and a gun with a viable Ecosystem of parts and accessories.
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DanTSX..the Sar has a very good track record, even if it isn't in the good ole' US of A. I ran it with everything from basic 185s to hot as heck 230s, not so much as a hiccup. I would, and have, trust(ed) my life with it.
Funny you talk about parts, but recommend a discontinued 3rd gen Smith. Excellent firearms in their own right, but what kind of parts supply are we looking at there? At least the Sar is current, and currently, in production, and when I discovered a cracked grip panel, a couple of emails later I had several sets of grips with new screws and various other swag. Not trying to hate, but rather, educate.
Funny you talk about parts, but recommend a discontinued 3rd gen Smith. Excellent firearms in their own right, but what kind of parts supply are we looking at there? At least the Sar is current, and currently, in production, and when I discovered a cracked grip panel, a couple of emails later I had several sets of grips with new screws and various other swag. Not trying to hate, but rather, educate.
Mrray. I'm with you. I'm here to learn, and share what I can share. What I can share is that S&W has not abandoned the third gen despite persistent Internet rumors that they have. Repairs for the more common models like the 4506, 4566 etc, Will be supported by the factory for quite some time. Call them and see for yourself. This all started because of a game of telephone and a bunch of folks went straight for the hyperbole instead of confirming facts. I have no affiliation with S&W, but I did my fact checking myself.
I wish you continued luck with the SAR. If they are successful enough to develop an armorer program here for LE depts, I think they could be a viable alternative for duty as well. I think the Turks make decent guns. They often fit together with fit and finish that western arms often lack, but I have reservations about over their small parts and using the proper hardening
I wish you continued luck with the SAR. If they are successful enough to develop an armorer program here for LE depts, I think they could be a viable alternative for duty as well. I think the Turks make decent guns. They often fit together with fit and finish that western arms often lack, but I have reservations about over their small parts and using the proper hardening
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They are about the same size of a P220. The receiver is stainless steel, and not aluminum, so they are heavier. There are aluminum receiver versions of the smith as well. Model 4513, 4553, and 457 I think.
Everyone has their trigger preference, but I like the smith trigger better. It's like comparing the trigger pull on a Colt revolver to a smith revolver. I find that the smith is more consistent through the pull, where the sig stacks. The reset is also shorter and more forceful, which is better for rapid fire IMO.
Everyone has their trigger preference, but I like the smith trigger better. It's like comparing the trigger pull on a Colt revolver to a smith revolver. I find that the smith is more consistent through the pull, where the sig stacks. The reset is also shorter and more forceful, which is better for rapid fire IMO.