compressing H110, spicy 357 mag, safe?

Okay, except that's not true. There are many powders for handgun rounds that are compressed and are superb powders for that cartridge.
I think what he's getting at is that if you have to stuff so much into the case that it gets compressed, you should probably go with a faster powder, which I can see some merit to. That being said, compressed h110 loads are my favorite, and I prefer loads at least near compressed loading densities. Hard to double charge when you can barley fit one.

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I think what he's getting at is that if you have to stuff so much into the case that it gets compressed, you should probably go with a faster powder,

Again, not true. Whether a powder is compressed or not often is a function of its density characteristic, regardless of its speed fast, medium or slow. The fear of a compressed powder is unwarranted, with some exceptions, i.e. Trail Boss;
https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=575811



Otherwise, Hodgdon says there are advantages to compressed loads;

https://www.hodgdonreloading.com/compressed-loads

"Hodgdon notes in its reloading data if the subject charge is a compressed load. A full case, or lightly compressed charge is an ideal condition for creating loads with the most uniform velocities and pressures, and oftentimes, producing top accuracy."
 
About fifteen years ago, when Ken Green was still SAAMI's Technical Director, I called him to ask about the history of SAAMI load pressures in the 357 Magnum. He said they have never changed as far as SAAMI is concerned because the same reference loads were used to calibrate different pressure equipment or as test protocols were modified. So all pressure numerical magnitude changes are equipment artifacts rather than actual pressure changes. The current standards are 45,000 CUP and 35,000 psi, but those numbers come from firing the same reference loads in the copper crusher and the conformal piezo transducer, respectively.

As usual, the CIP's numbers are still different. Their old copper crusher standard had the pressure as 3200 bar (46,400 psi) which is perhaps where the 46,000 psi number came from). Their current transducer limit is 3000 bar (43,511 psi). So their different instruments agree better than ours, but not perfectly, either.

Hodgdon currently lists 125-grain JHP loads (Hornady XTPs) as 21-22 grains of 296/H110. Speer number 8 has 18-20 grains as the range. The old (2004) Winchester single-load, one-and-done charge weight is 18.5 grains. Hodgdon uses Winchester brass but does not indicate the load is compressed. That may not mean much. Before Hodgdon acquired the Western Powder lines and change the website, they listed powder bulk density and VMD lot tolerances, some of which were as high as ±5.6%. So it is perfectly possible for one lot not to be compressed while another is at the same charge weight.

Yes, the 10" barrel used by Hodgdon is an unvented test barrel whose length is measured from the breech face, like a pistol barrel. Their vented (to mimic the barrel/cylinder gap in a revolver) test barrel length is 4", as measured from the front edge of the vent. The 10" barrel is to mimic single-shot handguns.
 
CAUTION: The following post (or a page linked to) includes or discusses loading data not covered by currently published sources of tested data for this cartridge (QuickLOAD or Gordon's Reloading Tool data is not professionally tested). USE AT YOUR OWN RISK. Neither the writer, The Firing Line, nor the staff of TFL assumes any liability for any damage or injury resulting from the use of this information.

I’ve gone to 22.3 with the 125 xtp. I don’t like to run it in handguns but I have on occasion. But mostly I run it through a 20 inch Rossi 92. I have the same gun also chambered in 454 Casull, so it can handle the pressure no problem. It makes 2460 fps from a 20 inch barrel with no pressure signs.
Out of a revolver it is a waste of powder. Lots of blast and fire, clean extraction in some guns, sticky extraction in others. Not fun to shoot from a handgun.

None of the preceding is load advice. Always do your own load workups, using reliable load data and common sense.

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So you're just spreading the rumor without actual knowledge. Okay. That's all we need to know.
Rest assured that as long as Beefalo Bore continues to slap a “+P” on products that do not have a standardized +P, it would be spreading an ABSOLUTELY TRUE rumor to say that Beefalo Bore isn’t producing ammo to a SAAMI standard.
 
Garret Cartridges is another one. They also load a number of big-bore cartridges above the SAAMI MAP as "+P", and each load description has a "more info" button you can push to see the pressure in CUP, and it mentions specific guns the load is safe in. Their 45-70 +P loads, for example, go to 35,000 CUP (SAMI MAP is 28,000 CUP) and their 45 Colt +P is at 21,000 CUP (SAAMI MAP is 14,000 CUP).

SAAMI has no +P standard for either 45-70 or 45 Colt, so I'd rather see them designated +P+, as that is the whatever-the-maker-wants designation for cartridges that have a SAAMI +P standard (SAAMI has no +P+ (sometimes "Plus P+")standard). For example, Federal used to make a 185-grain "Plus P+" Hydra-Shok law enforcement round for 45 Auto, but as no such SAAMI standard exists, they could load that round to any pressure they thought safe in guns intended to use it.
 
I always compress,W296/H110 loads (as well as loads of the holy black). For real fun, try finding a consensus about loads for the .50BMG. There's no SAAMI standard for that beast, but you can still have fun with one as long as you're careful.
 
Rest assured that as long as Beefalo Bore continues to slap a “+P” on products that do not have a standardized +P, it would be spreading an ABSOLUTELY TRUE rumor to say that Beefalo Bore isn’t producing ammo to a SAAMI standard.
Some +p designations are saami designated (9mm, 38 special, 38 super auto, 45 ACP ECT) those do have saami standards.

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Shadow9mm,

Did you notice more consistency in SD and ES with these loads were they more accurate?. In my Smith and Weason 586 it likes 20 grains of H110. I was also thinking of a compressed load as well. If i recall I tried 21 grains but I dumped them out because the cases looked almost full , I chickened out.
 
I note QuickLOAD and GRT both show the recommended 125-grain XTP charges from Hodgdon being compressed and producing excessive pressure, even though Hodgdon does not show either being compressed. Personally, I would use something like the old Winchester 18.5 grain load for a 125, before carefully working up near Hodgdon's numbers. Both programs produced higher velocities with a 10" barrel than Hodgdon reports. But when working with straight wall cases, they can get off a bit. If I raised case capacity to about 28-29 grains I could get velocities to match.


Bbqncigars,

No SAAMI standard, but there is a CIP standard for it. You have to translate some millimeters to inches (dividing by 25.4 is an exact conversion), and their peak pressure limit is 3700 bars (53,664 psi) by Kistler channel transducer. The military tech manuals use 53,000, 54,000, and 55,000 psi, but this will have been measured by copper crushers (so they are actually units SAAMI calls CUP). I don't know if the CIP number is based on copying the military crusher numbers with the transducer or if this is just one of those cartridges for which crusher and transducer numbers happen to match well. You may be able to find some military procurement specs for the cartridges that give both numbers.
 
This reads like a thread Elmer Keith (bless his soul) would love.

" But can your load hit an out house at 800 yards???"

Personally if I want a velocity over about 1100 fps, I get a rifle. Only been doing this for 60 years, so I am probably too old a fossil to understand why we want to blow up our revolvers.
 
I’d suggest that you are far too set in your ways to un-learn what you think you know over the decades if you truly believe that using a slow burning optimal magnum powder is going to “blow up our revolvers.”

For that you can use Bullseye, AA#2, Ramshot Zip or the best possible choice, Titegroup.

I’ve only been doing this for half the time you’ve been doing it… 10,000-20,000 rounds annually, but I figured that out quite some time ago.
 
I’d suggest that you are far too set in your ways to un-learn what you think you know over the decades if you truly believe that using a slow burning optimal magnum powder is going to “blow up our revolvers.”

For that you can use Bullseye, AA#2, Ramshot Zip or the best possible choice, Titegroup.

I’ve only been doing this for half the time you’ve been doing it… 10,000-20,000 rounds annually, but I figured that out quite some time ago.
Yeah, I can vouch for Titegroup’s ability to kill a revolver. I sure miss my 627 and if another would ever show up around here I’d scarf it up.
 
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